Burgundy

[tommy]

i have an 80 dollar gift certificate to a wine store, and i want to use it to by something that i normally wouldn't.  that is to say, a bottle over 25 dollars!

i love red burgundy, but really have little experience with them.  any suggestions as far as what to look for (region, cru, year, etc) when shopping for a bottle in the 80 dollar price range?  

additionally, if it's possible to get something decent for around 50 or 60, i'd just as soon get 2.

please do not pelt me with rocks and garbage.  i'm sure there is something nice out there waiting for me.

any help would be appreciated.

[robert brown]

Tommy, do you want to hold 'em or fold 'em? I'm partial to the Albert Moreau Beaune wines (Toussaints and Teurons) in the value for money department.  Maybe priced in the low 30's. The 1997 you could probably enjoy now if you like to drink Burgundy young, which a lot of people do. Otherwise straight village wines such as Gevrey-Chambertin 1ere Cru from Serafin would be nice. A Comte Lafon single-vineyard Volnay. Why don't you go to the store and write down some names and post them? Is it a store with a big choice of red Burgundies?

[tommy]

i'm going to drink this one now.  

once i'm a little more familiar with some bottles i'll buy and hold.

there are several wine stores i could go to.  i suppose that altogether there would be a decent selection.  perhaps i'll take your advice and post of few that i see.  thanks for the input.  

[Steve Plotnicki]

Tommy - That's a tough one. It's hard to a find a burg that is drinking now, let alone one for later. The 1997 vintage is a good bet for you because it is atypical and the wines are forward. A producer who makes wines that drink well young is Serafin. If you can find 1997 Serafin Charmes-Chambertin, it's about. Also, if they have a 1997 Rene Leclerc Griottes-Chambertin that drinks great too and is in the same price range. But it might be easier for you to tell us who the shop is, and we can go online (if they are online) and see what they have.

[helenas]

Steve,

Is this offer valid only for tommy and ๠ burgundy?

What about other egulleters in need of guidance?

Could you take a look at our beloved NJ winestore

http://www.winelibrary.com/

Are there any attractive reds in ุ-โ price range

( i don't have a gift certificate), something that will be a revelation for a budding wine lover?

Thanks, helena

[Steve Plotnicki]

Helena-I peeked at the site and they have two 1999 Roumier wines and I think he is the best producer out there.  Normally I wouldn't recommend Burgundys in that price range. But 1999 is possibly the best vintage in 50 years and every Roumier wine is supossedly stunning. They have a Chambolle-Musigny and a Morey St. Denis Clos de Bussiere which is a Monopole that Roumier owns. Each wine is เ. I think those wines are better buys than blowing money on more expensive Burgs. But that's just my not so humble opinion.  If you can manage a mixed case of those two, or even a half case, you will easily drink the Chambole over the next 5 years and the Morey over the next 7, possibly more.

[TCD]

Tommy,

You may want to consider checking out www.winespectator.com site.  Although I find WS ratings to be less reliable than those of Parker and Rovani, you can perform searches for free for red burgundy in certain vintages to become familar with the higher rated producers and appellations.  You could also try erobertparker.com.  It's a pay site, but I believe you can run some free trial searches if you register.

Generally, it's early to be drinking the 1999s but the '97s are approachable.  Also, 1993s are drinking well now and seem to be available in better shops.  Note that it was not a strong vintage overall but there are defintely fine drinking options providing good value.  1995 and 1996 were good vintages and with some air time are very enjoyable.

I have a list of burgundy producers/negotiants and regions that I provided to some "non-wine" relatives who were interested in giving some bottles as gifts and wanted some guidance.  I'll send it to you when I locate it.

[tommy]

much appreciated.  you are all very helpful.

[Ron Johnson]

Tommy, do not go anywhere near the winespectator website if you are looking for any valuable information regarding Burgundy.  Choosing a decent burg is hard enough without throwing those bufoons into the mix.

My 0.2, scrap the burgundy altogether and spend the 80 bones on a Northern Rhone.  You can get a very good Cote Rotie for that price.  Look for '90, '95, or '99.

[A Balic]

Tommy - in regards to Burgundy, my vote is for a Chambolle-Musigny, which I love because of the fantastic nose, I could just smell a glas of it all day. I realise that this is way out of line, but as you have the cash to spare and you like Burgundy, have you thought of getting some New World pinot noir? New Zealand Pinots are getting some interest at the moment, some are a little full-blown, but one I could recomend is "Martinborough Vineyard". It might be interesting to compare a Burgundy with one of these New World upstarts.

[DANYRAF]

You can use the Wine Spectator and Wine Advocate sites if the style of Burgundy you like is the new style (big, black, rich overripe fruit with little structure, tannins or longivity) that they seem to enjoy. Neither one of these publications seems to enjoy or understand traditional Burgundy. Read Steve Tanzer or Clive Coates but most important.... trust your own palet....

