LPShanet
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Posts posted by LPShanet
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How would you describe the dress code at Degustation? Any recent must have dishes?
I concur with the above thoughts about getting a tasting menu. However, one specific dish I had on a recent visit was a cold almond soup with grapes that I thought was really special. And for me to go on about a vegetarian dish is highly unusual, as I typically insist of having some kind of animal involved with almost any dish where maximum deliciousness is required. So get that if they have it...they'll be happy to include any specific dish you're curious about in the tasting.
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Exactly. If the restaurant offered the identical food, with counter dining on bar stools and hard rock blasting out of the iPod, Allegretti would be praised as a genius.Frankly, I think the reviewers questioned its value just because they were put off by how nice (in a traditional sense) the dining room is.Completely agree with Sneak and oak's assessments, and would add that it certainly didn't help the cause that they opened with the current economic situation. Critics tend to be very hard on places they see as "fancy" or inappropriate to the times when the current ethos is otherwise. Not really fair, but that's reality. Add to all that the fact that Allegretti wasn't a high profile kind of chef, and they assume that he's charging too much relative to his prominence.
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Please rec. Japanese restaurants in Manhattan, Brooklyn, Queens for excellent Wagu/Kobe beef.
While it's not a steakhouse, the best properly prepared Kobe beef I've had in NY was at Sugiyama. He offers it as part of his kaiseki style meal.
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In Vino - 215 E. 4th St.
Peasant Wine Bar - 194 Elizabeth St.
Bacaro (same owner as Peasant) - 136 Division St.
Sorella - 95 Allen St.
Il Posto Accanto - 190 E. 2nd St.
Otto - 1 Fifth Ave. at 8th St.
Pata Negra - 345 E. 12th St (bet 1st and 2nd)
Although you might be stretching the definition a little bit, I think it's worth considering L'artusi and Dell 'anima on your list. The food is probably better than any of the above, and though the focus isn't on wine first, the food format lends itself to using them like wine bars.
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Should have put this in my wine bar post, but I travel to Italy regularly but live in Chicago. Not really many good places here that can provide a similar culinary experience to what I eat in Italy, or can just as easily make at home.
I hate loud restaurants, so have always avoided Babbo. I have liked Bellavitae in the past, but want to stretch out a little on this NY visit, and have considered Insieme. Are there others, probably smaller, chef-driven places I should consider?
Consigliatemi, per favore. Thanks.
Has anyone been to Perbacco lately? As of the last time I went, this would probably fit the bill. It may be slightly on the loud side at times, but small, cute and very inventive. It was totally chef-driven and the food was special in its employment of creative ingredients and techniques, while still staying pretty true to its roots.
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It is quite common, unfortunately.The four of us had dinner recently at this restaurant that does not seem to be on anybody's radar.Its a small place with choices from the south of france and Italy. Its good value for NYC with entrees around $30 and appetizers around $15,dessert $10,also a prix fixe menu @$39...The noise level however was quite high. Incidentally is this the case with most NYC restaurants?
It is reasonably well known. (There is a previous eG thread, with which these posts should be merged.) It received a favorable two-star review last year in the Times, and it even made the critic's list of the 10 Best New Restaurants of 2008.Overall, this restaurant is good value and I wonder why its not better known.Ironically, it seems like the biggest gripe about Allegretti in many reviews has been from those that questioned the value and found it overpriced. Which makes it quite clear how relative value is...
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It's hard to tell from the menu, but if you were to guess a dollar figure per person without drinks/wine, what would you ballpark it at, especially if you lean towards the small plates?
For example, when my husband and I dine at Momofuku Ssam Bar, we typically order 5-6 items and it's about $35-40pp before drinks.
From my experience, pricewise the restaurants are similar.
I'd say the prices are fairly similar, too. But it's pretty clear that I eat way more than Kathryn:) Gluttony gets expensive...
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Martian/American? Sounds interesting... Tell me more...
