lostmyshape

funny you should mention this... my aunt served a mixed fruit cup topped with apple mint syrup this weekend which was tasty. i was curious about different types of mint and wondered if apple mint could be used in drinks. i guess that they could. the taste was only very slightly "apple-y" and had a mild mint flavor. however, like eje said, bruising the leaf caused a pronounced "vegetal" flavor (grassy) with quite a bit of bitterness. i should have take some home to test, but forgot at the end of the day. if i were using this in a drink, i would only very slightly press and not muddle or shake. maybe even simply try to infuse over a long time without bruising the leaf. i love, love, love peppermint, but have only ever used spearmint in drinks... i'm not even sure why. weird.

ha, ha!!! i only laugh because you're so incredibly smooth when you drop that strainer. i guess that's why you have a 2nd one right on the bar. again, great video, toby. can't wait to visit you in person at the violet hour some day.

a few others -- gin: brokers (~$17), seagrims distillers reserve (~$13) bourbon: buillet (~$22) and another vote for buffalo trace i agree that herradura silver is really, really good stuff for $32, but despite the marketing hype and possibly being overpriced, patron silver is a pretty great tequila. also, prices vary greatly. i can't get wild turkey in PA for under $20, nor any cognac other than chalfonte for under $38.

haven't seen one of those congacs in a PA liquor store. so sad. $35 is about my limit for a mixing base spirit, so i really struggle with finding brandies that i'm satisfied with. right now chalfonte vsop is all i can find in this price range. question: why isn't there any reasonably priced american brandies that i'm satified with? why can't california make a good congac-like brandy? they make great, inexpensive wine.

ah... interesting. can you define the styles? and what makes them different? hmm, i've never seen Pikesville in PA. any other maryland styles?

i just did the same think about a week ago. to me, the differences were as startling as those who've commented above. the old stuff was darker in color and way more interesting and complex. the new stuff was "thinner" and almost one-note, with both the bitterness and sweetness coming upfront on the tip of the tongue and then vanishing. i certainly could tell the difference side-by-side in a drink (negroni) also. i was as disappointed and shocked as others, even though the new campari still makes a fine drink. however, i also could probably accept the open bottle as the culprit theory, rather than a change in formula. my old bottle has been on the shelf, less than 1/3 full for over a year. evaporation, oxidation, etc could be blamed, i guess, even for an improvement. i guess we'll be able to test this theory in a few years when our current "new formula" bottles have sat on the shelf, draining slowly, and hopefully taking on these complex flavors we're noting. those who have found the older bottles recently on the shelves -- how does a newly opened bottle of the old formula compare to a newly opened bottle of the new formula?

funny... i like Overholt over Beam by far. which might be odd as i think they're both made in the same distillery (Beam makes Overholt). i think the Beam is a bit boring and on the sweet side. i like the Overholt because of the spicy grassiness. i think it asserts itself in mixing better, too. so, as always, to each his own. they're all good products. of the three, i think i might like Saz the best, but it's 40% more expensive in these here parts.

from wikipedia, fruit flies "feed on the microorganisms that decompose fruit, as well as on the sugar of the fruit itself." so i imagine booze with a higher sugar content would be more attractive. also could be bottles that are poured less often, leaving dried sugars on the pourer/rim. or maybe bottles poured only now and then, where the alcohol has evaporated, leaving a nice wet and sugary home for microorganisms. another thought -- perhaps some boozes' smell has components similar to that of rotting fruit, and the flies think that they'll get a good meal or place to lay eggs. they like to lay eggs in (and feed on) fermenting fruit, which smells a lot like... whiskey? tequila?

um... maybe? PA has stocked vya from time to time. i've only seen the extra dry (in east liberty) recently. nearly indefinitely, right? i mean, it's fortified wine, so as long as air doesn't get to it, it should be fine. alchemist and others say an opened bottle only lasts 2 weeks and you should toss vermouth after that. well, it may start degrading after 2 weeks, but i'm guessing we've all kept them around longer than that. sure, they're not as good after a week or so, but i've had vermouths (and quinquinas) opened for a couple months and not noticed any "off" flavors. not as good as when first opened, but not bad enough to justify tossing a half-full bottle of $18 vya. doesn't hurt to throw out a $5 martini & rossi, though. if in doubt, taste to see if it's kicked the bucket.

train an army of bees? or how about http://www.instructables.com/id/Honeysuckl...Nectar-of-Life/. i'm sure a similar process could be used for lilacs... however this could be seriously time consuming. alternatively, there seem to be a lot of recipes online for both honeysuckle and lilac syrups, which are exactly what you'd expect them to be: bring water to boil w/flowers, add sugar. i imagine that you'd be able to infuse booze similarly, rather than use the nectar. with some flowers, you may have to use fresh blossoms, though, as dried ones have lost all the scent/flavor. theres a big honeysuckle bush outside my front door. i may try this once it starts blooming.

