Araignee

[balex]

I had a very nice bit of beef at a Lyonnais restaurant in Geneva which was called "araignee" which was described as like onglet but better. Does anyone know what this is in English? Literal translation 'spider'.

Very good flavour, slightly chewy, and an unusual shape. Served and cooked in the same way as bavette or onglet but thicker.

Edited September 11, 2004 by balex (log)

[carswell]

Am a bit vague on this but I believe it's one of the smaller muscles that make up the round or rump. A similar and nearby cut would be the pear-shaped muscle called, logically enough, the poire. Unlikely that there's a common American or British term for it. I'll be dropping by my (French) butcher's shop this afternoon and will see if he can elucidate. In the meantime, for a cross section of the round, check out the Canadian Food Inspection Agency's Meat Cuts Manual – Beef.

Edited September 11, 2004 by carswell (log)

[carswell]

Hope I've got this straight. Unfortunately, my butcher didn't have a hindquarter ready to carve up, so we made do with a printout of the CFIA charts I linked to earlier. Referring to the illustration for 5.3.1 Rump, the araignée comes from the top front of the shaded area, the area between the pelvis and the sacrum/tail. It's a ball of muscle located on the inside, i.e. closer to the tail bone; on the outside is the fausse araignée. Writing this, I realize I'm not clear whether each hindquarter has an araignée or there's only one between them. (For what it's worth, an online glossary identifies the muscle as obturatorius internus; I've not been able to determine the accuracy of that claim.) French butchers call the cut a 'spider" because of an associated bundle of nerves that resembles an arachnid.

Like the onglet (hanger steak), the araignée is sometimes referred to as a butcher's cut, as butchers would set it aside for themselves or the occasional knowing customer. As often as not, however, these cuts would end up being ground or even used for dog food. It's a different story these days, and the law of supply and demand means they can no longer be considered budget cuts.

Will continue looking for a more detailed explanation and a diagram. The more I search, however, the more I'm convinced some university ought to establish a chair of comparative butchery.

Edited September 12, 2004 by carswell (log)

[balex]

Hope I've got this straight. Unfortunately, my butcher didn't have a hindquarter ready to carve up, so we made do with a printout of the CFIA charts I linked to earlier. Referring to the illustration for 5.3.1 Rump, the araignée comes from the top front of the shaded area, the area between the pelvis and the sacrum/tail. It's a ball of muscle located on the inside, i.e. closer to the tail bone; on the outside is the fausse araignée. Writing this, I realize I'm not clear whether each hindquarter has an araignée or there's only one between them. (For what it's worth, an online glossary identifies the muscle as obturatorius internus; I've not been able to determine the accuracy of that claim.) French butchers call the cut a 'spider" because of an associated bundle of nerves that resembles an arachnid.

Like the onglet (hanger steak), the araignée is sometimes referred to as a butcher's cut, as butchers would set it aside for themselves or the occasional knowing customer. As often as not, however, these cuts would end up being ground or even used for dog food. It's a different story these days, and the law of supply and demand means they can no longer be considered budget cuts.

Will continue looking for a more detailed explanation and a diagram. The more I search, however, the more I'm convinced some university ought to establish a chair of comparative butchery.

←

I think there are the poire the araignee and also the 'merlan' but I have no clue where they all are. Worth searching it out though.

I guess we could use the latin terms for those cuts that follow natural anatomical divisions -- it's a bit geeky but hey -- this is eGullet so we are geeks.

[wesza]

This cut if often known as the, "Diaphragm" , "Romanian Tenderloin", "Skirt Steak" and various other regional names.

It's popularity increased since it often considered the best cut of beef for, "Fajitas" but it has even become more popular since many beef eaters feel that it tastes better then the so called, "Hanging Tender", "Hanger Steak" or, "Onglet" and makes great Grilled Steak Sandwiches.

For many years the Diaphragm, Flank and Hanger Steaks were the mainstay of beef used in Asian Cooking and the Mexican community due to taste, character and more important price but now that's no longer the case.

They are most often now sold skinned in Meat Displays or Rolled Up and tied in most parts of the states.

I still enjoy them seasoned with chopped garlic, cracked black pepper and quickly seared over hot coals as a tasty, chewy real Beef flavored Steak.

Irwin

[carswell]

This cut if often known as the, "Diaphragm" , "Romanian Tenderloin", "Skirt Steak" and various other regional names.

It's popularity increased since it often considered the best cut of beef for, "Fajitas" but it has even become more popular since many beef eaters feel that it tastes better then the so called, "Hanging Tender", "Hanger Steak" or, "Onglet" and makes great Grilled Steak Sandwiches.

←

Not to be disputatious, but the araignée is not the same cut as the skirt (hampe in French).

You're right that skirt steaks are part of the diaphragm. So are hanger steaks. Here are the skirt and back steak (aka hanger steak) definitions from the CFIA site: "Skirt [hampe, click on the Français link at the top of the page to display the French-language analogue]: thin muscular part of the diaphragm adjacent to the ribs. Back steak [onglet]: thick muscular part of the diaphragm adjacent to the spinal column."