More evidence that we're still looking for a better term than "molecular gastronomy"
WD-50 is best described as modern or experimental, and Wylie Dufresne, the chef there, is one of the most prominent proponents of it. I suppose the closest UK equivalent would be Fat Duck, but they are quite different beyond their modernity. WD-50 features deconstructed and modern American food that is often inspired by foods that the chef enjoyed as a kid, in some cases low brow American classics that have been interpreted and updated to the point of being tough to recognize except as inspiration. There's a tongue in cheek (and even some actual tongue) aspect to the menu, and the place is fun as well as delicious. So the use of "Martian-American" is actually very apt. -
Point taken about the Mexican restaurants - it's just I have an American friend based here in the UK who's constantly telling anyone who'll listen that the Mexican food scene in the US is way ahead of anything we have over here, so I thought it might be worth asking.
Burgers and pizzas sound good - any specific recommendations?
And I'll check out the bars.
I totally agree with all of the recommendations made by Sneakeater. So please put in one more vote for all the places he has mentioned/endorsed, especially WD-50, Jean Georges, Kyo-Ya, Momofuku Ko (or Ssam Bar) and Corton.
One area of disagreement, though, with him and a few other the other posters: While there are other parts of the US that are way ahead of NYC in terms of authentic down and dirty Mexican food, the top "haute/modern Mex" places here are now as good as anything in the country. The idea that there is nothing Mexican-inspired here that's any good is totally outdated. However, Rosa Mexicana is not among those top places (it's barely better than a high end chain, IMO), and Centrico is a distant third at best. If you do want to have that sort of modern Mexican experience, I'd recommend trying Crema or Pampano. I've had four or five of the classic moles at Crema (poblano, verde, pipian, blanco and more), and all were totally spot on. Either Crema or Pampano on a good day would be creditable even in DF.
Also, to your original post, Soto is very good, but Megu is just expensive. Megu is a cool looking venue, and worth seeing just for how it looks, but the food isn't among very the top in the city, though it is decent (and pricey). On all matters of Japanese food, I'd trust Raji with my life.
In terms of pizza, I'm a bit shocked that no one has mentioned Una Pizza Napoletana. A pain to deal with their hours and wait times, but it's certainly up there with the top Italian style pies in the city (Motorino, Keste, Co., etc.). Maybe above them. For NY style, DiFara is arguably still the best, but a hike to get to.
One more caveat: I've taken a number of non-Americans to various barbecue places in NYC, and they tend to see them very differently than we do. Hill Country in particular has just confused most of my European friends, and they've all considered it a meal wasted, just because they didn't "get it". So be warned that it's not the kind of saucy barbecue you may have seen...it's essentially plain meat. Lovingly cooked and dry rubbed, but plain. While I don't agree that there are no worthwhile Mexican experiences in NYC, I could make a case for skipping the barbecue. If you don't skip it, make sure you ask a few questions that help you decide which style of BBQ you're likely to enjoy, as the different styles are quite different.
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Over in this topic, Fat Guy waxes rhapsodic about a pizza he recently had at Patsy's...perhaps still the sine qua non of Manhattan pizzerias.
Lombardi's is a mere shadow of its former self, overrun by the tourist hordes in Soho, though if you ask for your pizza prepared a certain way, perhaps you'll be rewarded with an excellent pie from the original (1905) coal oven - see above topic for more info about that.
The invasion of "real" pizza Napoletana has brought to NYC many new pizza joints. Keste, Co., Una Pizza Napoletana et.al. in Manhattan; others, like Motorino, in the outer boroughs (btw, looks like Motorino is applying to buy UPN, according to the community board calendar for this month). They have both their supporters and their detractors...I happen to really like that style, and find Keste quite good. Sneak loves Franny's.
I have a big soft spot for Arturo's on West Houston St. Their blazing hot coal oven runs at close to 1000 degrees, and it produces some excellent pies. Also fairly high on the tourist radar, it nonetheless is a bit of an NYC wonder. With a jazz trio often playing in the front room, snagging a seat at the bar and eating a pie there, while listening to the disgruntled regulars talk about the good ole days, is an experience that wont be replicated in any of the other pizza joints. Only open for dinner, it's really close to Pegu Club...
