robert brown

How about "very unique". I guess "sinfully rich" has run its course. Verbs without objects;i.e. "It stimulates";"It gratifies".

Wilfrid, does that mean that you think we will never get it together to have an e-Gullet dinner or that you will never attend one in a million years?

Unless my taste buds have lost their acuity to a degree more than I think they have, and in the past ten years I have turned into a moldy fig, I have to say with a certain sense of regret and nostalgia that French "haute cuisine" has declined noticeably. Not that you cannot still eat very well in France; you still can, but on fewer occasions and in fewer establishments. You can look at the reasons for it in a number of ways, but,as always,the reasons are economic. In my view, gastronomy in France still has not recovered from the nasty recession that began in mid-1990. To anyone who spent an appreciable time eating in France and paying attention, the dimunition in quality and quantity of food, generosity, and service declined. There was much less new restaurant formation, although a notable exception was the opening of "bistro" or second and third lesser restaurants by two-and-three-star chefs; talented young chefs who otherwise would have stayed in France migrated to Great Britain, the USA, and other countries; and seemingly any ambitious new restaurants for the most part were built by, and as part of, hotels. It is hard to imagine that anyone who systematically toured gastronomic France in the decade or two before 1990 could not help notice how small everything has become: the wine lists, the kitchen and dining room brigades, the a la carte menus to name the few most obvious. Ironically, however, there has been a perverse affect of the increase in the possibilities of increased enrichment for famous French chefs,(apparently the flirting with bankruptcy by chefs such as Gagnaire, Veyrat and Loiseau are all in the past) all of which the restaurant client pays for from chefs spreading themselves too thin. It is no wonder, given how gastronomy has become so media-driven, that all the excitement and action with only a few exceptions are in Paris. Gone are the days when one had to see the rest of France to eat well or to realize fully the depth of astounding restaurants: Bocuse, Chapel, Troisgros, Guerard, Verge, Haeberlin, and others. Now any chef of talent, (unless his deep feeling of roots and family dictate otherwise) is either opening in Paris or leaving the country. (Someone ought to discuss what the American popular culture and life and its depiction in the media have done to attract culinary talent to our shores). Perhaps it would be interesting if one were to ask some of the interesting younger chefs the question, "What are you doing and why are you doing it". I think you would get, if they were honest, replies having more to do with living the good life and achieving fame, notoriety, and creating dishes that aided in attaining those ends than you would have 20 years ago, where the answers would have more to do with satisfying the clients, respecting the traditions and "terroir", and then, maybe, a few words about having your other needs provided for.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the genesis of what we now call "fusion" cuisine is a trip Gault-Millau organized for several French chefs to a few cities in Asia in the late '70s. I know that Louis Outhier and Pierre Troisgros were definitely among them. Michel Guerard, I believe, was also there and probably a few lesser-lights. As for where they went, Bagkok for sure and almost surely Hong Kong. It appears that only Outhier had his head turned, but that was enough to add Asian touches to his cuisine at his restaurant in La Napoule, L'Oasis (a Michelin ***) and to influence above everyone else one of his 'stagiers", Jean-Georges. This trip is the single-most (seminal) manifestation to influence, if not seriously launch, fusion cooking.

Suvir, that is an observation I would agree with. Until a few years ago, London was the place I would have Indian food above all else. However, the meals I have at Salaam Bombay are as good as I have anywhere outside of India (not that I have spent a lot of time there). Bay Leaf is an address that no one ever talks about, but to my mind is only one notch below Salaam Bombay. I ate at SB a few nights ago and enjoyed food of an incredible freshness (best sag I have had in NYC, speaking of freshness). Yet I know that Indian cuisine is extremely varied, complex, and place-oriented and can only wonder if New York represents it well. Suvir, what are your thoughts about Indian food here and the best places to experience it? I would like to see more posts about Indian restaurants in NYC.

Bux, did you used to hang out at the Cedar Tavern?