As my butcher said — and as the few websites that discuss it indicate — the araignée comes from the upper rump/round, above the pelvis and behind the diaphragm. It's a different shape from the skirt and is associated with another cut, the fausse araignée (there's no such thing as a fausse hampe or false skirt). Also, the Latin names of the muscles are different: hampe/skirt is diaphragma (pars costalis sternalis); onglet/hanger is diaphragma (crus dextrum sinistrum); araignée is obturatorius internus; and fausse araignée is obturatorius externus. (See, for example, the United Nations Interpretation Service's French-English-Latin Meat Glossary).

As I said above, I hope to find a diagram of the various cuts or, failing that, drop by my butcher's with a digicam some day when he can show us the cuts in situ.

Edited September 12, 2004 by carswell (log)

[wesza]

carswell:

When the Hindquarter is separated from the Forequarter the "Diaphragm" is split when butchered between the quarters.

In some regions of the world this is often called "Thin Skirt" from the Forequarter and "Thick Skirt" from the Hindquarter. There are other places that will remove the Whole Diaphragm or Skirt from the Split Carcass before breaking the Beef into Quarters but this varies to some degree according to culture, traditions or local preferences. It wasn't to long ago that most hindquarter "Diaphragm or Skirt" was merchandised as "Ground Sirloin" that was some of the tastiest Ground Beef sold in many Retail Markets, but it's rarely merchandised that way any longer.

For a long time the "Steak Sandwiches" featured by various Luncheonettes and Fast Food Restaurants as well as some moderate priced Steakhouses was made from 'Thick Skirt or Diaphragm" Skinned, Cut into Portion size anywhere from 3 to 8 ounces then Run thru the "Steak Cuber" to flatten and tenderize the Beef that was layered, separated by Butcher Paper and Grilled , Broiled or even Pan Fried to order as, Steak Sandwich or Club Steak or Braised as "Swiss Steak".

Now most Markets cut these items from, "Top Round", "Eye Round" or "Knuckle" known as "Sirloin Tip", some Steak Restaurants use the, "Bottom Sirloin" Known as "Triangle Tips" as well.

It was rarely available in Retail Meat Markets as most Purveyors ordered the Beef Quarters without the Skirt or Hanging Tender included. It was left out officially starting when we published the Original USDA Meat Guides for Primal and Boxed Meat Cuts by numeric designation.

In retrospect after reading the original post I feel that the cut of beef referred to is sometimes called the , "Ball Steak", cut from where the Knuckle breaks from the Ball Joint. It is sometimes featured trimmed portioned, shaped and wrapped with Bacon as a moderate priced "Fillet Steak" that customers very frequently assume to be due to it's appearance as "Fillet Mignon". It also makes delicious Sandwich Steaks when pounded between 2 pieces or Plastic or Wax Paper to make it a equal thickness for cooking quickly.

Irwin

Not to be disputatious, but the araignée is not the same cut as the skirt (hampe in French).

You're right that skirt steaks are part of the diaphragm. So are hanger steaks. Here are the skirt and back steak (aka hanger steak) definitions from the CFIA site: "Skirt [hampe, click on the Français link at the top of the page to display the French-language analogue]: thin muscular part of the diaphragm adjacent to the ribs. Back steak [onglet]: thick muscular part of the diaphragm adjacent to the spinal column."

As my butcher said — and as the few websites that discuss it indicate — the araignée comes from the upper rump/round, above the pelvis and behind the diaphragm. It's a different shape from the skirt and is associated with another cut, the fausse araignée (there's no such thing as a fausse hampe or false skirt). Also, the Latin names of the muscles are different: hampe/skirt is diaphragma (pars costalis sternalis); onglet/hanger is diaphragma (crus dextrum sinistrum); araignée is obturatorius internus; and fausse araignée is obturatorius externus. (See, for example, the United Nations Interpretation Service's French-English-Latin Meat Glossary).

As I said above, I hope to find a diagram of the various cuts or, failing that, drop by my butcher's with a digicam some day when he can show us the cuts in situ.

←

Edited September 13, 2004 by wesza (log)

[balex]

It's quite possible that the usage of 'skirt' is less specific than the French terms that refer to the same bits. But this thing was much more like onglet (which in North America is called 'hangar' steak, I think?) than bavette (which is 'skirt'?)

[carswell]

It's quite possible that the usage of 'skirt' is less specific than the French terms that refer to the same bits.  But this thing was much more like onglet (which in North America is called 'hangar' steak, I think?) than bavette (which is 'skirt'?)

←

No, bavette is flank steak. Hampe and onglet are skirt and hanger respectively. And in all three cases, the French and American terms refer to more or less identical cuts because, for once, the American cuts are individual muscles, like French cuts, and not cross-sections.

Cross-cultural comparisons are a maze of complication as the systems of the two countries are entirely different: the French cut meat following muscle separations, while American butchers usually cut across the grain. Identification is made more confusing as different regions in each country use different names for the same cuts.

–Mastering the Art of French Cooking, Volume 1