drcocktail

Ok Penwu, this dates from the 1920s or earlier because in the 30s they'd begun using other methods of closure. Traditional genever bottles like this were much the same from the mid-19th century (and before if you except the label) to, as I say, the 1930s. If the bottle has a pontil scar (look it up) on the bottom, that would put it in the 19th century. If it has a mold seam up the side (usually hidden in one of the corners on genever bottles) it is surely 20th century. FWIW, I envy you this lovely acquisition! Hope this helps! --Doc

Notice that Chris noted of the 1/2 oz Angostura: not an error. This is a cocktail that would lose any recipe-judging competition (assuming the rules stipulate the judging must be of the written recipe alone.) Add to that the rare genever, the egg, the gum syrup AND water...it just sounds busy, picky, weird, awful, and just plain wrong. Credit J.P. Morgan (who IS credited for this drink) for more than financial prowess and Chas. Baker, Jr. for having the guts and insight to originally publish it. I think, 65 years later, I was indeed the guy who revived it, in the sadly out of print Vintage Spirits & Forgotten Cocktails. ***WARNING***SELF-SERVING PLUG ALERT***WARNING I'm pleased to make eGullet the first discussion forum to report....Vintage Spirits & Forgotten Cocktails, the Deluxe, Revised edition will be released this year. It has more info, images, and stories on a lot of the rarified cocktails from the first edition (including the Alamagoozlum) but wait, there's more! There are 25% MORE new (meaning old) recipes of great flavor and obscurity to revel in plus more cocktail history and a section of Internet cocktail pioneers where eGullet plays a definite part! The book is bigger, more than double the page count, will open flat, hardback, and bee-yoo-ti-ful. The "where to acquire" section of arcane ingredients has been entirely updated. Release date: July 1st 2009. With any luck, it'll be on sale at Tales of the Cocktail. ***END***SELF SERVING PLUG ALERT***END*** We now return you to your regular programming. --Doc.

I sent Eric Seed samples of the Swedish Punsch brands I own quite some time ago: Cederlund's (once the most famous in America - pretty anemic stuff), Carlshamn's (very nice, stronger - available after Cederlund's retraction from the market in the States), and Grønstedt's Blau (in my view, the best Swedish Punsch out there; smokey & rich.) Wouldn't you know - the Grønstedt's broke. I will say the Facile Punsch E.S. sent me a sample of was maybe even better than Carlshamn's to my tastes. So I know that Eric knows what good Swedish Punsch tastes like, but for a while (and as observed via DW in this thread) I was having difficulty making clear the difference to him between what HE thought Swedish Punsch was supposed to be (the Arrack Punch beverage) and the honest-to-god liqueur that we are discussing. I think he gets it now. For instance, I'm very disinclined to believe there is lemon juice in the liqueur. If there was, well....let me put it this way: I have a full 1930s bottle of Cederlund's and it still has total clarity. You can see through it. Note what happens to cordials and alcoholized syrups that DO have juice in them...think about that 20 year old bottle of Rose's Lime you have stashed away....clear still? Not so much. I AM cheered to see someone cite tea an ingredient. I admit I didn't realise it, but as soon as I read it I KNEW it was right. The Van Oosten Batavia Arrack is, of the 3 brands I have messed with, the best I have EVER tasted. It will make a superb base for Swedish Punsch. I firmly believe Eric will toil away until he gets it right. He's been a hero to us all already! --Doc.

No way. A well-envisioned whole egg or egg yolk cold cocktail will be a lovely thing, and it ought to be the emulsification that makes it so. The viscosity changes, the sense of "richness" is enhanced, the "warmth" or "comfort" character of the drink is extended. Depending on the other ingredients, in a way magnified over egg white. If you are (more than a little) TASTING egg yolk, that was not a very well envisioned cocktail from the git go. Try a Coffee Cocktail. There egg yolk is used to good effect, IMHO. Part of the trick is to forget what you just put in the shaker. Americans tend to shrink from egg. The first step to dominating this fear is egg white. The second is egg yolk. Eventually you have an egg. Not too long ago I had an Absinthe Suisesse down in New Orleans. I ordered it, the bartender paused for a pregnant moment and then set about her duties. She served me the drink with the whole egg instead of just the egg white. It was STILL utterly delightful (and palatable). --Doc.

Northerner changed their rules and won't even entertain a discussion regarding it. When I wrote Vintage Spirits & Forgotten Cocktails they WERE shipping. Now, there is no one doing so. I'm working on it. Stay tuned. --Doc.

Yeah, it's a Swedish Punsch made by Henrik Facile in Stockholm, Sweden. ← I'm told he no longer makes it. Any truth to this? And definitely not distributed in the States, right? Thanks! --Doc.