Bux, I have nothing against short shelf life. It's what keeps every guidebook and food/travel magazine and their personnel earning their keep. I just don't consider Patricia Wells in the Pantheon of gastronomy writers, which is what Steve started off talking about and the context that he initially established. I view her as the husband of the long-time managing editor of the International Herald Tribune above everything else. I would like to think that there are lots of people who post on eGullet that for some reason or another have more "gourmandness" than she does. Her reviews do not instill any excitement or anticipation in me; they do not convey the nature of the particular experience. Her reviews are workman-like, yeoman's service, and so forth. I know that a lot of ex-pats and Francophiles think she is special, but I think a lot of it is a matter of lack of an alternative; i.e some others whose job it is to cover the food scene in France and in English on a regular, continuous basis. Now maybe her relatively recent foray into recipe books is another story, but I direct my thoughts to her reviews and guides.

Steve, you invoked Patricia Wells in the preceeding context of literary genius ( or near-genius) by mentioning Liebling, Gopnick, and Olney; and in the context of rigor by mentioning Waverly Root. I don't think Patricia Wells is rigorous or, as previously mentioned, a good writer. But as I said, she did the field work, but so did Henri Gault and Christian Millau. (And is the book you say you have "Dining in France" or "Le Guide Gourmand de la France". You seem to be inferring the former by referring to "the high end". Guide Gourmand is about what grows where, what dishes and product are from what place,etc. arranged in the same way as the Blue Guides.)The work Wells did had already been done, but you are right in that popularized it for Anglo-Saxons. Also, what about Samuel Chamberlin? I have his book on France he did for Gourmet Magazine in the 1950s? I'll look at it tonight and put it in context. As for her collaboration with Robuchon, did you ever see her pan any chef that came out of his restaurant? The stuff she does has a short shelf life. The books that Waverly Root, Roy DeGroot, Liebling,etc. do will be around a lot longer than Patricia Wells's work.

The difference between Patricia Wells and the other people you mentioned is that they can write and she can't. Her restaurant reviews are written as though she has blinders on and her taste is questionable as well. I also do not like that she forms economic links with people like Robuchon. All she has done is a lot of road work. True, she does write better than Faith Heller Willinger, but that is not saying a lot as she can not write at all. But as I wrote elsewhere on the site a few weeks ago, her recommendations are terrific; but maybe that's saying as much about Italy as anything else. It slipped my mind, but who was the blind American food writer who wrote about France? He wrote a terrific book about two sisters who had a little restaurant in, I believe, the Savoie. Do you know that one, Steve? Or anyone else? Okay, it's "The Auberge of the Flowering Hearth" by Roy Andries deGroot. I just found it on Amazon. Steve, if you want the penultimate book about French gastronomy, try to find "La Guide Gourmande de la France", Gault and Millau's first project, I believe. (circa 1970) I would lend you mine if you don't have it, but I would never get it back!!!

Steve, at what time are you talking about the eight establishments? I wrote as best I could what I remembered from when G-M started the 19.5 (c. 1980) until the early 1990s. However, in trying to paste it from word onto the site, I lost it and got the whole thread instead. I can redo it tomorrow or just try to stick to a certain period. You got a better send-off from Guy Sammut than I did. While we were waiting on the roadside 20 minutes for a kid to being us our short, he was parading around the grounds in but his skivvies while walking his dog. I gather you're back?

Steve, what do you mean by "It catapulted 8 places ahead of the other top restaurants in France and Switzerland"? Was Bruno being his pain-in-the-ass self? What about Guy Sammut? He's an arrogant, self-important asshole. I am getting an uneasy feeling about Guy Savoy. My friend, in a burst of ethnic pride, may have led me down the primrose path 25 years ago. I e-mailed him yesterday, but he has not answered. He's plastered a lot of the time. I used the time-honored research tool of looking up family names in the NYC phone book. There weren't a lot of Savoys, and one was a minister. I'm getting disheartened. How's the food? Keep up the good eating, Robert

Pheebs, Garnet Wines and Liquor on Lexington Ave. between 67 and 68 St. has Vidal-Fleury Baumes de Venise and perhaps a few others. You might find other offerings of interest. It's a really good store with good prices. I never looked at their grappa, but they are quite deep in Italian wine along with red and white Burgundy, and good overall. See if they will let you in on their 10% off on everything sale that runs into early March. Tell them you heard about it from a customer and that you made a special trip in from out of town. Good Luck!!

