Cafe Diem

[dagordon]

I thought I'd concluded my survey of Philly's Pho offerings. I ended up right back where I started -- Pho Ha on 6th and Washington. The soup is consistently good there, although lately the filth factor is verging on unbearable there.

Well, Cafe Diem, 1031 S 8th St, right above Washington, has, hands-down, IMO, the best Pho in the city, and some of the best I've ever had. The broth was not nearly as dark as Pho Ha's, but it was incredibly flavorful. The best Pho that I've had has an odd combination of intensity of flavor and lightness, and this had it. Maybe the lightness is that the broth isn't very fatty? I don't know. In any case, it was awesome. It was standard steak and maybe some brisket -- I don't know what else is available.

Also -- not really Pho at all -- Bun Bo Hue, spicy beef noddle soup. The noddles were round and reminded me of Dan Dan noodles. The broth tastes like the Pho broth, only intensely spicy. I mean SPICY. This is about as spicy as I can tolerate. Maybe others will find it pretty manageable, but I had a couple of coughing fits. Last time we were there, my girlfirend ate some too quickly and claimed that it bore a whole through her ear.

It's a pretty small place, but very clean, and the staff is friendly.

[dagordon]

I'm a bit worried that this message might get lost in the flurry of replies to my initial post, but: this place is really outstanding. And it has A/C, so it's COOL inside on days like today, making slurping pho perfectly comfortable even in hot weather.

I don't think I've ever seen another non-Asian in the place (except for my g/f). This is a good sign.

Can't eat pho anywhere else in Philly now. At some point I'll have to try the other non-soup dishes, but only a very small portion of the menu has English translations, and I can't imagine not having pho.

[KatieLoeb]

This is the little place on the east side of the street between Pif and Washington Ave., yes? I've always wondered what it was like inside. I presumed it was just a coffee shop! I'll definitely have to go check it out on your recommendation.

I got violently ill from a dinner at Pho Ha awhile back and the place is so filthy I can't even go past it without wretching just a little. :shudder:

[dagordon]

This is the little place on the east side of the street between Pif and Washington Ave., yes?  I've always wondered what it was like inside.  I presumed it was just a coffee shop!  I'll definitely have to go check it out on your recommendation.

I got violently ill from a dinner at Pho Ha awhile back and the place is so filthy I can't even go past it without wretching just a little. :shudder:

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Yup, you have the location right. Just be careful, I think there are a number of small Vietnamese restaurants surrounding Cafe Diem...

Here are some pictures of the Vietnamese-only side of the menu -- apologies for the picture quality (camera phone way up close)

The pho I've had is the Pho Tai.

Also, Katie, you'll be happy to know that not only is Cafe Diem clean, as I've said, but, unlike Pho Ha, it got the all clear from the (correct) Philly inspection report.

[Diann]

I'm really looking forward to trying this place, dagordon. Thanks for the heads-up!

After a bit of googling I think I have some translations of things I like:

- Tendon = Gan

- Bible tripe = Sach

- Nam = Flank

And Tai is eye round ("regular" pho).

Anyways, is any English spoken at Cafe Diem? I just want to be able to ask them if I can get tendon and flank in my pho. Or should I attempt the Vietnamese?

[dagordon]

I'm really looking forward to trying this place, dagordon. Thanks for the heads-up!

After a bit of googling I think I have some translations of things I like:

- Tendon = Gan

- Bible tripe = Sach

- Nam = Flank

And Tai is eye round ("regular" pho).

Anyways, is any English spoken at Cafe Diem? I just want to be able to ask them if I can get tendon and flank in my pho. Or should I attempt the Vietnamese?

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The middle-age woman who always serves us speaks *minimal* English; it might be better to attempt the Vietnamese. If you do figure out how to get tendon and flank, though, please let us know!

[dagordon]

Had one of the best bowls of soup I've ever had this afternoon. Bun Bo Hue Dac Biet. As far as can tell, any soup "Dac Biet" is a "special" version of that soup, which includes whatever interesting meat they have available that day. (My standard pho order there is now "Pho Dac Biet".) Today there were generous amounts of tendon, brisket, and unidentifiable fatty pieces as well, as well as a largely bony thing whose purpose, as far as I could tell, was not to be eaten but to continue to provide flavor to the soup (I have no idea what it was). The broth today was particularly incendiary.