i was thinking the same thing! but with honeysuckle. unfortunately, dried honeysuckle tastes nothing like the nectar (and is actually really gross). seems like you'd need a LOT of nectar to flavor a little bitters, though. if you can get enough, i imagine you could distill it. do you have a method to collect the nectar?

now there's my problem... i wasn't canning at all. it went into a sterilized 20 oz bottle with a pour top. i think the problem was that i made too much, so i just stored the extra in the back of the fridge where it sat unused for 3 months. if i make too much next time i'll definitely can it. i realized i was asking a bit much to expect it to stay good for so long, but just wondered about the use of preservatives in syrups. i just hate to throw stuff out.

hmm... you mean, just add it in? any idea how much? would those perservatives affect flavor? EDIT: answered part of my own question... from http://www.nysaes.cornell.edu/necfe/pubs/p...2_chemical.html: at first glance this seems like a last resort, as in my experience the sugar levels ward off most icky critters. however, i'm having a problem with some refrigerated 5-month old pineapple syrup -- the syrup itself still tastes good (flavor is dulling a little), but i'm getting mold in the bottle above the liquid line (in the residue left behind after pouring). would potassium sorbate fix that?

Interesting thoughts! Saying the Vya has a briney character makes me think of some Scotches and Campari. I wonder if it would mix well with either of those? ← i was messing with a manhatten variations... well actually variations on audry saunders' "little italy." i love the bitter flavors from the cynar. it perks a manhatten up, but it's pretty sweet (sweeter than campari). so i started to experiment with substituting vya extra dry for the sweet vermounth. it worked pretty well. as did brandy, cynar, and vya e-dry combinations. i could never get it to play well with gin, though, which is maybe where all the disappointment in it comes from. wish i could get my hands on some genever. maybe a vya "martini" would work with the maltier gin?

It really does seem more like they were trying to make something tasty to drink alone vs. something that mixes friendly. Or at least they succeeded in only one of those areas (imo). ← i think vya extra dry is good to drink alone (i don't love it, but find it interesting and distinctive), but makes a really distracting martini -- fighting with the gin. however, i think it can make a super, super cocktail. i just would never use it the way i use noilly pras. the botanicals (or maybe the wine used) has this "brine-y" quality that reminds me of sea spray. it's funny -- i perceive it as "salty", but when i taste it and really concentrate on the flavors, there's not really any salt. i think it pairs with whiskey better than with gin. i've been using it with bacon-infused bourbon to great success: 1 oz bacon bourbon, 1 oz rye, .5 oz m-r sweet, .5 oz vya extra dry, dash peychaud's, dash fee's whiskey barrel aged. soooo good.

said i'd report back and i'm happy to say that the bourbon has mellowed considerably in the last month. it's still fairly intensly flavored, but the charcoalness has dropped back a lot and now is even pleasant. i'm still cutting it half and half with another whiskey when i use it, but it's pretty tasty now. probably 1/5-1/2 lb of bacon (depending on the type) would be plenty to flavor a 750ml bottle... not the whole pound i used. my favorite drink i've made with it so far is a perfect manhatten, using vya extra dry. there's a brine-y-ness to the vya (along with anise notes) that goes spectacularly with the smokey bourbon.

HA! yeah... i do that too. i also try to special order stuff that they have no idea what it is (BTW, we're sort-of off-topic here -- PA state stores). the rothman & winter creme de violette was in the website inventory (special order) for, like, 2 weeks. when i went in to see if i could order it... POOF... gone. i also tried to order rittenhouse rye 100, but it only came in the case. i couldn't convince my wife that 12 bottles of rye was a good idea. PA has absinthe now... but internet order only. i'm always so dissappointed with the rum selection. i go to the east liberty store (near the whole foods) a lot, oxford center (downtown pittsburgh) and squirrel hill. oxford center has the last 40 bottles of wild turkey rye 101 in the state, so i've been picking those off one by one. back on topic: been doing a variation on an Aviation -- no creme de violette in PA, so instead i add a teaspoon of green chartruese (not at all the same thing, i know) and a few dashes of grapefruit-lavendar bitters from the recipe in the bitters thread -- spicy, sour delicious!

it's also worth mentioning that not all stills are equal. there are pot stills that have long, tall heads that function much like column stills (Glenmorangie) -- only letting the more ethanol-rich distillate through and sending the rest back to the pot to be re-boiled. and modern column (or continuous) stills are fairly complicated and "tunable." they can be constructed (or set) to produce a very pure distillate, or to make a more flavorful product.