Steve, I'm incredibly embarrassed. It is "fresser" and payback for "than" rather than "then". What makes it worse is that when I e-mailed Amanda Hesser about her story on Maine belons, I suggested she change her e-mail address from "ahesser@nytimes to "afesser@nytimes". At least she replied, but only about the oysters. But Oy-veh.That's what happens when you grow up a Jew in the bush leagues. I always thought Guy Savoy looked like a tribesman, but this was c. 1976. Maybe he has grown out of it or converted for the extra bread. I'll ask Alain Weill (as in "Oy-veh"). How close did Cabrales get, and how did Guy or the staff guy respond?

Steven, I have no intention of moving in the hopes that you will conceive and execute the perfect restaurant in walking distance of both our houses.

Ajay, it's an Indian restaurant in Tribeca on Greenwich St, near Duane. It's one of the very best Indian restaurants in the city with several dishes that you do not always see in even the other good places. I wish I could get down there more often.

Living near 86 and Lex. I shrunk the Upper East Side. Thus when I say it is not a good neighborhood for restaurants, I was no doubt thinking about Carnegie Hill, the Italian joints along 2nd Ave, and so forth. Even so, some of the places mentioned that are in the 60s and 70s are, to my mind, overrated and overpriced. I'll admit there are some high-profile names befitting the socio-economic profile of the district, but I don't find good Chinese, Indian, Japanese, Italian or even pizzerias such as those you find mid-town and below 14th Street. When I want to go out and have an interesting meal that affords some value for money, I can't think of more than a few places near where I live. All the restaurants I have found to be of solid interest-Craft, Blue Hill, Nobu, Salaam Bombay, Dim Sum GoGo, Babbo, Lupa-are places I have to schlepp to.

I am not sure what the best restaurant neighborhood is, but I can tell you what the worst is: the Upper East Side. Wilfrid, what does the "D" stand for?

They're mercenaries, but I'm referring primarily to the French chefs who leave France and cook "French" food wherever they think they can make a buck.

It's Les Moulins du Duc. The 2001 Gault-Millau calls it a new listing, but says there is a new chef who apparently is reviving the place after "the depart of Torigai who made its glory". I guess that Torigai was the Japanese chef and that the establishment lay dormant for some period. I wonder what happened to the Japanese chef. Anyway, it was a charming situation 20 years ago and probably still is now.

P.S. Do you remember the name? Sometimes it pays to be a pack rat.

Now that you mention it, you are right. I remember a big pond on the property and a good meal as well. Goood work, Bux.

Bux, you're right about a Japanese chef in Brittany. I can see I'll be thinking of nothing else and laying awake all night trying to think of where. Was it in Belon at a hotel-restaurant circa 1980? Not Locquenole, is it? I thnk, though,that that is a French owner-chef situation. I think that after having so many of our guys and girls writing about food, it is nice that finally someone gets universal acclaim for preparing it.

Magnolia, if looks are deceiving, then M. Klein is Jewish; but to look at his picture on the Relais & Chateaux site, he looks like a young, nice-looking, something-other-than-Jewish lad. And how about his wife?

Magnolia, you mean two in one year? What do you think this is, women's Olympic figure skating? (Jewhoo says that Irene Slutskaya is Jewish). I suspect, however, that given his Alsatian location, Jean-Georges Klein has one of those names that is both German and Jewish, with the likelihood that it is indicative of the former to the exclusion of the latter. However, one never knows. Let's see what I can find out. Good observation, though.

Cabrales, La Mere Charles was the woman chef who sold the restaurant to Alain Chapel's parents. She was one of the "meres de Lyon". Chapel kept the name along with his until the late 1970s when he dropped the"Chez La Mere Charles" Bux, the answer to your riddle is "to get to the other side" (of the pond, that is).