.Roman pizza is represented too. Of course, Jim Lahey (of Co. fame) started us all off with his pizza bianca, back when he was "just" a baker and the founder of Sullivan Street Bakery. Pala, on Allen St., has been around now for close to 3 years, and does a fine job with their take on this specialty pie.
For my money, the best "slice place," which is really what many of us grew up with, is Joe's on 6th Avenue at about W. 3rd St, on the west side of the avenue. No seating, only a few stand-up tables. Others like Vinny Vincenz on 1st. Avenue for their "grandma" slice and Artichoke on 14th St. YAMMV.
As a supplement to all the advice given, I also think it's appropriate to point out (as implied by weinoo's "YAMMV") that pizza is a form that's very susceptible to variation. This is certainly true at Joe's and Arturo's, where on a given day you might get very good pizza or fairly mediocre stuff. It's hard to determine all the factors that go into this, but human error seems to be a big part of it (both in the preparing and cooking stages). And this is also independent of the obviously variable tastes different people have in different pizza. Bottom line is that you may have to try a given place more than once to get a sample of how it performs at its best.
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Ate here a few weeks ago and have to throw in my agreement. Everything was great. Especially good among the petiscos was the ramp dish with pig's ear, apple, etc., though the razor clams and the urchin toast were both excellent. Among the apps, the standouts included the cuttlefish in coconut curry and the consomme with "ravioli" and various mushrooms. Also really enjoyed the monkfish and scallop mains, and will be back for duck rice and other animal dishes. Really one of the best new openings in NY this year. The food is serious, but the atmosphere relaxed and the service friendly and professional. When I went, it already seemed like they were running smoothly, despite their newness. Impressive visit overall.
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Not so imcomprehensible, as Sfoglia is also about 97 blocks from being in Little Italy.
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Yet, somehow, every other restaurant in the country seems to be able to handle this issue in a more transparent way.
Very good point. Let's hope this isn't the start of a trend. I think the backlash may prevent that.
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So in other words, it's a tip, except that nobody reading the notation on their check is supposed to know it's a tip.
Almost. My understanding is it's a tip, and they're expecting people will know it's a tip, even though they can't just say it's a tip for legal reasons. They put the language in there because they had to, but I'm guessing they thought people would just gloss over it. They didn't. That's what happens at this price level.
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And people who read it are supposed to know that how?
They're not. It's like a legal disclaimer, which they have to put if they ever take any portion of it for any house-related thing. It's also an accounting thing, as it affects how the restaurant pays tax.
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Thanks. I checked the on-line menu for Grand Central Oyster Bar and they do have them listed, but you are right that it's wise to call the day of. I'll try calling Pearl as well. It's definitely a Long Island summer childhood memory for me.
FWIW, I think Grand Central is more likely to have them on any given day, but Pearl is likely to be better than Grand Central if they have them.
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I will be in NYC this weekend and early next week and am looking for a fun place to go for a late lunch before I leave on Tuesday. I was thinking about Bar Boulud but have read/heard mixed reviews.
What do you all think? I don't want to drop a *ton* of cash, but it doesn't have to be dirt cheap and I am a really adventurous eater. The hotel I'm staying in is near the Javits Center because I'm going to the Fancy Food show, so if anyone knows of a cool place near there that would be great, but not a dealbreaker.
Thanks in advance!
Bar Bouloud is good, especially for charcuterie, but beware they do close at "in between" times sometimes. Not sure if this has changed, but I went at just before 3 once and they wouldn't serve me (even though they were supposedly open until 3).
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Still, I think people go totally nuts for Pastis, and while it's not bad at all, is it really deserving of the level of adulation it gets? (e.g. people salivating and saying that it's the best French restaurant in all of NYC, lines forming for hours, etc.)
I honestly haven't seen it get that response.
Everybody I know considers Pastis a tourist/B&T shitshow that they'd never go near. And I think that for tourist/B&T shitshow, it's food is remarkably good.