Interesting conjecture. I don't believe the term "pastis" was even in the public parlance in 1930. --Doc.

Troublemaker! What I would propose is that you saw a typo. Duffy's Manual also repeated that recipe, and I know there wasn't anything called "absinthe bitters" in the States. Moreover, Duffy was largely a reprint of Savoy. Subsequent guides publishing the recipe saw Angostura indicated instead. If there WERE such a thing as absinthe bitters, my mind springs to a substance like Chartreuse Elixir Vegetal....a concentrate. Every other ref I've seen to absinthe bitters (or bitter absinthe) by proportions seemed to infer absinthe - just as similar phrasing did for Campari. And as deep into bitters as I am, it would frankly amaze me never to have heard even a whisper of such a thing. One other thought, though: the Waldorf guides mention "Manhattan Bitters" and we take that to mean generic aromatic bitters, suited to a Manhattan. In Jerry Thomas we saw "Bogart's Bitters" a mistranscription of Bokers. Such phantoms gather over time, but neither of those two, so-named, have ever been documented either. Then again, maybe Mr. Craddock was making his own private bitters! Oh, and a final observation: with the legality of absinthe a changing and moving target arount the world these days, we note the term "absinthe bitters" as currently referring to labeling standards for real absinthe being sold in France where it is required that they be labeled as bitters or amer. --Doc.

Well, I am not inclined to necessarily suppose Secrestat Bitters had any predominant anis component. No other gentianes do. Which is not to say that Peychaud (and yes, Angostura too) mightn't use gentian as theiir primary bitter agent, it is just to say that, as with quinquinas, the gentiane style has great similarities between brands. I say "as with quinquinas" so let me illustrate that parallel: Dubonnet, Byrrh, St. Raphael...see? All their own products and formulae, but all within a rather tight spectrum. So it is with gentianes, which, like Suze, tend to be more typified with a definite detectable gentian FLAVOR as well as bitterness. On the other hand, lots of products use gentian that are NOT gentianes, and you mentioned some. Angostura and Regan's #6 immediately spring to MY mind. Now as to whether simply diluting aromatic bitters would turn them into aperitif bitters, well....kudos, man. That is a bonafide SUPERB question - and I'd say the answer is...yes. Not necessarily a good aperitif bitters, and certainly not one that would fit well into established categories (quniquina, gentiane, absinthe/pastis/aperitif anis). But THAT fact does not pishposh your idea either. Amer Picon, Campari, Fernet Branca, Unicum, Boker's, Hostetters all fell outside of strict categories. The jury is still out on Khoosh. Someday I may extract some of my Secrestat just to put the flavor question to rest, and when I do, I'll be sure to let the results be known here on eGullet! And eje, "absinthe bitters" were just absinthe just as "Campari Bitters" or "Bitter Campari" were just Campari. Just another way they were expressed among bartenders and devotees that found its way, occasionally and piecemeal, into barguides of previous eras. --Doc.

Hi all, at Erik's request I'm poking my head in here; something I don't do nearly often enough! I have a full Secrestat Bitters. It WAS an aperitif bitters. I have not sampled it, but it likely conforms to the general characteristics of French Amers. In fact it was a special subcategory of aperitif bitters known (as thirtyoneknots' poster link clearly shows) as Gentiane(s). This means the bitter constituent in it was gentian, while the bittering agent in absinthe was wormwood and the bitter component in all quinquinas (Dubonnet, Byrrh, Cap Corse, St. Raphael) was quinine. Of course, Secrestat, like Angostura (but not like Peychaud) was the name of a company, not just a product, and Secrestat made an absinthe (and later an absinthe substitute - pictured here.) as well as the once-famous Tonicola, but neither were the iconic bitters. They also made a whole range of liqueurs not unlike Bardinet or Cointreau back in the day. It bears noting that absinthe itself was an aperitif bitters, but Secrestat was more akin to Amer Picon and even to Suze than to absinthe. That the Secrestat COMPANY once made an absinthe and later an absinthe substitute explains the absinthe spoon neatly, but the fact that the Robys poster is unquestionably showing Secrestat Bitters being poured over the slotted spoon crowned with a sugar cube suggests that they were making a contention that the old absinthe technique suited gentianes as well. This was not a commonly held belief. Gentianes are rather uncommon outside of France, but here is one brand and here is another. Hugs and toasts to all, --Doc.

I'd say, deftly donning my Sherlock Holmes chapeau, the answer is elementary - we have all the evidence we need before us: 3 parts Charbray orange vodka, 1 part fresh lime juice, 1 part Belle de Brillet Pear Liqueur....and a big honking slice of avocado, yumm! Always glad to be of service, --Doc.

