yvonne johnson

lxt: Didn't I meet you the other day at USC, when you appeared to be quite sane? (Sorry, lapse in the non-use of the smilie, but unless your post is a spoof, I can't agree with your arguments). There is a saying : "Money for old rope". Let's take women's clothing (I could take an example from the art world, but let's keep things everyday)as it is generally sold in the USA. In comparison to men's clothing of similar price range, the clothes sold to women are of inferior quality. They do not last as long, stitching is poor etc. Yet, women's clothes tend to be more expensive than men's. This is an example of price being out of whack with quality. I just can't fathom the 'good quality=high price' argument. I'm not saying that in many cases it might be true. I'm saying that one cannot categorically say it is always true. An SUV can get me from to A to B, but the subway suits me fine quality-wise and it's cheaper.. Your last paragraph puzzles me. I can see that your argument may apply to the genuis. But what of training of the middle of the road person in the street?

HOLD ON A MINUTE. Steve P, you were shouting at me yesterday, and now it's my turn The above was your answer to Steve S's question, "Which is the better steak?" Given that strip steak is CHEAPER than filet mignon, all your arguments yesterday about the best being more expensive were wrong, contradictory, according to your own standards. Peachcreek: That sounded like a great place with some fine cooking.

Steve, you really take the biscuit in terms of dodging around. In the above you appear to be comparing steak and hamburger, and in your most recent post you do so again. In the past you have compared peasant dishes from Britain, say,with French sophisticated ones and claimed that the French ones are better. You have claimed that French cuisine is the most evolved comapred to other Western ones. You mix apples and oranges all of the time. Oh, but hang on, now I see, you decide on the classification system. If I discuss 2 fish, I'm not comparing like with like, but if you compare two very distinct dishes it's OK, because now they both fall under your grand category of "technique".

This is false. I'll add to Wilfrid's point below on the importance of distinguishing between cost and expert evaluation. Steve, You mention the sea: The commercial fishing expert will, as you say, determine the quality of the fish, but that does not always match what people will pay. It is simply wrong to say that, every time, the best sells for more money. I'll use catfish as an example. The expert has long known that this is a fish with a lot going for it. Until more recently, could it demand a decent price? No. Fishermen couldn't get over shoppers' willingness to pay more for a fish that was of the same or inferior quality relative to the catfish. An example of the public not paying for the quality that the expert saw all along. And bushey: I agree with you. In my opinion (if only Steve P. could preface most of what he writes, by saying the simple in my opinion many of these arguments wouldn't happen), the better burger is made with meat that has a fair amount of fat content.

And let's remember that, according to Plotnicki, port is a high class drink.

I think Steve is barking up the wrong tree with his argument on geography as he frames it, that is, people passing through. But, geography may help explain why French cuisine is so good. It's a country that has the Mediterranean climate in the south with all the things associated with it. Olives, etc. And in the north it has a temperate climate, hence the cheeses. It is this rich mix of climate that produces the wide array of foods, that when brought together, gives the chef such a broad canvas and such variety. Compared with Spain, Italy, Britain, Scandanavia, France has contrasting climatic zones that maybe cannot be compared.

Thanks for the link. An interesting topic, and it might warrant a thread of its own on General. I guess with the major studies that the NIH is conducting on alternative treatments, we may be able to find empirical evidence supporting some of the traditional methods. I wish your father all the best.

Nick, D'Artagnan, (800) 327-8246 carries Giannone chickens ($2.15 a pound approx), but they favored my buying them at my local store as they are not packed in cryovac(sp?), and shipping an individual chicken to my home would not be in as a controlled environment as shipping to a store, if that makes sense.

I'm wondering if others find the free-range Giannone chickens imported from Montreal to be spectacular. A NYTimes article a few years back cited the chef, David Cunningham as saying they were "the closest in flavor and juiciness to the famous poulet de Bresse of France". They are fed corn, soy and wheat and no antibiotics or growth hormones are given. Giannone Poultry chill their chickens with frigid air rather than water. This procedure lowers the chance of bacteria occuring and also prevents the watery feel that many other chickens have. Jefferson Mkt in NY carries them, and I think they can be ordered from D'Artagnan. We rarely buy any other kind.

Thanks Suvir for your detailed reponse. What an interesting history. I found a Saag Vali Khichri in Jaffrey, so I'll give that a go sometime. And when I'm on the verge of hysteria, I must remember to have some asafetida on hand. If you have a chance, can you say more about other resins/spices used in Inidan cooking that have medicinal qualities? I see that lime pickles (that have asafetida in them) are suggested for digestion.

Husband bought a little container of asafoetida the other week. Whenever he cathes a whiff of the stuff, he complains it is filling our cupboard with a smelly sock smell. (Mrs Balbir Singh says some varieties have a nauseous small.) I don't sense it this way. I don't mind the smell at all. Anyway, last night husband made some fried potatoes from Madur Jaffrey. They were quite good, I wasn't sure if I could detect the taste of the asafoetida, though. I was wondering how else it is used, Suvir? And what would you recommend?

What didn't you like about the fries?

I've not been to Virgils, and I'm not sure what kind of preparation they serve. But I think it's worth quoting Fat Bloke again: "In terms of the style of the ribs, Blue Smoke is making something completely different from what you'd get at Dallas BBQ or the typical Harlem soul food place where the ribs are not barbecued at all (if it says BBQ on the menu it's a figure of speech and not a reference to actual wood smoking); at that species of restaurant they are typically oven baked in a sweet sauce. Many people, when experiencing the less moist, minimal-sauce, wood-smoked barbecue styles find them dry and unappealing by comparison to the sweet, sticky, falling-off-the-bone baked ribs they're used to. However, I think if one takes the time to acquire the taste and look for depth of flavor as opposed to the one-dimensional fat-sugar punch of baked ribs, the payoff is great." As for me, I tend--at the moment, things may change--to prefer the wet ribs at The Hog Pit (New York) and Sticky Fingers (Charleston). Blue Smoke's ribs are completely different. Another observation that consort made was that the ribs at BS were neatly trimmed. Not much fat at all, so there wasn't that gelatinous texture to the ribs. So, I guess I'm saying you won't get the best barbecue in the city at BS if your preference is for wet ribs. But who knows, BS may be producing the best smoked ribs in the city.

jhlurie today made reference to this thread, and between reading it when new and now, I read Alan Davidson report that farmed salmon have been fed paprika to enhance their color.

