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Uurrrrm! You've got me there!

Craig, Totally agree with you that there is no set pattern. My father has some 19th century Bordeaux and when we very occassionaly have a bottle we do not bother decanting it. It is lovely for 5 minutes before the air gets to it and kills it. However I was talking to a wine journalist some years back who was given 2 bottles of 19thC wine (I think it could have been Latour) and the wine's owner told him to decant it the day before. The journo didn't believe that this was the best course of action so decanted 1 of the bottles the day before and the other an hour or two before drinking. Lo and behold the one decanted the day before was by far the better. I had a Haut Brion 1979 the other day, which when decanted 2 hours before dinner really did not show well. We had it for lunch the next day and it was showing much more rounded (albeit it is a tired wine). One of the better wines that I sell is a 2000 & 2001 Vin de Table from Domaine La Bouissiere (really it is declassified Gigondas with some merlot in as well as VDQS Grenache). Both vintages improve in the decanter over 3 days but to be honest it is no better than leaving it in the bottle for 3 days. Out of interest why/how did decanting come about. Was it primarily to aerate the wine or was it just to take it off it's sediment? Or is it even more simple and that in days gone by one had a barrel and just drew off a decanter of what was needed.

Now I'm no chemist but I am not sure that alcohol determins viscosity. I think that glycerol does. The Bordeaux 1st growths tend to have higher levels than others (at about 10g/l) while your typical good cru bourgeois will have 5 or 6. Of course, I could and prbably am wrong!!

Being a traditional Englishman, vintage port is best served with cheese and coffee and continue drinking it by itself once dinner is finished. Never with desert.

Beind pedantic, Roc de Cambes is not a Cru Bourgeois as it comes from Bourges. I have had it a few times and must say that my palate doesn't agree with a lot of others when it comes to this one. Also I seem to remember that it is very expensive.

When I tasted them in the cask, I thought that alot/most of them were over extracted and overoaked and made (with no disrespect meant) for the American market/taste. No doubt that over time these aspects will mellow out but will leave a wine which is not as charming as it might be. I think that in the past this forum has commented that Bordeaux has rather lost its identity by making wines that appeal to one sector of the market rather than making a true Bordeaux. Am I playing devil's advocate? Maybe a little but not about the over working of the wines. It would be interesting to see Craig's view on things as we all have different tastes.

2000 Casa de la Ermita, Oak aged from Jumilla. UK price inclusive of all our extorninate taxes about $10. Think that Parker gave it 90. Big but a little one dimensional.

As a bigger than average wine drinker, I must say that Burgundy doesn't often feature on my table. Having said that, in the past month I have had 3 bottles. 1 was corked, 1 was a 1986 that my dad had and was dead and the other was a white (96 Corton Charl, Bonneau du Martray that was fantastic). Speaking from a personal perspective, I generally do not drink much white and if I have to i will choose Loire/Alsace/Burgundy. My current favourite is a simple Bourgogne Blanc by Michel Bouzereau. As for the red stuff, I do like it and get a lot of enjoyment from them as each bottle is a surprise (increased due to my knowledge being a bit lacking) opposed to Bordeaux where what you get is much more obvious. If I had to choose a Pinot to have everyday, I think that I might well choose something like the Isabelle Estate from NZ

Yes Phelan Segur does seem to have out priced itself. In the UK you can pick up the 2000 for about $32 inc taxes and Duty. I remember buying a case of 1990 in Leclerc (a French supermarket) for about 50FF a bottle (in 1992/3) and I bought a bottle or two of the 1959 for 300FF a bottle. Some of the CBs are the most guilty of them all when it comes to price increases. Something like Sociando Mallet is utterly overpriced IMHO and my broker in Bordeaux offered the 2000 vintage to me at €40 a bottle. Having said that the French and their 2000 prices seem to have gone way way way way over the top.

Craig, thanks for the info about superieur. Always can rely on you!! Some of my preferred CBs not mentioned are Phelan Segur Angludet Gloria Haut Marbuzet Liversan Meyney Ormes de Pez Beau Site Bernadotte Moulin Riche (2nd wine of Poyferre - how many 2nd wines of GCCs are CBs?)

So Americans are concerned by their waist lines!!! :º) But seriously, if they are concerned by the calorific content, surely it is better to have one bottle of beer that tastes great rather than 3 or 4 that don't.

Having occaisionally read the Wine Spectator (for business reasons) do any wines from California (or for that matter anywhere else in the US) ever get less than 90 points? A little tounge in cheek but US wines never seem to score badly.