Hail all, after so long a sojourn! I just happened on this thread, and as serendipity and fortuitous timing would have it, I just posted a rather exhaustive article on this very subject! Stop by, won't you? Cheers and hugs to all my pals! --Doc.

Sam, Nursie might agree with you. As for me, I hate peering at the glass (or worse, metal) all-in-one pourer. When I have a number of guests over, I am so much faster with my 3 (6) jiggers sizes and I can see the measurement I need immediately by the (comparitive) size of the jigger. I suffer every time I have to use an an-in-one. That said, Nursie makes me great Martinis with her chosen all-in-one glass measurer: (That's 1/2 a rabbit of dry vermouth and a full jackass of gin!) --Doc.

As a matter of fact, I just created a bar set for Nurse Cocktail's niece's wedding gift (got that?) I put it all together from scratch and composed a instruction/explanation document for it which I am providing a link to right here: Doc's cocktail set (redacting only their names.) Most of it is self explanatory, but the juicer is one of those tall steel ratcheted machines with an pull arm like on a one-armed bandit. The shaker is lovely and, with rubber gaskets all around, particularly simple to use. This to me, was a sane cocktail kit. As I say in the text, you still need glasses, plates, linens (and booze) but this is otherwise all I need when I make drinks. --Doc.

I love this thread, not only because I adore aquavit, (be it the aged Linie or the bracing-but-succulent Aalborg) but because you all have come up with a set of recipes that, to a one sound delicious. I want to try them all. 2 or 3 years ago I came up with this one: Le Corbusier 3 oz aquavit 1/4 oz (2 tsp) crème de cassis 1/4 oz orange juice Combine ingredients in iced cocktail shaker, Shake & strain into cocktail glass Add a thin float of soda water Garnish with orange peel --Doc.

I've been recommending Killer Cocktails to sincere newcomers who contact me regularly via CocktailDb. As I said to Splif, it's a real wolf in sheep's clothing...friendly, kicky graphics, basic mixing guidance, and before you know it, you're in deep with the good stuff. Just like small fry might say..."jeez, if Id'a knowed it wuz healthy I wuddn'ta et it!" Too late! --Doc.

Hi. I'm so used to being a know-it-all, this is my first post in these waters. I mean direct or online contact with the rum greats of the world, Edward Hamilton right here in this forum with his amazing geographic and sipping knowledge, Steve Remsberg with his astonishing collection of VERY vintage rums, and Jeff "Beachbum" Berry with his platinum palate for the complexities of tiki drinks...it's been enough to keep even a blabbermouth like me from waxing too pithy on subject rum! But I must take the plunge, Ed. I've been following your adventures since you first put up the old pink Tapia website. I sure am glad this blog format has expanded our internet info-gathering and communicating horizons! Though I remain largely mute on the subject, my relationship with rum is one of love - and I keep a LOT of rum and related spirits on hand. Many of my past and current holdings may be viewed here. That said, there is one rum related product also seen on the site which long ago wrested itself from my grasp. This is a mantra more and more people are repeating too: I want my Pimento Dram! Wray & Nephew called theirs simply "Pimento Liqueur" -though eventually they gave it the cute name of Berry Hill Allpice Liqueur, presumably so folks wouldn't think it was a cordial composed of the red wadded up things that inhabit olives. Sangster actually CALLED theirs Pimento Dram, but seems to have discontinued its manufacture some time ago. So, Ed, here are my questions: Why did Sangsters stop making the stuff? What can be done to encourage W&N to A) sell the stuff online and B) export less than a container into the U.S.? Finally, failing all else, how might I, short of a Jamaican vacation, replenish MY supplies of the stuff? I think it is the most versatile liqueur in the world, and I have 1/2" left in my last bottle! Please help, my sanity depends on it! Thanks! --Doc.

What remains consistantly interesting to me is the utter difference between even the most cursory Calvados and the most carefuly crafted American apple brandy. Laird's flagship product shows it, St. George's did too. They ALL do. I've had 1913 American apple brandy which has the same character - which is utterly different than Calvados character. I'm not trying to create thread about which is better (Calvados), but rather why someone (we) can't or doesn't/don't embark on a process to match the character of the other non-superior (superior, Calvados) product. I've never had a serious American apple brandy I didn't respect (dislike is another matter). Applejack, so termed, is different. I love the whiskey character and I know it is pretty much just for mixing. Those with pretentions to the snifter, however...man, maybe it's just me, but how does that Normandy rotgut get its flavor? We can't seem to achieve it. --Doc.