We and two chums had dinner on Wednesday at Blue Smoke. Of all Danny Meyer restaurants I have tried, this is the best so far. I’m in a minority, I know, but USC, Tabla and GT do very little for me. Starters: Very substantial peppery pork sausage and the pickled onions & okra were nice accompaniments. Lots and lots of chicken wings with chipotle sauce that had real heat. I agree with Nick, the homemade, good, BBQ potato chips were served in enormous quantities in a large bucket. Also, we received sliced bread (from Amy’s bakery, I was told) and “bread and butter pickles”. Do you see a lot of food on the table yet? Main courses: 2 types--St Louis & Memphis--of pork spare ribs. As previous posters have mentioned, this is not wet, fall-off-the-bone meat, it is a little drier than that, but by no means un-moist. I also tried some delicious pulled pork. I agree with others, the coleslaw is not the best. It seemed a bit tired to me. Now mine, the brisket, which may have been the best thing we had. It was juicy, meaty, tender with a few caramelized onions accompanying the very good mashed potatoes. My dish was enough to feed a family of four. I ate two big slices of the brisket, gave away one slice and took enough home to feed two for lunch the following day. We also ordered a large (oh, my) order of fires. These were piping hot and were sprinkled with salt. Maybe not Les Halles quality, but nonetheless very able fries. We’re big eaters, but 80% of the fries we had to leave. Nearly forgot, we also ordered fried onion rings. Good selections of tap and bottled beers. At the end of this gluttony I contemplated the room in an effort to take my mind off the possibility that I was about to put out--I see people on eGullet mostly talk about about “taking in” meals---my dinner. Everything is massive here: huge pussy-willows in huge blue vases, and big windows looking out to garden scenes. Given its name, I imagined a dark, smokey place but it's quite bright. We ate early, but by 8 o'clock it got hugely noisy. Talk of a dessert I somehow tolerated, and to my relief no-one ordered anything more to eat. Service was very good in parts (welcoming without being gooey)and in other places, spotty (disorganized placement of food on table). I think some new staff were being trained. Will definitely go back. But next time, I’ll order a little less. Other reports by fellow eGulletarians http://forums.egullet.org/ibf/index.php?s=...ue%20smoke&st=0 Robert has interesting report on p. 2 http://forums.egullet.org/ibf/index.php?s=...3&hl=blue+smoke from CathyL

A few months back I walked past The French Culinary Institute on 462 Broadway, New York, NY 10013-2618 (888) FCI-CHEF, (212) 219-8890, and I was reminded of it when discussing wine courses today. Has anyone here eaten there? Can't say I've heard much about it, but I gather it has a restaurant open to the public.

Interesting the comments on lack of sauce. If Asimov got the place right, that would've been on days the meat wasn't dried out. His complaint was they smothered the meat in sauce when they needed to disguise the meat's being way over done. Oh, well, off I go.

Just out of interest--leaving aside the price-- what are the criticisms of the FCI course? I've only dipped into Immer's books, but having seen her on the box she seems like a decent teacher. The other attraction of this particular course, if I understand it correctly, is that it includes meals during which the wines under study will be paired with food. This seems like a good idea. I was in Nappa Valley a few weeks ago, and tasting even a reserve Mondavi without food didn't realy seem to do it justice.

Thanks for the report Aaron. Speaking of ribs, I'm heading off to Blue Smoke tonight. I'll report back tomorrow. If the reviews are to be believed they won't be worth getting excited about either.

I learned a few weeks ago (from ad in NYTimes) that Andrea Immer is offering a wine course (I think there are 8 sessions over dinners) at: The French Culinary Institute 462 Broadway New York, NY 10013-2618 (888) FCI-CHEF (212) 219-8890 It starts in the fall, on Monday nights. I didn't enquire about the price as I can't make that night.

We've watched a few of Alton Brown's shows, and, as consort says, we learn some interesting things, but I find Brown's manner overbearing. He's too much in one's face. I'd take Rosengarten any day over AB. Being as young as I am, Wilfrid, it must have been re-runs of the Fanny Craddock show I saw. Yes, I do remember them. Haddock, anyone, to go with that brown bread?

Floyd was refreshing in more ways than one. He drank copious amounts of wine on screen, and seemed--on more than a few occasions--very refreshed. Good for him.

A few weeks ago on Maui I tasted a raspberry wine (made by Tedeschi Vineyards) with a chocolate dessert and they made for a great match. http://www.hawaiiweb.com/maui/html/sites/t...chi_winery.html I'm searching for it in NYC, and have not found it here. I know that this repsberry wine is made in small batches, and goes for around $40 for a half-bottle In Union Square Wines, I bought a small bottle of Alba's (Finesville, NJ) Red Raspberry Wine, c$15. This is much inferior--thinner, sourer--but it may well work with chocolate nonetheless.

Today's NYTimes mag has an article by Julia Reed that discusses Sandor's, the restaurant, and Sandor, the man. It brought to mind your write up. http://www.nytimes.com/2002/06/30/magazine/30FOOD.html

Rochelle, All the best for tomorrow. I'm looking forward to your diary entries.