Kohai

Got it. Thank you.

These points all make sense, although I'm not sure I personally am going to abandon the syrup so readily. Is the opinion of Embury, who stressed the use of syrup for simple ease, given no consideration regarding this drink? Is it because he was writing 100 years too late? Finally, what about the orange slice? I shudder at the thought but it sounded like David (Wondrich, not Embury) tolerates them. I thought that stuff like that was derided as "the garbage"....

I think I may actually have had a few Old Fashioneds (and should it really have a hypen: "Old-Fashioneds"?) the last time I tried to address this question, but... Can someone who rigidly adheres to the school of solid sugar over syrup explain why it's supposedly the correct or better way? I would be curious to hear why. Is it strictly a purist thing? I personally prefer syrup for practical and taste reasons. I also find it difficult to believe that people didn't make sugar syrups for convenience even in the earliest days of the cocktail. Anyway, a good counteropinion would be interesting. Thanks.

Hmmm. Well put, sir. Perhaps I will rethink some of my earlier comments.

So... it's comparable to sugar, therefore it's "poison"?

Wait... so you're taking a naturally occurring sugar and mixing it with a nerve toxin... and the sugar is the problem? ETA: "a small amount of agave nectar isn't going to kill you. Just don't buy into the idea that it's any better for you than plain old sugar or HFCS" OK, cool. So it's only as good as plain old sugar, but not better. That'll do.

While I'm at it... what's wrong with agave syrup? This is totally off my radar. All the info I find on it seems to indicate that it's natural, non-chemical - legit, in other words, depending on the brand. Wherefore the gripe?

Even potato shochu doesn't taste like vodka (because, as noted above, shochu has flavor). They're pretty different spirits.

Does it strike anyone else as ironic that - of all the cocktails to eggify - they choose the Old Fashioned?

Wow. This has been both an incredibly frustrating and utterly fascinating thread to watch for weeks now. While I personally fall into the school that defines an O.F. rather narrowly (sugar + bitters + spirit + ice + twist)... I confess! I balk at the demand for solid sugar over syrup. Dave, you say that you expect to receive a drink made using: "sugar, not syrup, a healthy slug of a main spirit and a couple of dashes of bitters, stirred with ice and sprayed with citrus oil (with, of course, the option of adding a half-wheel of muddled orange to the proceedings)" The thing I don't get is this: If I make you an old-fashioned with solid sugar (granulated or what have you) thoroughly dissolved in bitters and a splash of water, then mixed with spirit, ice, twist, etc... And then I make you an old fashioned with a syrup that (in this hypothetical world) provides an identical amount of sugar, use an identical amount of bitters, and essentially make it in exactly the same way as the first old-fashioned... In a blind taste test you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. The only way you could tell the difference (and I'm talking about plain old simple syrup here, not gomme syrup or any other kind of mouthfeel-enhancing syrup) is if the sugar was insufficiently dissolved, (which I personally find somewhat repellent). So why the insistence on shunning simple syrup? Is it simply to satisfy the purist demon on one's shoulder? Furthermore, although the difference between an Old Fashioned with sugar and one with syrup is minimal, the difference between an O.F. with a muddled orange and an O.F. without is so large as to be an entirely different drink. And yet, if I understand the quote above, you think either is allowed... Orange is OK, but not simple syrup? How to reconcile these contradictions? I speak as an enthusiastic (yet confused) fan of your work, for the record.

This is anecdotal, but a friend of mine tried to make peach pit bitters and wound up with something that was extremely similar to cyanide. I believe they even had it tested and found it to toxic. I would advise the utmost caution when dealing with most stone fruit pits, as everything I've read seems to indicate you could kill yourself with it. I believe there might be some kind of processing (toasting?) that renders the cyanogens inert, but again - caution is the watchword, in my opinion.

My spiced rums usually involve some or all of these ingredients: Orange, lemon and/or grapefruit peel cinnamon stick nutmeg, freshly greated espresso beans black peppercorns szechuan pepper corns annatto seeds allspice coriander cloves cardamom plus other stuff which it's too early to remember. Anything crushable gets crushed in a mortar and pestle. I avoid buzzing them because it's a little harder to strain perfectly. Let sit for 48 - 72 hours in a reasonably decent amber rum and you're good to go.

Another favorite this fall is aquavit. I guess this is a riff on an Improved Aquavit Cocktail? Cold Comfort 1.5 oz. Linie Aquavit 1.5 oz. Rye (prefer RH100, of course) ~1 tsp. Luxardo Maraschino dash Peychaud's dash Regan's Orange black pepper-infused sambuca (rinse) Stir, serve in stemless wine glass rinsed with black pepper 'buca.