Applejack was called applejack all the way by in colonial times and did not really differentiate between distillation methods. As a matter of fact, even back then, steam distillation was highly preferred. Cold distilling makes a gut-wrenchingly awful product and was only used at times of dire necessity. In those days what REALLY divided apple brandy so-called from what was termed "applejack" was the aging of one and the lack thereof upon the other. No commercial product put the term "applejack" or "apple jack" on a label until the 20th century, and then it was synonymous with apple brandy. --Doc

I never had that reaction. Vodka, even old Smiroff, never appeared to make Vespers harsh to me. The one thing that DOES seem very important is the lemon twist. Not a tiny little spiral, but a broad swath twisted smartly right over the surface of the drink. That's my secret weapon! --Doc.

If you combine Monin syrup and vodka until you achieve a flavor like pastilles - and not particularly syrupy, you'll have an approximation of it. --Doc

Actually, Safeway notwithstanding, rye is probably not your main problem. Finding good raspberry syrup is a BIG hassle. I always use canned grapefruit juice because it's easy and works great in this cocktail, but I recommend avoiding the pink stuff as a tad too sweet. It's getting so that, in my neck of the woods, the pink stuff is all that is available. I may just break down and buy a REAL grapefruit and see where going au naturel gets me! --Doc.

OK, my bar was designed to specifically suit me, and my ideas are, at best, odd. Mirror? What mirror? Perhaps you mean under the old 1940s neon jeweler's clock? Nope. It's just a side table from which I can chose a cocktail shaker by whim. I do not believe a sink has any place in my bar. A drain? Sure. A sink? Just takes up space and washing glasses is not mixology. The pantry is through the white (and it won't always be white...work in progress) door to left of the bar. Easy carting for cleanables. You'll note there is no front bar either. I hate being separated from my guests. If I have a big party (rare; I like the small ones best) I drag in stanchions to lightly define a perimeter so I don't have to shoo people away as they impede access to the cabinets. Now, refrigeration and ice are a different matter. There I must protest that I have only owned the house 1 year and the library wasn't even the biggest project. That said, see the wall at the right end of the bar? That the right hand glass cabinet butts up against? There will soon be a built in fridge/freezer arrangement there with a door that matches the cabinetry. Right now it is an ice bucket situation though the kitchen ice maker is just steps away. Thanks for the compliments, but a bit of perspective here: I used to be a DJ years ago, and I had LOTS of LPs. I still love music and that whole back shelf/cabinet unit to the right of the patio doors still contains about 3500 recordings on LP and 78. I sold off easily 500 lps (half of them) long before CDs hit the market simply because if you are not at some radio station why would you want 500 albums with 1 decent song on each? Think about my booze that way. Many of those bottles are called for in one cocktail in the pantheon of cocktail history - like Cora Bitters in the Amarosa Cocktail. Sure, I could create new and tasty drinks calling for the ingredients (and do) but since no bars carry this stuff, they are tasty little hothouse flowers. My book professes an egalitarian premise that great forgotten cocktails should be AVAILABLE and I bend over backwards to provide sources for all obscure spirits in those recipes. Creating a recipe from a weird old ingredient not made anymore and only used once before may lead to some surprising taste sensations, but when someone says "That's great! I want to order one next time out and make it at home too!" it does my ego no good at all to say "sorry, can't, don't make it anymore." Historically interesting, but the envy maybe slightly misplaced unless you specifically want to be my kind of nut! --Doc.

Jason, You are right! Or left; far on the left top shelf of the left cabinet resides the Zacapa. Here's a tour of the rest of the visible: next to the Zacapa, Clairin, then Batavia arrak, n/d rum, a very old Yates Bros. London Dock that really ought to be in one of the rare cabinets, Bacardi 8, Myers's, Old Overholt, Kentucky Spirit, Famous Grouse. Bottom shelf: bottle of Marc, bottle of Plymouth gin from the 70s, barack palinka with the big fat red cap just barely visible behind it, Martel, Poire William in the box, another n/d Cognac, Laird's Appple Brandy (100 proof), Raynal, sideways bottle of Boddles, gallon mason jar of North Caroline moonshine, Linie aquavit, a tiny lab bottle of real zubrowka (can anyone help me out, here???) and a big old honker of Schenley's gin. Just the first charge of the left flank, Ladies & Gentlemen - each cabinet goes back about 7 bottles deep. I think I should stop now before your eyes roll all the way back in your heads. I basically know where everything is - except I need to more thoroughly arrange the liqueurs into subcategories, like in CocktailDB. A megalomaniac's work is never done. --Doc.

Remember, I never said I was Ansel Adams. Any cabinet you see that isn't open is equally packed with libational constituents! In the big cabinet resides the booze I mix with regularly. Left cabinet-hard liquor, middle cabinet-liqueurs, right cabinet-non-alc mixers, bitters, absinthes, wines used in cocktails, spices. The other cabinets around the room contain real rarities and are divided by specific type of booze. there is a bit of liqueur overflow too. I'll be building another cabinet where you now see those side chairs and the big box. That should take care of the entire collection. --Doc.