Every time I've ordered the Bun Bo Hue Dac Biet, the waitress has said to me with a concerned expression, "You know that contains" followed by something I can't make out. I nod my head and indicate that of course I know that. You know that whatever follows an exchange like this is going to be pretty damn good...

I wish that I could communicate to them how amazing I think their soups are, but I don't think my past attempts have been successful. Anyone know how to say "This is one of the best things I have ever eaten" in Vietnamese??

[mrbigjas]

dagordon, your implied fears in the first or second post in this thread were well founded--it did indeed get lost in the shuffle, and for some reason i still haven't been there. i think i'll remedy that this weekend. thanks for the reminder.

Edited December 5, 2006 by mrbigjas (log)

[shelly59]

I am not from Philly, a little help with the location? Please? Exit from I95 coming from Wilmington, etc. Much thanks

[dagordon]

I am not from Philly, a little help with the location?  Please? Exit from I95 coming from Wilmington, etc. Much thanks

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From 95, Take the COLUMBUS BLVD exit- EXIT 20- toward WASHINGTON AVE. 0.2 miles

Take the ramp toward WASHINGTON AVE / PENNS LANDING. <0.1 miles

Turn LEFT onto S COLUMBUS BLVD. 0.1 miles

Turn LEFT onto WASHINGTON AVE. 0.7 miles

Turn RIGHT onto 7th St

Make your first LEFT onto Carpenter St

Make your first LEFT onto S 8th St

Parking lot on your left; Cafe Diem is on the next block down on 8th St.

They're closed on Wed; also I'm not sure how late they stay open. You can try calling them at 215-923-8347.

[shelly59]

Many thanks

[philadining]

I was intrigued by dagordon's posts, and a bowl of noodle soup sounded like a pretty good dinner to me...

Bun Bo Hue Dac Biet

This is a huge bowl of soup, with a nicely spicy broth, spaghetti-ish noodles and loads of meat, some of it pretty weird! The broth was very tasty, and there was lots of thin-sliced flank, along with chunkier stewed beef, tripe, some stuff I couldn't quite identify, might have been tendon, and a gigantic bone.

As it should the soup came with a plate of herbs, mostly basil, but a little mint too, limes, hot peppers, and hidden beneath the green a heap of very fresh, crisp bean sprouts.

I really liked it a lot, and it was so big that I couldn't quite get to the bottom of it. $7. As reported earlier, there's limited English spoken here, but enough to get by...

I'd like to try their Pho, from this experience, and dagordon's comments, I'm sure it's good. That said, I still prefer the Bun Bo Hue out at Little Saigon in Upper Darby. The broth is a bit deeper-flavored, and I like the flatter rice noodles they use better. I have no idea if one is more authentic than the other, they're both quite tasty.

Edited December 10, 2006 by philadining (log)

[mrbigjas]

i like it when places include herbs other than just the usual thai basil on the soup plate, like the hot mint you have over there on your plate, phil. i don't know what's traditional with which soup, but i dig that stuff. rau ram it's called in vietnamese i think.

the only one i don't like--and i keep eating it in hopes that i will one of these days, but it hasn't happened yet--is fish mint (diep ca). nam phuong always includes that in the herb plate that you get with their grilled beef in grape leaves, and i always eat some of it, and it's ... ugh.

[dagordon]

I'm a big fan of the ngo gai -- culantro, saw-tooth herb, etc... I've only seen it a couple of times at Cafe Diem. Apparently grows more slowly than other herbs so is more expsneive, which might explain this. Though it always seems to be on Pho Ha's herb plate.

philadining, thanks for post! I will have to try Little Saigon's bun bo hue asap.

oh, and were you asked a question when you ordered the bun bo hue dac biet regarding whether you eat something or other? i'm fairly certain now that the question is "do you eat pork". Last time I was there the exchange after the question went on a bit longer than usual and for the first time my bun bo hue included what looked like slices of pork roll.

[philadining]

There was a funny exchange when I ordered the Bun Bo Hue: the waitress asked if I wanted regular or the special. I had been thinking of just getting the regular version to serve as a baseline, but when she offered the special, I figured, what the heck... she said a few things I couldn't understand, but then I heard "dac biet" and I nodded and said "dac biet" back to her, which I would not have known without this topic! But then she said a few more things that I couldn't understand at all, but that sounded like questions, so I just said "yes, anything" assuming she was asking if it was OK that there was ingredient X in there.