For me an Old-Fashioned differs from a Cock-Tail with the inclusion of a twist of citrus peel: a quiet admission that bartenders can't not tinker with their drinks. That's how I read the mythology, anyway.

Room temperature mixed drinks, huh? That makes me think of this: I've put a few new drinks on a menu that, I notice, seem to improve as they sit on the bartop. They're served in chilled rocks glasses and the flavors change as the drinks warm. Actually, come to think of it, I've heard that said about the Sazerac, as well. These drinks are mostly in the same vein: lots of base with a dash of this and a drop of that. Anyway, it was very interesting to me to learn that they actually improved at room temperature. So I guess I could see some scaffas being really good.

Random question about ice machines: What is a good rule of thumb about how many pounds per day will be needed when choosing an ice machine? I've got my eye on something on Craigslist but I'm not sure if it will crank out enough. And speaking of Craigslist, I've been strongly cautioned (by ice machine vendors) not to buy a used ice machine due to unreliability. Does anyone disagree/agree with this?

Enh, yeah - there's one drink with a foam, and the recipe is provided. It is 2008. But then there are other drinks where he's actually improved the recipe this time around, either aesthetically or with regard to history. Take the Vesper - the gin/vodka in Craft is flipped, something he allows for and corrects in Essential. He's had some time to revise. And the recipes are on the left-hand page and the backstory on the right, so you can easily MTFD without steeping yourself in its beautiful history and heritage etc.etc.etc.

Interesting. I was going to suggest the opposite. I find Craft to be a "lite" version of Essential. Maybe it's just me, but Essential seems to be the full package with much more content (history and such). There may be fewer overall recipes but I don't think that's such a bad thing - if my memory serves me correctly, Craft has something like ten different Bloody Mary recipes. Essential just feels more polished and up-to-date. The Craft of the Cocktail was written in 2002, versus 2008 for The Essential Cocktail. Considering how drastically cocktail culture has changed in that short span of time, I think Craft feels a little long in the tooth. Essential seems a little more classic. To me.

I've started playing around with Raynal VSOP, a french product. Doesn't seem terrible and it's hard to beat $13/btl.

My guess is that when it opens Aviary will have some spectacular stuff happening. The ideas they're playing with are embryonic; I don't get the feeling we're seeing the finished products here. That said, I agree with Sam about these videos. They feel scripted and viral advertising-y to me. And the, I dunno, self-satisfied astonishment with their own brilliance irks me. Who but us could possibly pull off something this crazy? Meh. My mind isn't blown quite yet. In sum, I am very much looking forward to checking out what they do, but these videos are a bit smug.

Been lovin' on fino sherry this fall. Makes sweetness magically unsweet. Now You Know 2 oz. Flor de Caña Gold 1.25 oz. Tio Pepe fino sherry 1 oz. Cynar .5 oz. Licor 43 3 dashes Peychaud's Stir/strain. Grapefruit coin zest. Stockholm Syndrome 2 oz. Aalborg Aquavit 1 oz. Tio Pepe .75 oz. lemon .5 oz. simple lingonberry syrup Shake/strain everything but lingonberry. Drizzle lingonberry into the drink so that it creates a fade effect. Mix it all up before drinking.

Aviation. Aviation. Aviation.

I certainly would not claim to possess a better palate, but at the risk of having two active threads referencing the same Cooking Issues post at one time, it's worth pointing out that some people claim you can store a martini in the freezer without harm.

Erik, that was my understanding too. A few days ago I read the OP, started penning an impassioned counterargument, and then decided to actually read the source blog before posting it. Glad I did. He's not necessarily saying that unskilled hacks lean on the classics because they're easy - he's just saying that some drinks are extremely sensitive to temperature and dilution and require careful timing or they will be ruined. I suspect that the category of drinks that are as finicky as his gin and tonic - which is a pretty involved creation, technically speaking - is a very small category, and is actually the exception rather than the rule. It's also worth noting that while the prep for the drink requires a great deal of special equipment (redistilling gin) and technical ability (clarifying juices) that are above and beyond what people expect from their bartenders, the actual drink itself was simply served from a bottle. Anyone could do that - the question is whether the drinker shoots it quickly enough. This example seems to speak more to temperature of cocktails than dilution. As far as his postulate addresses dilution - I feel that the ability to accurately gauge the dilution of a drink and strain at the right time will make the difference between an OK cocktail and a spectacular one. A classic cocktail might be "forgiving" of a certain margin of error in dilution, but I think there's no mistaking when someone has just nailed it.

If you can say with a straight face that I should be paying Eben Freemen every time I fat-wash or make a Jell-O shot I will be... amused, to say the least. If I have misunderstood you somehow, please correct me.