MartinH

I wouldn't trust a 30-second dunking to pasteurize the meat. Not long enough. Actually, HB says something a bit different. What HB says is: "Sometimes with red meat, when it's going to be cooked at 56C, it's necessary to sear or grill the meat before vacuum-packing it, and plunge the bag in water above 80C for three to ten minutes, according to thickness, to kill lactobacteria on the surface, which will otherwise affect the flavour." (The Fat Duck Cookbook p. 429) But I'm doubtful of HB's suggestion. First, if the aim is to kill surface bacteria, there's no need to vary the time from 3-10 mins according to thickness. Thickness has no bearing on the matter of killing stuff on the surface. Second, to first sear/grill the meat and then give it a 3-10 minute hot bath seems like overkill. Has anyone tried this double surface-heating method? Surely one or the other would suffice. Third, HB doesn't say exactly when the "sometimes" are that one needs to do this. How is one supposed to know when to do this and when not to? Fourth, I'm not sure how much or what flavours lactobacteria can leave behind during a straight 56C SV with no pre-searing. Fifth, why just red meat and why not say chicken too?

The iPad promises to take the cookbook to a new level. Cookbooks downloaded to it might contain hyperlinks, embedded videos, apps of other kinds, automatic conversions of measurements from metric to english ... and much else besides. So, for instance, that book by a TV chef might contain bits of the TV show within it. Or, it might link into the many variations of a recipe in online collections. Could be interesting.

Lamb is also prone to overcooking and turning somewhat soggy. At least, that's true of the New Zealand lamb that I have access to. So, when SVing lamb I avoid letting it stay too long. That may not be true of mutton, but mutton isn't sold hereabouts, so I cannot say for sure.

I use a couple of pinches of baking soda and it really speeds up the browning. Before, I had no patience to caramelize onions, now it's no problem. (The bicarbonate of soda also helps to brown cookies and other things.)

Sous vide and hash: they were meant for each other! True, sous vide is advanced cooking, while hash is about as primitive as it gets. But the two complement each other perfectly. Sous vide gives perfectly done meat. Yet, SV meat isn't browned, and it doesn't have any unctuous, mouth-coating, liquid fat. Make a hash a couple of days later, and you can get everything. I've found that the old-fashioned hash method needs to be slightly modified to yield a superior SV-hash. First, I prefer to avoid canola or other seed oils and to use instead a tasty grease, like butter or duck fat when I have it. Then, instead of throwing everything into the pan together, I briefly brown the meat chunks alone over high heat then remove them from the pan. Keeping it brief is of course important to maintain the rareness of the meat. Doing it in chunks is better, I've found, than browning one big slab of meat since the chunks have more edges, and edges tend to brown most quickly. Finally, into the pan go the vegetables. I keep a supply of blanched onion in the fridge because I think blanching takes away the harshness of onion. I tend to use little cooked potato and substitute cauliflower, which browns nicely. Some cooked cabbage, a few capers, roasted red peppers, all go well. Anyone else an afficionado of SV-hash?

This chimes with my experience that marrow from the middle of the bone was about as done as marrow from near the ends. There must be another reason for the common observation that meat near the bone is more tasty and juicy - perhaps it contains more collagen, and of course is usually furthest from the exterior, or perhaps "thermal conductivity" is just more complex than these bare measures.

Love the thin disks of marrow idea, sounds just right for a perfectionist chef. But at home, I'm wondering if the spouse will allow a big band saw into the kitchen alongside the SV setup (I used longish pieces about 2"-3").

Or, is bone in fact an insulator? I've heard this said before, but I'm now wondering what is the science of bone conductivity. Fat certainly insulates (hence the blubber layer of sea mammals); but bone perhaps not.

Bone does insulate and on a thick marrowbone there's 1/4" or even 1/2" of it for the heat to penetrate. I wonder if anyone knows what the actual thermal conductivity of bone is compared to flesh.

SV marrow bone hasn't been much discussed, so I've been experimenting. First, as a control, I tried the conventional methods of roasting and boiling. Roasting in a hot oven (450F/230C) for 15 mins is associated with a marrow-on-toast dish by Fergus Henderson. It yields slightly browned bone (which looks better sitting on a plate than a beige bone) and very soft marrow, suitable for slathering on toast. But: so much of the delicious fat melts away to waste! Boiling in soup or stew is traditional and it too gives a soft marrow, yet the fat and juices remain to fortify the pot. Tradition has much going for it. Then, I tried two SV ways. One was relatively hot and quick (175F/80C for 1 hour), the other was low and slow (135F/57C for 8 hours). Neither rendered much fat, though some juices were given off (much as happens when SVing flesh meat). The hot+quick marrow was quite firm, the low+slow was jelly-like -- better texture for my palate. The bottom line: SV marrow is an alternative to conventional methods, but it is not as clearly superior as SV-cooked flesh is to conventionally-cooked flesh.

Re: marrow bones, thanks for the suggestions. I'm planning a comparo test: 1. fry (with marrow removed from the bone, dusted with flour); 2. roast (450F/230C for 15 mins - because the web is full of a recipe from Fergus Henderson for roast veal marrowbones with parsley salad); 3. SV warm and quick (176F/80C for 1 hour, as KennethT did); 4. SV cool and slow (135F/57C overnight, as yosemit3 did). In each case, I'll lightly season each the same way with s&p. I hope I can report back after the holidays. Perhaps others can try a similar test to compare results.

Back on March 11 KennethT asked whether anyone has done just a marrow bone and if so, what temp/time? But there were no responses then. Anyone have any experiences with sous vide marrow bone?