Petrus ?

[GordonCooks]

I've heard it either way by people of equal knowledge - so, I'm slightly confused as my calls to the Mouieux chateau's answering machine go unnoticed.

Is it "Pe-troose" or Pe-trus" ?

edit - I've been using the latter for as long as I remember

Edited July 14, 2003 by GordonCooks (log)

[carswell]

I've heard it either way by people of equal knowledge - so, I'm slightly confused as my calls to the Mouieux chateau's answering machine go unnoticed.

Is it "Pe-troose" or Pe-trus" ?

edit - I've been using the latter for as long as I remember

There's an acute accent on the e (Pétrus), so the first syllable is pronouced pay. The tru is pronouced somewhat like English true and the final s is pronounced but unvoiced (i.e. like the s in caboose, not goes). The syllables are given equal emphasis and, of course, the vowels are purer than their English equivalents.

[endless autumn]

in english it's 'petroose': we don't use french vowel sounds.

(paris is 'paris', not 'parrhee'.)

[Fat Guy]

Endless thanks, endless autumn, for explaining that. It needs to be repeated every time this conversation arises in any context.

Here are some useful wine-pronunciation resources:

http://www.stratsplace.com/dict/p_dict.html

http://www.bbr.com/GB/wine-knowledge/pronu...ion.lml?ID=null

http://www.wineloverspage.com/lexicon/

[Stone]

in english it's 'petroose': we don't use french vowel sounds.

(paris is 'paris', not 'parrhee'.)

You probably pronounce Otto, "Otto."

[melkor]

I'm sticking with Pet-russ, but I do kind of like the idea of calling Dominus Domi-noooose. this link supports my pronunciation of Petrus.

[docsconz]

Let's call the whole thing off

[carswell]

in english it's 'petroose': we don't use french vowel sounds.

(paris is 'paris', not 'parrhee'.)

First, and more to the point, if GordonCooks is phoning the chateau (figuratively or not), it's probably not to learn how the name is pronounced in London or L.A.

Second, the pronunciation of foreign names and words in English is not nearly as cut-and-dry as you would have it. Yes, the names of certain cities, for the most part historic centres of trade, have long been Englished (e.g. Hong Kong, Cologne, Florence and, bien sûr, Paris). But that is rarely the case for the names of smaller places. And bear in mind the modern-day trend to move closer to the native orthography and pronunciation (Peking -> Beijing, Bombay -> Mumbai, Leghorn -> Livorno, Quebec City -> Québec).

When pronouncing the name of a foreign estate/producer, here's the safest rule to follow: approximate it in English, trying to get as close as possible to the native pronunciation without sounding affected or unnatural. Why pronouce the s in Cornas and not in Chablis? Why pronounce Billecart bee-ya-car instead of bile-cart? Aloxe alosse instead of alox? Fumé fu-may instead of fume or few-mee? Rioja ree-o-ha instead of ree-o-jaw? Because in every instance it is closer to the native pronunciation. Yes, standard usage determines correctness in English. But who is in a position to say what the standard usage among anglophones worldwide is for Pétrus, let alone Pacherenc du Vic Bihl? In the end, the only reliable touchstone is how native speakers pronounce it.

Melkor, that's the French pronunciation (and spoken by a francophone to my ear). Note that the first syllable is closer to pay than to pet and that the t goes more with the r that follows than the é that precedes. Am a bit surprised by the pronunciation of Cos, though. I've always understood it was pronouned cosse but the clip sounds closer to casse.

Edited July 14, 2003 by carswell (log)

[melkor]

Melkor, that's the French pronunciation (and spoken by a francophone to my ear). Note that the first syllable is closer to pay than to pet and that the t goes more with the r that follows than the é that precedes. Am a bit surprised by the pronunciation of Cos, though. I've always understood it was pronouned cosse but the clip sounds closer to casse.

I'm focused on the troos or trus question... To my ear, that clip supports my trus opinion. The speaker as well as the Chateau are french, so I suspect it's safe to go with the french pronunciation. Besides, it's just a bottle of Merlot

[Mark Sommelier]

Pétrus is Latin for Pierre.