Mao

hell, I started the whole thread of damnation, and no one ever treats me like the Royal Prince. Maybe I should stop using this obfuscuting pseudonym, and it will result in better meals. We appear all to be so famous here. Blush

Thanks for the input. Is there a bar area where one person could eat? And here is a question you probably can't answer, but I will throw it our there anyway: does anyone can know if one person can do the tasting menu?

The Penang that I have always gone to is near my father's on 1st and 66th. Was not aware that they are a chain until you mentioned it. I may try Baba this weekend though. This whole thread has been kind of an education as to what exists within the bounds of Malaysian food in NYC.

One of the reasons I actually asked is that I think I had given up on Malaysian food after multiple bad experiences with Penang. Soits interesting and excellent to know its out there.

Admin: The active discussion thread for Blue Hill may be found here. Suggestions of what to order? Seem to be a decent population of people on this board who eat there with some conviction and pleasure. Along with Ilo and Veritas (been once) the places I keep meaning to go to, but have yet to make the trip.

Pan. Thank you so much for all that detail. I learned a lot and am definately heading to Queens to check the place out in the next few weeks. I have spent a lot of time in East Asia, though little in SE Asia. What were you doing over there? Also, are there any other Malaysian focused places you would recommend in Manhattan or other boroughs in addition?

I am not going to jump up and defend the current state of Sugiyama. I am frankly a little worried about what used to be one of my favorite restaurants. My last two trips over the last 4 months have not been on the same level as any of the meals I had last year; and I am worried that lack of business is forcing the place to cut back on the quality of ingredients. That said, the Sietsema piece spends as much time socially dissecting a group of overly scripted caricature patrons (I have yet to encounter anyone remotely like this on multiple trips to the place) as it does describing his ONE meal at the restaurant. Propaganda in the service of class warfare and the portrayal of a decadent and non discriminating moneyed class had its role in cold war propaganda films about the decadent West, but strikes me as slightly heavy-handed and disingenuous in contemporary food criticism. As Steven suggests, Sietsema seems motivated by a quest for a myth of authenticity in which "true" food is the product of the toil of noble and impoverished immigrant masses, a vision that simply banishes the possibility that food above a certain price level is anything but supreme artifice by and for the artificial.

My sister and I ended up trying the tasting menu for 2, which if you follow Tommy's link below, is one of the ways of working one's way through the myriad dishes available. We also did the accompanying wine tasting. Mogsob, you were spot on about the Lobster in Muscat de Beaumes de Venise. Absolutely fabulous. I thought the rest of the meal was also very, very good. There were no imperfections and the combinations of ingredients was clever, worked and was often interesting. Still, for me the cooking lacked something in the way of soul and risktaking. I am the devil who started the Craft is dull thread, and I think a bit of that criticism, though much less so, applies here too. I realized I walked away from the meal with food memories of the lobster only, and a whole bunch of nitpicks. Its probably just my mood, so you will excuse me. The kitchen seemed to me to be producing food that was once but no longer experimental--March falls into my restaurants in a state of being, not becoming, catagory, based soley on ( I am sure) an erroneous 1st impression. I ate at Bouley midweek, and in the inevitable comparison that comes with close proximity in time, March fares rather poorly, despite the fact that Bouley botched 2 out of 4 dishes I ate: the other 2 he pulled off--the Phyllo crusted shrimp and then the lamb--were so memorably good and passionate, yet infused that my jaw dropped. With the exception of the lobster, there was nothing else I ate that startled me or made me wonder how the kitchen did that at March. Everything I ate felt like it had come from a cookbook of years past, and despite the freshness of ingredients lacked vitality. Desserts were very competent, but again no jaw drop vs midweek, where Bouley's current dessert form is unearthly. Maybe its not fair to compare the two, but it was inevitable for me, since the meals were so back to back. I thought the space was great and indeed very private. The wine tasting course was also superb. One riesling was knock your socks off good. Our server was also very good, though a bit pushy. We had just ordered the wine and two person tasting menu which was 140 a person. At which point the server suggested that we also order these 2 other tastings with lobster and black truffles. These are $20 each and separate from the tasting menu. I felt these were being unnecessarily pushed upon me, however. I think I overreacted a bit, because I was dubious, and having just eaten my way through Paris during black truffle season, I asked him why they were offering these black truffle centered bites when black truffles' season is over. I suppose it was an aggresive question in response to an aggresive push to order two items that struck me as expensive and of dubious value. His presponse was that they were black truffles, which were good any time. We ordered them anyway, and they were OK. I probably should have just passed. Anyway, I will go back and try again sometime. I loved the space, and think the kicthen is definately worth another try. The kicthen has a lot of skill, maybe next time it will have more of the passion I saw in the lobster.

