Le Bernardin

[rockefeller666]

Well, I finished dining at Le Bernardin tonight. We had the $79 prix fixe menu. We had a nice white burgundy to drink, which was very good. The amuse bouche (sp?) consisted of a sauteed shrimp in this wonderful asian sauce. Absolutely terrific. No question.

I started with a progressive tastings of fluke. They were raw pieces of fluke, arranged in marinades consisting of lemony-type stuff to an asian spiced full bodied dressing. It was wonderful. Absolutely wonderful.

I then had the halibut with an asparagus puree, covered in a black truffle/lentil sauce. It was great. Really good food. No question, the quality was outstanding. For dessert, I had the pinapple surrounding a pana cotta mount, topped with a crisp shell, some raspberry sorbet and a raspberry sauce. It too was excellent. We finished with some petit fours (sp?), which were quite good.

Overall, the quality of the food is outstanding. I will say, it's 11:37pm, I just finished inner around 10:40pm, and I'm hungry. I really am hungry. Not just un-stuffed, but I'm actually hungry. If you threw a slice in front of me now, I'd wolf it down. The quantity of food was just so small. I was reading NYCitysearch, and there was this guy who said he bought pizza after a meal there. I thought he was just one bitter dude. But he's right. He's 100% right. I'm really hungry. To drop $150/person for dinner and be hungry is just morally egregious. I could have eaten at Curry in a Hurry for $8 and be more full with a delicious meal.

I will say that the quality of stuff at Le Bernardin was quite high. But I personally think Daniel is better. I also left Daniel stuffed beyond belief. There was so much food, I could barely walk afterwards. And the food was so good, that I wanted to keep eating it. Le Bernardin, a NYTimes 4-star restaurant, is simply not worth the money. It is the proverbial french place which overcharges for very little food. The food was very good--not as good as Daniel--but just totally not enough. Daniel is only $6 more, so if you're going to drop that kind of money, go to Daniel.

I remember eating at a Michelin 3-star restaurant in France (3 stars is the highest michelin rating), and I dropped $120/person with wine. I was so stuffed that I had to run the next day and barely eat anything just to burn off the calories. Daniel is similar. Le Bernardin is simply not worth the money. $8 for curry in a hurry or $80 for Le Bernardin; the choice is clear, curry in a hurry is almost as tasty, more filling, and better value.

[macrosan]

Hey Rocky, thanks for the excellent review. I've had Le Bernardin on my "must go" list for a while, and you've confirmed that I absolutely must go.

If there's one thing I hate it's that "stuffed" feeling at the end of a meal. As a Brit who has spent a lot of time in the USA, I still get embarrassed by the sheer size of portions in America. I do hate to leave good food, because I dislike waste and I think it's like an insult to the chef. So when I get presented with these portions suitable for a 350lb footballer, I find that my enjoyment level instantly drops. It's just too daunting.

So I'm thrilled to hear that there is a restaurant that serves superb quality food in portion sizes to match my appetite.

[mogsob]

It's not only brits who hate the stuffed feeling.  In fact, I think the proverbial french restaurant exists solely to fatten you up like Hansel for the oven.

Having been to Le Bernardin many times, I can say that I have never left hungry.  Never, not once.  That said, I can rarely finish three courses at any restaurant, so I applaud smaller portions.

Macrosan, do go to Le Bernardin -- it is among NY's best, if not the best.

[rockefeller666]

Thanks for your replies.  They add good perspective on the Le Bernardin experience.  

While I don't dispute the quality of food at all--Le Bernardin truly is an outstanding restaurant--I wish they gave more.  I too don't like to eat until I'm stuffed; it usually happens because the food is so good, I can't help myself.  But at the same time, I don't like to walk away from a table hungry, especially after dropping $150.  It's just not right.  And if you read the reviews on NYCitysearch, I'm not the only person who left the restaurant hungry.  I avoided eating much bread, since I was anticipating better dishes.  I am a man, not huge (170lbs), but I eat a lot for my weight.  So while I'm not a sumo wrestler, I'm an average sized man who left this restaurant hungry.  