with the laws surrounding distilling, i would venture to guess not many. i think that's why there's such number of great micro-brews out there -- it is easy to brew beer as a hobbyist! so many of the brewers out there start that way. distilling, on the other hand, is so hard to do as a hobbyist. it's legal status has thrown a lot of it underground, where it is difficult to get good equipment, recipes, knowledge on how to do it properly. there's a great underground distilling community (a lot of it from New Zealand, where home-distilling is legal), but a lot of it is focused on column stills/vodka/pure ethanol. plus, there's always the chance (although slim) that you could get caught. and then if you want to do it legally... well, that could mean years of paperwork and high, high licensing fees. back to the topic at hand, it's really all about the distiller, right? a great master-distilller will use the right still for the job, and use it well. i don't see a reason why one couldn't milk a nice whiskey from a column still or a good vodka or gin from a pot still, but that is all up to the person working the controls.

just to elaborate on cdh's good explanation -- column stills are basically a contraption that allows "multiple" distillations in a single boil. this removes impurities quickly and efficiently (and much more cheaply) than a pot still, leaving you with purer ethanol. again, great for vodka, which is still often run through a column still many times to "wash" it of flavor and get a product that is more purely alcohol. the problem with a column still is that there are a lot of flavor in the "impurities" and using one for whiskey or brandy will give you a pretty bland product (well, a vodka, i guess). also, you could make a vodka with a pot still, but you'd have to perform many distillation runs to get the purity that you'd want. using a pot-still is about tradition, yes, but also about creating a product that retains the flavor and character of the sugar source that was used for fermentation. some distillers go as far as saying the size and shape of the pot influences the flavor of the distillate. so, not really a matter of which is "better," but of which is better for what you're trying to make.

hmm... i don't know... i was going by toby's (rough) recipe above. embarassingly, i didn't measure (damn silver fizz... and little italy... and...). it was probably more like 1.5-2 oz. i was actually surprised at how little liquid fat came from cooking a package of bacon. but perhaps i overdid it. actually, i'm not so concerned with the intensity of flavor, but with the overwhelming charcoal in it. maybe i burned the fat. although, i kept pouring it off after every 3-4 slices and cooked over low heat. the bacon didn't burn. so far, the best part of this experiment so far has been the bacon, date, and sea salt milk chocolate bars that my wife made with the left-over bacon. however, i think i can salvage the bacon-bourbon. i'll just have to use it in dashes and 1/4 ounces. hey, it'll last longer that way. and maybe it'll mellow with time. i'll report back in a couple weeks.

thought i'd give this a try. 12 oz whole foods hickory-smoked bacon, rendered fat in WT 101 bourbon overnight, picked off fat, strained. i wasn't expecting much. in fact, with some of the comments above, i figured there wouldn't be much bacon flavor. but, wowee! porky and smokey. in fact, waaayyy too porky and smokey. i got a lot of the "burnt" smoke flavors. when i take a sip and think "bacon," it's fairly remarkable -- "wow, bacon-y!" but, really, it's not too good. to make pallatible cocktails, i had to cut it 2:1 with another whiskey (WT 101 rye). and still, it's like "whoa... piggy charcoal." so... will the flavors mellow a bit? did i just drink too soon. will this taste better in 2-3 weeks? did i do something wrong (the bacon i made was delicious and had none of the "burned" flavors that it gave to the whiskey)?

ha! i think we're all in the no-vodka crowd here. if there's one think i've gained from lurking and hanging around this board in 2+ years is a general disdain (a dislike bordering on hatred) for vodka. my point is: my general impression of craft distillers is that none of them want to make vodka (although i'm sure there are exceptions). vodka simply is a money-making venture until they can establish themselves with another product. maybe not the best way to go about it, but the "safest." personally, i'd most like to support those craft distillers that provide products that i can use in recipes from Imbibe! c'mon, old tom gin! c'mon absinthe! c'mon genever! now if i could only convince PA to sell any non-vodka liquor.

that may be true... i guess it's a question of wanting to be the small fish in the ocean of sharks with the vodka or the retarded, crosseyed cousin with the moonshi... ahem, young wiskey. also, try to convince your investors and distributor that moonshine will sell better than vodka! there is, at least, one distiller trying to do it. i read an interview with the distiller. his plan is to rebrand once his aged product is perfected. until then, he figures his best bet is to play on the west virginny hillbilly stereotype.

i did a little research on this (because, secretly, my one dream in life is to be a distiller) and it seemed to me, after reading a bunch of interviews with artisanal distillers, that the answer has nothing to do with difficulty and everything to do with marketability and cashflow. distilling is an expensive business and it makes sense to start out in an already established market (i.e., vodka) than try to create a new niche market (i.e., hollands gin or young whiskey). new markets cost money for education, marketing, advertising, etc. (however, if you can establish yourself as the only player in a niche market...). these guys (and girls) have already spent their life savings on equipment, licensing, and distribution. they can't afford to produce something that won't sell. they're all making the whiskeys and hollands for themselves and friends already. just not selling it, because it would just sit on the shelf. oops... this is the Imbibe! thread... still enjoying the heck out of this book. dave, are you really planning a punch book next?