Interesting. Thanks Pan. Does anyone know anything about Malaysian food? How distinct is it as a cuisine? My sense, based on severely limited knowledge, is that it is not that distinguishable from Indonesian food and that it is the general synchretic product of Chinese and Indian cuisines that dominate SE Asia, though I wonder if its as self-contained and unique as Vietnamese or Thai.

when you the selections aren't limited to appets and main courses, what do you mean exactly? Is the menu broken down like Craft?

Have never been. Am going with my sisters for sibling meal. Are there things people would steer me toward?

:wow: Gee, I post once. The thread dies sans response. I have jury duty and the thread explodes behind my back. There are a slew of random questions, so I will answer by person, in no particular order. jjijj1: Basics about me. White caucasian male who speaks a bit of Japanese (studied for 4 years at the college level) and can communicate about basic topics, including politics. Can read newspaper slowly. Have spent some time in Japan, including eating there, mostly in Kyoto/Osaka area. I adore Japanese food, and have enough experience eating here and over there to know what most things should at least taste like. I eat out at a lot of Japanese places in NYC, and while I am no expert, I know as much about most of the Japanese restauarants in NYC as the Japanese expats I meet at the sushi or kaiseki bar. I am no authority, but feel fairly comfortable that my opinions are not prismed through an overly romantic lens, are honest and pretty well informed. I know of no reliable source about Japanese food in NYC other than this and the other nameless board. If you are looking for the Robert Parker of Japanese food in NYC, then I don't think you will find anyone. On the whole, Akiko and I have fairly strong and similar opinions, though we have never met. Akiko: Welcome here from the other board. To my knowledge, there are 4 places that consciously offer a Kaiseki menu in NYC: Sugiyama, Nadaman, Kai and Hatsuhana (the latter displays it prominantly in their menu but does not focus on kaiseki like the others). I have eaten at every one except Nadaman in the last month, and I have had relatively recent "off" experiences at Sugiyama and Hatsuhana, unfortunately. Please let me know if you go to Sugiyama, what your impressions are. I have had historically wonderful meals there, but get the sense that they are not going all out for the best ingredients like they have in the past. I hope I am wrong and that the night I went was just an evening when things were off, as it would be ashame to lose what is one of my favorite restuarants in NYC. Cabrales: I had sake in each case. I find the quality of the sake is completely random though. I prefer some brands to others, but a lot of its luck as to how fresh the sake they have on hand is. I have had the same bottle at Sugiyama, and could tell it was fresh and recently purchased one time The next time I went back and ordered the same, only to find it tasted stale. As for wine, I don't find that any place has a great or even interesting collection. Its typically the usual assortment of Cali chard. You might want to opt for the BYO option, though call ahead. I am not a wine expert but have had superb Mersaualt's with kaiseki meals, and it really clicked. On an unrelated note, i made it over to Bouley again on Weds, and had a few of his "on form" dishes. To die for desserts too. Question for everyone else: Did anyone go to Sono (the French japanese fusion place) before it closed its doors? How was it? And has anyone else been to Aki and think its as wonderful as I do? Jamaican Japanese fusion anyone?