[mogsob]

It is not so simple to say "Red Burgundy" and get an answer. More than any other wine region in the world (especially when considering that it is only pinot noir we are talking about), Burgundy ranges from big, rough and tannic wines (e.g., Fixin) to highly perfumed, delicate wines (e.g., Chambolle) to big, long, deep wines (e.g., Vosne Romanee). Moreover, the structure of Burgundy, where a single vineyard has dozens of producers (each with a different style and interpretation of terrior), means that there is no such thing as a Burgundian style. I mean, when you drink a great Paulliac, you know what you're getting. Same for Napa, Piedmont etc.

Here's my 2 cents. Go up to East 84th St. and Rosenthal Wine Merchants. They are primarily importers, but also do a retail business. There, you can sit down with (Will, most likely) and discuss what you like in wine (big, soft, long, perfumed, fruit, tannins, whatever). He can then recommend some wines to try (or one great wine). Going to Rosenthal is a unique wine buying experience -- you can get hooked quickly.

[tony h]

I recall that you live in Hoboken. In the days when I lived there I remember a very good wine shop on 1st street. They were very knowledgeable, friendly & had a fairly good selection. Ask them for advice. Also, don't rule out Beaujolais - something of a revolution has happened there in the last couple of years & they are now producing some excellent wines

[tommy]

it has been several months, and i'm still sitting on this gift certificate. thanks for the additional advice good people.

[Rail Paul]

Mogsob offered good advice. I may take him up on the suggestion.

You mentioned you have enjoyed California Cab Franc from time to time, I'd suggest you consider a Volnay for comparison. For $45, Fontaine-Gagnard offers a 1999 version (Clos des Chenes). I think F-G is largely a white wine house.

Good wine, Gary's had it a few weeks ago. I think it's in reasonable circulation.

[wineguy]

For myself, one of the great pleasures of wine (aside from drinking) is doing the research on the producer, trying to find out what makes them tick and passionate about the wine they make. When dealing with Burgundian wine, I find it is all about personality, you can have two winemakers literally sharing the same vineyard area and yet they are able to produce wines that speak differently. If you have or can get your hands on a refernce text that gives you some background on the producers, then when you are tasting try and identify and see if the descriptions match that of the characteristics given in the text. This doesn't mean every wine found is going to be great, but if it can come close to the description of how it was written up, then you have a find that you can talk confidently about next time. Great vintages and great producers are easy to find, it's looking behind the label and finding something that relates to you. Happy hunting.

[cookandwife]

screw burgundy, get in your car and go get yourself a good ZIN!!!

[cookandwife]

screw burgundy, get in your car and go get yourself a good ZIN!!!

[tommy]

zins are zins. burgundies are burgundies. i like both.

[mogsob]

Hey, cookandwife, why all the negativity? Is it born of ignorance or just plain malice? Zins make for a pretty good table wine, but the grape is incapable of reaching the heights of the nobler grapes.

[Lesley C]

I second the Cote Rotie suggestion. Burgundies at that price are risky. I love Burgundies but have blown too much money on dreary bottles between $20-$30. Cotes du Rhone in that price range are more reliable.

[tommy]

I second the Cote Rotie suggestion. Burgundies at that price are risky. I love Burgundies but have blown too much money on dreary bottles between $20-$30. Cotes du Rhone in that price range are more reliable.

i'm looking to spend 80 retail. i'm also looking to not blow money, which is why i'm asking opinions of you fine people. and more than 20 on a cotes du rhone seems a bit odd. rhone offers far better at that price point.

and yes, it's now 6 months after my initial query, and i have yet to make a purchase.

[MartyL]

One of the tough things about buying high-priced Burgundy is that if you open it very young, you end up missing out on many of the qualities that make the wine sought-after and expensive in the first place. Unfortunately, unless you are buying at auction, it is hard to find older Burgundies for sale.

If you want something that will be young and delicious in a Pinot-puppy-fat sort of way, while still tasting like Burgundy and expressing a sense of place, I'd suggest you buy a bottle each of 99 Roumier Chambolle Musigny (about $35) and 99 Roumier Morey St. Denis 1er Cru "Clos de la Bussiere" (about $45). These wines are available in a number of shops in New York, including Acker Merrall, Sherry Lehman and Garnet. Garnet probably has the best price.

[mogsob]

One of the best tips I once got on drinking young Burgundy is this: open the wine a few hours before you are going to drink it, decant it and put the stopper back on the decanter. Perhaps not a substitute for proper ageing, but a substitute nonetheless. Also be sure to use proper glasses to capture the nose correctly.

[tommy]

Also be sure to use proper glasses to capture the nose correctly.

i have burgundy glasses. will they work?