I will say that quantity aside, Daniel has the edge in quality.  The halibut I had was basically a truffle/butter-based sauce with asparagus puree which was very flavorful, but not particularly interesting.  At Daniel, I had some fish with truffles that just blew me away.  The desserts at Le Bernardin was quite tasty, high quality without a doubt.  But the desserts at Daniel were amazing.  So all in all, I would say just spend the money at Daniel.

[=Mark]

I've always been amused by the philosophy of cooking at Le Bernardin.  As I recall it was something to the effect that they believe in letting the delicate flavor of fresh seafood come through without overpowering the dish with overly assertive sauces spices or preparation.  Well fine, you serve me a simple seafood dish without a lot of distracting sauces or seasoning, then charge me $40 for the plate?

Sorry, but when I am dropping $150 on a meal I expect you guys to be back in that kitchen breaking a sweat and rattling those pots and pans.

Also I found the austere, cavernous cafeteria-esque dining room to be a put-off too.

[mamster]

It's not only brits who hate the stuffed feeling.  In fact, I think the proverbial french restaurant exists solely to fatten you up like Hansel for the oven.

The Franco-American restaurant, maybe.  The few meals I've eaten in France were remarkable for their perfect portion size;  I felt comfortably full after every meal in Paris except the one that followed a cup of that godawful Angelina hot chocolate.

I've also found this true at La Côte Basque.  At most restaurants I routinely leave a third of the plate uneaten.  Obviously, one portion size does not fit all, and it doesn't seem fair for a restaurant to let you leave hungry.  Any clever solutions, folks?

[ajay]

Mamster,

I'm wondering if we were in the same France.  Even the ethnic restaurants where I had "menus," usually the cheapest way to go left me quite full.  DOn't get me wrong, I don't mind this feeling at all.  Moreover, I have a pretty large appetite for a small (5'10", 160lbs) guy, and yet, I couldn't finish all of the food offered as part of the "menu l'astrance" at the amazing L'Astrance Restaurant.

Markstevens,

I think you'll find that claims of minimalism at the level of Le Bernardin still force the kitchen to work quite hard and the pots and pans will be a baggin'.  I've only had one prixe fixe lunch there.  But, I can tell you the cooking was intricate, and the flavors complex.  Le Bernardin is not a place that simply steams the freshest fish; they work their food over, but their influence is subtle.

Since I hate food wastage, I wish there were a good solution to the portion problem: I funtion on the goldfish principle--as long as food is put before me, I continue to eat it. But, I see now that, it's not just women who prefer smaller portions.  I usually emphasize my hunger to the waitstaff, but I don't think this practice yields a different sized portion.  I've often been tempted to ask for seconds--they've bee offered and gratefully accepted at a few places, but usually abstain so as to not disrupt the pacing/tempo of the meal.  I often request extra petite fours and I eat a lot of bread if I feel the portions are small.  These are, I admit, imperfect solutions, but I'm not sure what else to do.

[mamster]

Well, I'm sure there are as many Frances as there are travelers.  We ate mostly in bistros and went unstuffed.

At La Régalade, I got seconds on soup.  There was also an apparently unlimited amount of pork terrine to be had.  I guess these things are in the "eat more bread" category.

[Wilfrid]

A dinner party last night at Le Bernardin composed of:

Yvonne and G. Johnson

Mr and Mrs Tommy

Myself and Beloved

As you can imagine, a quiet, solemn, even funereal atmosphere prevailed. In fact, I thought the staff did quite well with us considering they couldn't get a word in all night.

We took the $84 prix fixe which offered three courses and dessert or cheese. The first courses listed were generally light, cold fish dishes (several came with caviar and hefty supplements), and the following courses were progessively more substantial. Overall I thought all the dishes I tasted were good, with one or two being exceptional. It's a lovely room, lighter than I remembered it from several years ago (have they brightened the decor?), the seats were comfortable, and our party was the only source of noise annoyance.

