Nathan

So, even though in your view the reworking may not have been enough to justify an automatic re-review, the place is good enough that a rereview is fine, if only to remind us?

based on that menu I would say that he appears to be genuine in shooting for a price point lower than that of his competition (especially in a hotel). though before getting too excited I find it highly likely that the $55 and $65 "Chef's Menus" at the bottom are in fact lunch tasting menus.

I have found websites asserting that they have the same kitchen but none that I would consider definitive. If, in fact, they do share the same kitchen then I absolutely stand by the assertion that to list NY as having three Nobus is an error. I will also note that people do not refer to Los Angeles as having two Nobus despite the presence of Ubon, and that NY was not referred to in guides as having two Nobus before the advent of Nobu 57.

the Nobu website describes it as an "extension" regardless, there were two indisputably blatant errors.

oh, gosh, I'm going to be another NY'er commenting on this (although I grew up elsewhere). "In other words, he can't distinguish between the taste of cornstarch and a dark roux." I believe his point was that one should be able to discern the difference -- and if one can't, then the roux is poorly done. For the record, most I've tasted in N.O. were indiscernable from cornstarch.

NY does not have three Nobus. (Next Door is the informal extension of the downtown Nobu) the first American L'Atelier opened in Las Vegas sometime ago. these errors are all of the vanilla type which are caught by basic intern-level - use the phone -- factchecking. and generally speaking, the Times is better on accuracy than its more partisan rivals like the Guardian or the Telegraph.

interesting article: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,20...37506_1,00.html I love the numerous factual errors. For years everytime a friend has come to me (from the right or left) with some politically hot story that is being "reported in the British papers but not by the American!" I've had to explain that British newspapers don't do fact-checking. seriously, they don't. not even the basic -- have an intern make some phone calls type of thing.

Craig's original point re: the difficulties of small producers in the U.S. was a good one, imho. for example, there are several small producers in the North Fork of Long Island. some of them make quite decent bottles in the $40 range (unfortunately, they're blown away by some of their $40 competition from elsewhere). unfortunately, although they do make bottles in the $10-25 range...I've never tasted one that wasn't swill.

middle of the block...either up or down the street from FR.

he ordered half the menu.

I haven't noticed any difference in quality between sitting in front of Yasuda and in front of one of the other chefs.

unless they've increased the prices, I don't think the BLT Burger prices are much (and often not at all) higher than their competitors.

I just returned from a trip to northern Italy so I'm late to the thread. completely agree with oakapple's last post. agree with most of Robyn's posts. exception: by and large, Germans speak excellent English. having hundreds of thousands of American soldiers parked there for years will do that. thought on the Japanese points: I don't have Raji's knowledge of Japan...but I did have a Japanese chef/student for a roommate for 2 years. When I first met him his reading knowledge of English was excellent and his spoken was ridiculously poor. according to him, this was standard in Japan...everyone learns how to read English but few no how to pronounce it. another note: in Italy, anyway, three-star Michelin restaurants all seem to be off the beaten path...in fact, I was unable to hit a couple that had been highly recommended to me (indeed the personal recommendations from people in the restaurant business jibed with Michelin's) because it would have required renting a car. another thought on "tourist places" v. places frequented by locals. sometimes the locals are wrong. I have friends who insist on asking cabdrivers etc. for recommendations everytime we travel. I find this pointless and inane. would one really recommend that a tourist visiting NY rely upon cabdrivers and people on the street for dining recommendations? the opinions of informed and sophisticated locals are obviously the best guide...but only if you can find them. the idea that any given local knows better than a guidebook is idiotic. (exceptions perhaps being food-obsessed countries like Italy and Spain) sometimes the local palate is very flawed. although I recommend that someone traveling to Prague go out to somewhere in Prague 3-10 and find a pivnice and order some pork knee and the like....I can also say that local advice for more sophisticated dining is horribly off. (which makes sense considering history.) any decent place there relies upon tourists to stay afloat. so, yeah, there are situations where guidebooks are your best, well, guide. second Robyn on hotel chains. they're almost all franchises anyway. I will say that as someone who is 6'3" I much prefer staying in "American" hotels in most of Europe (I would like to be able to stand up in the shower) one point of disagreement though: I think you will find that at high end restaurants in England they are certainly aware of Per Se.

casual is Nougatine

Just to clarify my point: I can think of several people here of whom I have no question would put together a better individual list than Michelin. But that's not a fair consensus, since the Michelin list is a consensus list. My proposition is that an egullet consensus list would not be any better.

This post (I happen to agree with most of it) illustrates why I doubt an egullet consensus list would be any better than the Michelin list. Marcus takes exactly the opposite viewpoint to some on this thread on several restaurants.

several points: 1. I know nothing about the clientele at DB Bistro Moderne so I can't comment on that. 2. I guarantee you that the majority of people who eat at Perry Street know who JG is. For several reasons -- of which the most obvious is that it is off the beaten path for tourists and the B&T. edit: and the tourists and B&T who do find their way to Perry Street are far more food-savvy and trendy then the rest. 3. I agree that B&T is unduly pejorative, but, as oakapple noted, there is no alternative term. 4. Of course many tourists and B&T know who JG is. However, they are not the same ones as those at Spice Market today. The food-conscious tourists and B&T peruse Time Out and eat at The Time Warner Center, Buddakan, etc....but, they are not eating at Spice Market these days. (Even a year ago it had been taken over by a trashier demographic. edit: there's a sharp difference between someone food-savvy who happens to reside in Chicago or Rutgers, and some 22-year-old guido with a gold chain hanging over his shirt -- it is the second type that now inhabits Spice Market)

oy! just to continue this (because I must): I might disagree with: "Would we all agree that most people who go to Spice Market -- even now -- know who he is? I would think so." there is such a massive tourist and B&T component today at SM that I'm not sure that is true.

that is indeed where I read it.

the people who are packing in right now most certainly know who he is (one look at the unusually old for the street and a burger joint demographic should give that away). the people who will discover it next week after it's written up in Time Out will know who he is (if nothing else because TO will tell them)...

"I doubt even 1% of New Yorkers know who he is." so? that's not what I said. he is a household name among the kind of people who spend a lot of money at restaurants...i.e. NY diners. There are thousands of these people in NY. Most of them have never heard of egullet. But they know who Laurent Tourondel is. why? because they eat at BLT Steak, BLT Prime and BLT Fish. they read Zagat, the New Yorker and, if younger, Time Out. I know this because I know numerous such people professionally. Danny Meyer, JG, Bouloud, Batali, Bouley, Circo, Tourondel, Robuchon, and Keller are names that they know. and some of them live in the WV.

I've read that they charge for the sauces...I don't personally know if this is true.

I'd say that he's a household name among NY diners today (much more so than at Cello)...

came up with a cocktail this weekend that worked out really well -- kind of a cross between a sidecar and a monkey gland. equal parts brandy and pear liquor, 1/half part cointreau, 1/3-1/2 part lemon juice, dash of grenadine, dash of suitcase absinthe (if you have it, not necessary), orange twist. I'm going to try it with apricot brandy instead of the pear liquor next time.

should be. But a press release without errors has the same existential validity as a black swan.