What you say about Pastis is totally accurate. The people giving it that response aren't "foodies". But aside from small places that can fill up on foodies alone (Ko, etc.), the ravages of extreme popularity are almost always fueled by non-foodies. And for what it's worth, the hip set lines up like crazy to go there for brunch and certain other mealtimes. These aren't foodies, but they aren't B&T either. They've just been told that it's the best French place around by other scenesters.
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To Daisy's point, I think this is really a matter of feeling appreciated for your repeat business and loyalty. And that appreciation can be shown in many ways. So in my mind, it's not a matter of "getting something for free", especially since many of the perks discussed aren't freebies, but an appreciation and recognition that in a city with so many dining options, you've chosen to return to theirs over and over.
That being said, I've been to Ssam close to 20 times, and while I'm always treated well, I don't think they've once realized that I was a repeat customer. Nonetheless, I'll be back another 20.
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The online menu at Pearl doesn't have them. I also checked Ditch Plains, which I thought would be the best bet, to no avail.
As Eatmywords posts above, it's been a long time since I've seen them on an NYC menu. Perhaps somewhere out in Sheepshead Bay or up on City Island?
Pearl offers them as a special, not a menu item, which is why I suggested calling. I've had good ones there within the last year. They reminded me favorably of summers as a kid on Cape Cod.
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I'm unconvinced that Pastis is overrated, though I'm certainly willing to hear some explanations of why. However, every cocktail or food item I've had there has been quite good, as has my service, so to me, that constitutes fair value. It's pricey, but that's because of the location and ambiance..
FWIW, I agree with this.
In fact, Pastis would be at the head of my list of "Restaurants That Don't Need To Be Good But Nevertheless Are."
I think it speaks volumes for Keith McNally's integrity that he maintains the quality he does at a restaurant that would be a cash cow even if it served nothing but steaming plates of pigeon shit.
I think a lot of people would have put Balthazar even higher on that "better than they need to be" list, and I've always liked the food (and experience) there much better than at Pastis.
There are those who say he tried the latter (pigeon shit) approach at Morandi without success
Still, I think people go totally nuts for Pastis, and while it's not bad at all, is it really deserving of the level of adulation it gets? (e.g. people salivating and saying that it's the best French restaurant in all of NYC, lines forming for hours, etc.) The thread is about the places being overvalued, so even if it's pretty good it can still be overvalued. I suppose I'm getting into pretty subjective territory, though. -
MEGU
Tao, defo!!
La esquina. What a clip joint! They take reservations and make you wait 2 hours, then overcharge you.
I don't think Cookshop deserves to be on this list. It's not in the same category in price as a lot of the others.
To clarify something that appeared in the companion post (Undervalued restaurants), I'm pretty sure the thread was introduced to list restaurants that are overrated, not overpriced. The term "overvalued" is a bit confusing in that regard, but I'm pretty sure the original intention was to state that these places are overvalued in the sense of having huge popularity, and being liked/appreciated too much for their level of quality (not whether they're overpriced or not). To that end, those of us who mentioned Cookshop are referring to the food being nothing special despite all the early hype it got. I'd be interested to hear how those who have dealt with La Esquina felt about the food. I actually thought the food was its one redeeming quality. Not great, but decent...but the overall effect of the place can be insufferable.
N.B. I wrote this before noticing that Sneak had already cleared this up. But laziness took over and I'm leaving it intact under the guise of further clarification:)
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Cookshop
Telepan
Shake Shack USQ
Devi
Keen's
Sushi of Gari UWS
Neo Sushi
La Esquina
Del Posto
Artisinal
Esca
Shun Lee
Del Posto is a great example. Forgot that one on my list...maybe since people don't talk about it as much any more. Shake Shack has a USQ location??
Degustation
in New York: Dining
Posted
Txacoli goes really well with much of their food. One of the great things about txacoli is that its acidity makes it pairable with a huge range of flavors. That's one of the reasons that it's far and away the most popular drink at the tapas/pintxos bars of Spain's Basque region, which incidentally are part of the inspiration for Degustation in the first place.