Chilled geoduck - the first time I've had it, I think, and since it was served shredded, I would never have guessed it was anything but regular clam. Nothing wrong with it, but I didn't find it any more interesting than regular clam, which fortunately I like. Came with toast studded with seaweed.

Brandade, served just warm. I could have happily eaten a larger portion, and I would rather have had the toast with this dish. But it was excellent - still slightly chunky, with biteable pieces of cod, which is how I like it. I sampled the Beloved's seared tuna, which had a strikingly deep and full tuna flavor.

Next was hearty, well-flavored slices of monkfish served over a cabbage leaf stuffed with shredd oxtail, surrounded by finely pureed potatoes and an oxtail sauce. Good-looking dish, and I noticed several unrepentant carnivores in the party ordered it. Halfway through, the Beloved snatched it and gave me the rest of her sauteed shrimp. These looked much more like langoustines than shrimp, and were quite outstanding - hard to describe how perfectly cooked they were. I am forgetting what they were dressed with, but they came with a side of spicy, saffron rice.

A $15 supplement bought a surprisingly hearty helping from the cheese trolley. The selection was mainly French and solid rather than imaginative - not unlike the trolley at ADNY. I liked the ripe Montbriac. I got a taste of an excellent chevre from Mrs T.

While there are some astronomically priced bottles on the list, I was very surprised at how reasonable some of the prices were. We started with a N.V. Louis Roederer at $70 (surely less than a 100% mark up). We moved on to a decent Pouilly Fuisse (Les Poyeaux, I think, 1998). I was really pleased with the red, a light, cool Saumur Champigny for around $65. Good for red wine drinkers who are eating fish. Can't remember the year.

Port, of course. Of course.

Negative point: nasty little plastic menus with the days dishes secured by an elastic band. Like a hotel coffee shop. I was shocked. And I thought the menu used to be in French. Did we get a cheap tourist translation?

[tommy]

i think the amuse was one of the most fascinating shrimp dishes i've ever had. it was one shrimp, served with a bit of what i assume was a reduction of balsamic vinegar. the texture of the shrimp was like nothing i've ever had. absolutely wonderful. i could have had 6 of them, and called it a day.

i was shocked at how early the place cleared out. we were the *only* people left in the place at 11.15 or whatever it was. the waitstaff no doubt sighed a collective groan of relief as the last one of us stumbled out of the revolving door.

the place was totally less stuffy than i had imagined. although, as wilfrid suggested, the waitstaff really didn't have the chance to give any attitude, as we were basically off and running from the second we got in...and we didn't shut up until after we left.

i wore a blind melon t-shirt, and wilfrid had a vintage sex pistols concert jersey. it was faded, and honestly, a bit embarrassing.

[yvonne johnson]

A stellar meal, I thought. And as tommy and Wilfrid say, the decoration, atmosphere and service much less stuffy (not too attentive. I think they scraped the table cloth only once with the razor clam shell-like instrument--about right, ) than they were a few years back. The waiters seemed to be smiling (then again that might have been a pained expression having to deal with us lot).

I agree the amuse--silky, sweet shrimp with ginger and soy butter--was fantastic. As were the sourdough rolls and butter.

The prix fixe menu is arranged in three sections and you choose one dish from each:

1. ALMOST RAW, 2. BARELY TOUCHED, and 3. LIGHTLY COOKED which doesn't make a lot of sense (bouillabaisse is barely touched?).

1. I went for the geoduck ("thinly sliced geoduck clam marinated with wasabi-lime dressing") which I'd never had before. Somewhat chewy and it had a lovely sea-side smell (in the best possible way).

2. Next I had a fantastic bouillabaisse ("aioli crabcake melting in a rich saffron lobster broth; poached shrimp and croutons"). What a lovely orange to red color

3. I also went for the surf and turf ("oven roasted monkfish loin on silky mashed potatoes and braised oxtail-stuffed cabbage in a rich red wine reduction""). The fish, which has a meaty texture in the first place, went terrifically well with the oxtail. Husband liked his Gamberoni shrimp ("broiled...flanmbeed in lemon Bacardi rum; basil, garlic and parsely") but found the accompanying "saffron basmati rice" too fishy. I thought it was wonderous, and I polished off the entire bowl, and maybe someone else's as well.