I went to Kai for the 1st time last night and my overall impression was: bland. The wonderful textural aspects of a great Japanese meal were present, but only at the start of the meal. A couple of things were brilliant, but most of the meal was unremarkable. Not surprisingly, the tea was superb--there is a tea store downstairs and that a Japanese tea company owns the restaurant. My favorite places for kaiseki in the city remain in this order: Sugiyama, Hatsuhana, Kai and Nadaman Hakubai. Donguri has an omakase offer, but its not kaiseki by name. The highlights included the first course, which consisted of about 5 to 6 little tastings of mostly seasonal vegetables. The most memorable of these was a gelatin tomato cake with caviar. This was art. Embedded within the gooey cake taste was just about every smell and nuance of tomato that I have in my memory banks. One of those truly memorable food moments in life where your entire experience with tomatoes passes across your tongue. There was also some home-smoked duck that was superlative. The other highlight was the sea bass, which was cooked in a helmet of sea salt and tea and accompanied by a yuzu? sauce (the smoky flavor that typically is an ingredient in Japanese clear broth soup) and mushrooms. Sea bass should never be served any other way again. It was very delicate, fleshy and supremely smoky odiferousness. Other items in the meal were a lily bulb soup that tasted remarkably like Western potato soup, and while fragrant, really had nothing going for it beyond this initial whiff. I have had excellent lily bulb mouthfulls before at Sugiyama, so this was disappointing. Sashimi was OK-kampachi, giant clam and one other forgotten item. Soba, which are made on premises, were under-brothed and not particularly special (Sobaya and Honmura An have much better soba). The final main course of steak with various sautéed veggies was one of the blander versions of this combo I can remember. There was one other dish with mushrooms and another with bamboo that left no impression. Desserts were a little piece of slightly dry chocolate cake (intentionally so) and one or two more traditionally Japanese-like desserts with sweet beans/rice. The hoji cha (burnt rice tea) that went with this was excellent. So overall probably worth the trip for those one or two memorable moments, but a surprisingly bland and atextural meal to my mind. Nao Sugiyama has little to fear from the upstart.

I was there Friday night. I had one of the better meals of my life there about a month ago with my brother in law. Friday was, unfortunately, not quite in the same league, though a couple of the dishes were as good. I have heard that the restaurant is rather erratic, so I guess one just has to keep going, and hope that it is an "on" night like the one I experienced before. Sounds like you hit it right the next day Beachfan. I had the Rouget in Lobster-saffron broth and Tahihian vanilla, and should have had the Phyllo crusted shrimp instead perhaps. OK, but not memorable. I also had the Black Bass in Scallop Crust. Boy was that good. So much good stuff going on in the mouth. One of the staff seem to recognize me from the last trip and came over and shook my hand, at which point a black cod dish appeared "compliments of the chef". I think the waitstaff had me confused with Grimes at this point as the charm factor went up as well. The cod was superb, though I fail to recollect critical indredients. Final dish was Seattle, Washington Kobe Beef with Asian Celery Puree and Black Truffle Horseradish sauce. This was the one poor dish of the evening. I had the Maine lobster with fava beans and Port Wine sauce on last trip, as well as Lamb with Spring Vegetables and zuchini mint sauce (or rather someone eating with me had ordered this) and both were devastating, but I did not want to repeat. Foolish me. This came out tasting slightly soggy. Kobe beef is best served minimally altered (At Nao Sugiyama's hands), and the meat was a kind of flacid, watery non event. Daring, but perhaps too clever by a third. Next orange mellon soup with apricot, yoghurt and rasberry sorbets and passion mango ravioli. Very good, but not devastatingly wonderful like last trip. Dessert: Hot Valrhona Chocalate Souffle with Armaganc, and various icre creams and sorbets. Yummy. I think I am going to take a few weeks off before I repeat so the menu can chg, but on a good night there is no place in NYC I would rather eat.

I just ate at the tavern at GT tonight and they are doing the same thing. At least for certain bottles of water. We were offered Evian up front at reduced cost and accepted. I wonder if further inquiries into other brands would have yielded similar results. But they were up front about how they were doing this because of the water shortage. As an unrelated question, how often do the desserts at the tavern change? I ate there about about 6 weeks ago and they seemed almost identical. Two desserts, in particular, involving rubharb and another with apple seemed terribly autumny to me. Then again GT always gives me this fall season vibe no matter what time of year it is.