I don't think I saw anything that looked like pork roll, or anything especially porky, but I suspect the ingredients might change from day to day.

And as for Little Saigon, it really might just be a personal taste thing, but I do prefer the broth and noodles. But their version isn't quite as loaded down with stuff, maybe because it's not "dac biet"! And as was noted in the Upper Darby thread , they don't routinely serve it with the herbs and sprouts. Apparently they found that most people weren't using them, so they stopped serving that plate of accompaniments. But they have all that stuff, they serve it with their Pho, so just ask, I'm sure they'd provide it.

But that's not to say the version at Cafe Diem wasn't really delicious, it's just a very small personal preference, and it could be partly that Little Saigon's Bun Bo Hue was the first I'd ever had.

We really are lucky to have some pretty excellent choices for Vietnamese food here in Philly.

Edited December 10, 2006 by philadining (log)

[dagordon]

Has anyone tried the pho here? It's I think $6 for the pho dac biet. I challenge anyone to produce a higher QPR food item in this entire city.

philadining tried the bun bo hue, but not the pho...

I don't understand why this place isn't packed all day, and isn't expanding and opening little Cafe Diems all over the city. It's really shocking how much better this is than any other pho in the city.

[mrbigjas]

ok i hate to be this guy but can i drag the boy there, or is there no room?

[mattohara]

i don't know how i missed this thread. i've been going to Huong Lan. Diem always seems to be closed when i stop by. must always be on wednesdays.

i'll be there tomorrow for dinner around 7:30 if anyone's in the area.

[dagordon]

ok i hate to be this guy but can i drag the boy there, or is there no room?

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There should definitely be room... There have always been at least a couple of open tables when we've been there.

matt -- when you say you'll be there tomorrow for dinner, do you mean Huong Lan or Diem? I think Diem's open for dinner only one night per week, and I think it's Friday, but I'm not at all sure...

[mrbigjas]

\

There should definitely be room... There have always been at least a couple of open tables when we've been there.

excellent. it seems so small from the outside.

I think Diem's open for dinner only one night per week, and I think it's Friday, but I'm not at all sure...

damn this job of mine! i wonder if i can get down there for lunch.

[mattohara]

damn! i meant Diem. where should i go for a good pho in this dreary weather?

[mrbigjas]

i have always and still do like the pho at xe lua, 9th & race. but if you wanna stay down in your hood, i've liked what i had at viet huong on 11th street. i like their banh mi too. pho 75 is fine as well.

but what i think you should do is go to the place on 11th where porky & porkie was, and tell us how it is.

[mattohara]

ok, i'll do that. where is it?

[KatieLoeb]

i have always and still do like the pho at xe lua, 9th & race.  but if you wanna stay down in your hood, i've liked what i had at viet huong on 11th street.  i like their banh mi too.  pho 75 is fine as well.

but what i think you should do is go to the place on 11th where porky & porkie was, and tell us how it is.

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Just had some Pho-to-go earlier this week from Pho Hoa, on 11th just below Washington. It's next door to the 7-11 where Porky and Porkies used to be. Address is easy to remember - 1111 South 11th Street. It was very good! Broth was strong and well flavored and there was a boatload of meat and noodles on the side. Packed separately so the meat wouldn't cook and noodles wouldn't get soggy. Niiiice. I got the #15 which was the "beef with the works" pho -Noodle soup with steak, flank, tendon, tripe, and fatty flank. This was comparable to Pho Xe Lua which is also my usual go to. Place was very clean and professionally run. Managers were clearly career management types. There were non pho items on the menu as well and everything was reasonably priced. Cheap for the quality in fact. Menus were available in several languages and had photos of all the dishes on them. There's even a kid's meal! This is a chain, but in a good way. I was quite impressed and will undoubtedly go back.

[dagordon]

We tried Pho Hoa recently, it was pretty good. Xe Lua is pretty good too.

But they're no Cafe Diem.

I'm sorry to have to do this, but Katie and mrbigjas, you are both on probation until you try Cafe Diem. (I'm not sure exactly what this entails, but I'll think about it.) Anyone else who mentions another pho place in this thread before trying Cafe Diem will face a similar fate.