4. For once, I didn't feel like a cheese course and instead went for the cherries. Cherries that were deep red, lightly poached, I think, and very cherry tasting--what more can one ask for?

The menu covers as Wilfrid noted are a little disconcerting. I never went to Butlins holiday camp, but the pictures of the sea and sunsets brought to mind a cafeteria at a cheap resort. But that's the only negative thing I can come up with.

I hope g. will add his thoughts as his opinion is that Le B was better 10 years ago. Le Bernardin gets top marks from me which it did not before.

[Wilfrid]

"Gamberoni shrimp ("broiled...flanmbeed in lemon Bacardi rum; basil, garlic and parsely" - thanks for describing that correctly. It was quite wonderful. And you did indeed get into more than one bowl of rice.

I wonder if it made a nice change for the waiters to deal with a table of people having fun?

[g.johnson]

I hope g. will add his thoughts as his opinion is that Le B was better 10 years ago.

I thought Le B was better 10 years ago.

(It's the little things that make a marriage work.)

[Varmint]

C'mon, the 2 most important words for me in my marriage are "Yes, dear."

[tommy]

I sampled the Beloved's seared tuna, which had a strikingly deep and full tuna flavor.

i want to comment on this as well. it struck me as the deepest darkest tuna i'd ever "taken in". really interesting.

also interesting was the bread "service" for some of the dishes. toast points and peices of bread were presented on a small plate. no one knew whether they were to take one, take the dish, throw the dish, wipe their fingers on the bread. it was all quite bizarre.

[Fat Guy]

There was a renovation a year or so ago, to answer the question asked way back when.

Most of the work was done upstairs, but I recall reading that the dining room got a once-over as well:

http://www.le-bernardin.com/salons/index.html

I still think it's hotel-lobby impersonal and generic, though.

[tommy]

looking at the pics on the site fat guy just posted, my only question is: "was i there last night"?

[yvonne johnson]

I was thinking the same, tommy. Here's where we were http://www.le-bernardin.com/

[Bux]

Shaw's photograph appears to be one of the private rooms on another level, at least according to the test on that web page.

also interesting was the bread "service" for some of the dishes. toast points and peices of bread were presented on a small plate. no one knew whether they were to take one, take the dish, throw the dish, wipe their fingers on the bread. it was all quite bizarre.

Could you clarify? I'm assuming sevral of those options were not ones you thought were legitimate just from previous restaurant experience. Was it more than just wondering which breads were supposed to go with which dishes?

[tommy]

Could you clarify? I'm assuming sevral of those options were not ones you thought were legitimate just from previous restaurant experience. Was it more than just wondering which breads were supposed to go with which dishes?

i can't clarify more because it was confusing to begin with. the presentation of small pieces of bread proved to be baffling. that's what i took away from it. sorry i can't be more clear.

[Wilfrid]

Tommy's right. A waiter presented a small plate with teeny bits of bread on it from my right, and I automatically tried to take the plate from him. He meant me to take one of the little pieces of seaweed toast. It wasn't clear. They should have doled them out with tongs. And I don't know why I got toast to accompany geoduck, not brandade. Not a big deal, though.

[jaybee]

I am glad to read that your experiences were as good as the one we had a few months ago. leB deserves to be put back on the list of favored places, IMO.

[robert brown]

How crowded was the place? Were any tables turned? (Not on you, of course).

[Wilfrid]

I was sitting with my back to the room, which meant getting quite a sore neck while trying to peek at the other diners, some of whom were quite attractive. So I didn't follow what was going on in any detail. I didn't have the impression it was ever completely full.

[foodboy]

I've been to Le Bernardin once and had the dinner tasting menu (the more expensive one). It was an excellent meal, but there are two fish dishes I've had at Gramercy Tavern that are better than anything I had at Le Bernardin. I wonder what it would be like if Tom Colicchio opened a seafood restaurant.