Both this and the orginal are very good, and darn cheap. On a good night with enough people so that many dishes can be ordered, there are few better meals for the money in my book within Manhattan's borders. Of course I do have a Vietnamese bias when it comes to inexpensive food. I think the flavor and textural complexity of good pho and noodles is one of my favorite things to eat.

For me, as shallow as it sounds, my willingness to cut a restaurant slack really depends upon word of mouth and reputation. If enough people (whom I respect) are willing to proffer praise, I will give a joint multiple tries. There are few places that despite repeated attempts at a good meal that I will give up on. So far, there is really only one. In 3 visits, I have yet to have a very good meal at Jean Georges, and frankly, I think 3 times is enough sample size if you are doing the tasting menu. I have heard very good things about the man from people who work in the industry. I have heard praise from many corners, but I have yet to have a good meal there. There is no doubt that the ingredients are cleverly put together, and that the lobster has never been more brilliantly treated in my experience, but what age are the ingredients, and everything else besides lobster has been truly disappointing. Others, say the Four Seasons, one visit was enough o know that enough is enough.

Bitch. Moan. Just thank your lucky stars you don't reside in CT or PA. In PA one has to buy liquor in State stores, which can carry severely limited selections of many wines. In CT, every liquor store closes at 8 pm on weekdays and isn't open Sunday. In certain areas of NJ (Princeton) liquor licences can cost 250-300k for a restaurant, because of artifically curtailed supply. That's not to say that all the laws aren't absurd, but NYC seems to me among the most liberal and least impacted areas by archaic and puritancial legislation of centuries past.

I have no problem going to the West side. hell, I eat in hell's kitchen at Grand Szechuan Intl and Esca with some regularity. Its the culinary desert above 66th St that I am loathe to wander into for fear of encountering a bad meal. Are there any good restuarants on the UWS?

Went for first time yesterday and had crispy catfish salad, pork leg soup and Jungle curry chicken. I guess expectations play a large roll in food and eating, but I must say that apart from the catfish salad, which was excellent, the rest of the meal did not come close to replicating the excellence of the food I ate while in Thailand. It was rather underwhelming. Could have been an off day, but the curry in particular was watery and the chicken plastic like. I will go back again, but probably with more people so I can try a greater number of dishes, and get more sample size. Still will confexss disappointment.

Perhaps more chefs should be chastised in public forums, and criticism and forced into a defensive posture where he feels he has something to prove. Perhaps it was just that it was just one of those evenings when Bouley was on. But whatever the reason, I can only say that I am extremely happy theat David Bouley resides in lower Manhattan and has a restaurant. I went out with two writers last night and showed up relatively late. When we left at 1:30 in the morning, both the writers were oozing all the words that food critics and writers aren’t suppose to use…”sublime,” “transcendental”, “the best meal of my life,” “I didn’t know food could be this good and so transformative” and on and on. I can’t honestly say that this was the best meal I have ever eaten. I think that honor goes to a recent meal at Le Grand Vefour in Paris, but this was pretty damn close. Three people is the perfect number to try everything on the tasting menu. There are a la carte items now available….but why bother when the tasting menu is this good. I could spout more superlatives, and even describe the meal, yet somehow words would be a waste. I am heading back as soon as possible before Bouley loses the cooking focus and no longer feels he has something to prove.

Now take out, truly a brilliant suggestion, Fat guy. I was contemplating going to Veritas too in order to round out the weekend, having not been there yet (along with Sripraphai), but all that take out may crowd it out. I suppose I could still bring the take out to work Monday or Tuesday and hit Veritas Sunday night. I wonder if slightly old Thai food has the same comfort food qualities that 2 day old cold pizza or hamburgers do for me. The latter two foods, I will admit are in pretty poor taste, but sometimes I enjoy reliving my college days.

This is the otehr place aI am heading to this weekend besides Bouley. I will definately order catfish. Isn't there also a ungle curry dish that is suppose to be rather delectable? Also, is the consensus that you need to request that your food be served "hot" or it will be too mild?

I am going Saturday night, will let you know if as memorable as pre 9/11.

I am too lazy to go thru 7 PAGES of one liners. can someone give me the quick and dirty version: 1) where? 2) when?