I don't really get the point of these light/ultra beers that the US is seemingly so keen on. Sure we get some weaker beers in the UK, but except from some bitters at about 3.5-4%, I do not know anyone who drinks them. Could someone enlighten me as to why they exist?

and why would anyone do that? In the UK there ad campaign was "the strong beer with no after taste". Personally if I am going to have a drink, I like tobe able to taste it for a while once it has past my tongue!

Think that NT Bitter (brewed in Darwin, Australia) stands out pretty well in my memory. Was years ago when I had it but tasted of salt! Apart from that some of those fruit beers the French/Belgians like so much make me feel sick but then I don't classify them as beer.

I tend to agree with you BUT... as opposed to the Grand Cru classification of the Medoc, which has no room for change, the Bourgeois and St. Emilion get re-evaluated every so often, although I presume that the local politics has a lot to do with who gets promoted or relegated

I looked at the link and have to disagree with it. Yes there are 3 categories but I am sure they are; Cru Bourgeois Cru Grand Bourgeois Cru Grand Bourgeois Exceptionel Not sure where they get the superieur bit from.

Craig, Agree 100%. And then there is the question of if you are paying top dollar for an imitation champagne, is there any point buying it? I am not totally sure how it all works and who does what, but the price of a kg of grapes is set by some body and this sets the price. There are 110 houses and 11000 growers. The growers demand higher and higher prices and this is what sets the high prices.

I agree that it comes down to the storage conditions. One of my clients has a lot of Taylors 1963 bottled by Tanners and it really isn't very nice but I know someone else who has some from the same stock and it is vastly different. I always thought that as the wine was fortified it was more robust and shipping it and bottling would not make any differnece. Anyway Port was never originally bottled in Portugal - as I am sure you know, a bit of brandy was added to the red wine of the area so that it could be shipped to England for bottling as we had in the late 1600s declared war on France and stopped importing their wines. As an aside, French wines were often bottled away from the chateau. In particualr Bordeaux was often bottled by the merchant that sold it and very often it was of a better quality as the attitudes to hygien differed.

I am glad that all the bottles were drinking well. It seems that here in the UK many winos (probably including myself) keep our wine for too long before drinking. Of course I am generalising and also applying this to red Bordeaux. I quite often get served wines going back to 1959 and I can honestly say that most of the wines before 1982 seem to have lost a lot of their fruit. I suppose a certain amount of it is that French wines are now made to drink relatively early on. I will confess to not knowing a huge amount about US wines but I presume that in general they are made in a similar way. Also one of my favourite wines from the US is the Ridge Zin (both Geyserville and Lyton S). Does anyone have any experience with how these age? I was always led to believe that Zin should be drunk relatively young but....

It is illegal to plant Pinot Noir in Bordeaux so NEVER contain Pinot Noir

I think that this is a slight exaggeration and if you compare prices to say the 1995 they are still quite a lot more expensive. The 1996 vintage went up 15% because the Franc "devalued" by 15%. The 1997 was a complete joke with the prices and taught the French a lesson. I can't remember what happened to the 1998 but think that it was a similar price to the 1997. The 1999 was a little more expensive as people needed to buy this to get their allocation of 2000, which was a complete joke price wise but I suppose it comes down to supply and demand. 2001 was again stupidly over-priced, so the 2002 coming down by 10-30% from the prices over the past 2 years really is quite meaningless.

Just found some info and that there is a production level of about 3000 cases (I am presuming that this is cases of 12 but stand to be corrected) Therefore each case produced has $83 on it for the winemaker (which IMO is crazy) Also the winery cost $9m, which spread over 10 years adds another $300 per case (which IMO is crazy)

OK she is a US wine diety and sits at the right hand of Bacchus. I will confess to not knowing much about the production levels at Bryant but know that the CS makes about 1000 cases. I can't find any other wines that it makes but presumes that it must - can someone let me know, otherwise it means that the first $250 per case goes in winemaker's wages and that is before the proprietor gets his bit, as well as the costs involved in vineyard management and bottling etc. If this is the case then it seems a little but uneconmic to employ someone (however good) at this level - afterall looking after 1000 cases is hardly a full time job!

Trusted sources at auction??? And where do they get there stocks from? Presumably from people who have stored the wine in bad conditions as well as those that are kept in good conditions. I would never consider buying really expensive wine from auction as the providence is not always as easy and straight forward as is declaredn (if declared at all).