Comprehensive list of ingredients and techniques

[annam]

I have seen many lists and databases online, but none seem to have a comprehensive and exhaustive coverage of ingredients (any foodstuffs) and techniques. Have you seen one? Please share!

[JAZ]

I'm not sure what exactly you're looking for -- something like The Flavor Bible, that is, lists of ingredients that go together? I guess I just don't understand what a list of "all foodstuffs" would provide.

[ScottyBoy]

Cookipedia? Get on it!

[annam]

Thanks!

@JAZ -- I am looking for something that one would describe as Encyclopedia of food (ingredients, techniques, etc.). Everything A to Z with no omissions and no specific angle (such as flavor, vegetable, spices).

@ScottyBoy -- cookipedia does seem to try to be what I am looking for, but it's very incomplete (mostly pulls stuff from Wikipedia it seems).

So, the search continues, or is there really no such resource on the web?

[IndyRob]

I don't think this s what you're looking for, but it looks interesting nonetheless...

For the ingredient side, I just found the USDA National Nutrient Database. No descriptions, but as a list it looks pretty comprehensive and includes nutritional and weight data. It can be downloaded in ASCII or MS Access formats.

It's possible that other resources could use the NDB_No ID to identify ingredients.

[Chris Amirault]

Welcome, annam! I don't think that what you're looking for exists online. I'm not sure it exists offline either! Is there a cookbook equivalent? Larousse? Oxford Companion to Food?

[annam]

Welcome, annam! I don't think that what you're looking for exists online. I'm not sure it exists offline either! Is there a cookbook equivalent? Larousse? Oxford Companion to Food?

Yes, it looks like it does not really exist online (or offline indeed). Surprising!

I wonder if there are people in the community that might be willing to create it? The USDA database is a good start, but much more needs to be included.

[IndyRob]

Yes, it looks like it does not really exist online (or offline indeed). Surprising!

I wonder if there are people in the community that might be willing to create it? The USDA database is a good start, but much more needs to be included.

It would be an interesting thing to explore, but it would have to be defined further and have a focus (or a limited number of foci). Julia Child had to do a lot of painful editings down.

I think this book, if in name only, seems to be close to what you want. But it looks like the reader reviews are not so great. I may have even seen this book in a store, but put it back on the shelf after browsing.

[Mjx]

I have seen many lists and databases online, but none seem to have a comprehensive and exhaustive coverage of ingredients (any foodstuffs) and techniques. . .

. . .I am looking for something that one would describe as Encyclopedia of food (ingredients, techniques, etc.). Everything A to Z with no omissions and no specific angle (such as flavor, vegetable, spices).

I thought of this post today, when I came across The Perfect Pantry – a food writer's 250+ favorite ingredients, with recipes.

This is something that can never exist in quite the way you describe, not only because food and its preparation are constantly evolving, but because access to knowledge and ingredients is constantly changing; for example, just when you think you've nailed the last item, along comes a never-before-done recipe translation from, say, Gujarati, which mentions three new ingredients and two new techniques. Or, I once came across a very old recipe for a pigeon dish that recommended using the 'readily available and delicious' passenger pigeon (the last of which died in the 40s).

Your best bet would be to compile a personal database, starting from whatever reasonably comprehensive source you first find, and then adding others: they often cross-link to related sites and databases (a good thing, since the more comprehensive directories I've seen have also tended to be less accurate, and this is a good way to catch errors). This can be added to on an ongoing basis, keeping it right at the cutting edge of your knowledge.

Actually, perhaps eGullet already has such a project simmering along, which I've overlooked? It certainly would be something doable, given all the potential member contributions.

Edited December 21, 2010 by Mjx (log)

[annam]

@ IndyRob -- I would think that with the ability of the internet to present data, all the data is out there. Just needs to be organized (no Julia Child editing down needed, I think).

@Mjx -- It does seem it has to start from somewhere and grow. It will be a never ending project admittedly, but once you get the main corpus of data organized, additions should be relatively easy. How do I go about finding if anyone in the community is already doing it? The managers would know I presume...

[Chris Amirault]

The answer is sort of. We have a comprehensive index for the charcuterie topic, and another you'll be hearing about a lot in the coming days. But this sort of project requires an expansive effort and constant monitoring and updating that expands beyond the bounds of our volunteer corps.

For starters, perhaps we can use this topic to gather the best of what's out there.

[Dave Hatfield]

I think the complete version of "LaRusse Gastronomic" is about as close as you will come.

Not 100% comprehensive, but the best source that I know of.

The original French version is best

[IndyRob]

@ IndyRob -- I would think that with the ability of the internet to present data, all the data is out there. Just needs to be organized (no Julia Child editing down needed, I think).

You're right, but my thinking was more along the lines of not making it intimidating.

I rummaged around my noggin for an ingredient to use as a challenging example of how it might be organized. Eggs. Common, cheap, versatile, sometimes surprising....Perfect.

Okay, we need to talk about egg grading, sizing and aging. Organic eggs, white vs. brown. Oh, wait...what about duck eggs, quail eggs, ostrich eggs. Turtle eggs? Oh man, all the fish eggs....

Preparations of a whole egg itself - hard boiled (including all of the water temp strategies, and well as oven methods), soft boiled, fried (sunny side up, over easy/medium/hard, etc), baked, poached, scrambled, ommelettized, frittata'd, etc. Plus hybrids such as deviled eggs.

Then there are the egg components, the yolk and the two whites. Oh, and even the shells have culinary applications by themselves. Emulsifying, whipping, tempering... Hollandaise, Mayonnaise, Souffles, Meringue,...

Better talk about food safety too.

Baking... Now there's another whole subject. Creaming, leavening, etc.

Of course, we've got to get into the chemistry. There's another whole section.

Then there are affinities. What ingredients go well with eggs?

People that actually have a culinary education could probably take all of this even farther. But while I've sought to provoke feelings of intimidation, I also know that I've probably chosen the most multi-faceted of all ingredients.

If eggs could be dealt with properly, anything could.

[annam]

@ Chris Amirault: I like the idea of of using the topic to gather information about what is out there. However, would it not be better to start a new topic which explicitly asks for that. (BTW, I like the charcuterie link -- did not know about it and am very I happy I do now:)

@IndyRob: The example is not at all intimidating. The work is a lot, but at least there is a well mapped way to do it and it's just a question of whether the right resources (volunteer or other) can be found to do it. I am a big fan of Lao Dze and his maxim that every journey starts with a single step:)...so, I am trying to make the first step. Thanks for your thoughts -- quite thorough:)

[mrsadm]

I've never seen a site as comprehensive as Larousse, but this site is interesting:

Ochef

[IndyRob]

@IndyRob: The example is not at all intimidating. The work is a lot, but at least there is a well mapped way to do it and it's just a question of whether the right resources (volunteer or other) can be found to do it. I am a big fan of Lao Dze and his maxim that every journey starts with a single step:)...so, I am trying to make the first step. Thanks for your thoughts -- quite thorough:)

By intimidating, I meant for the reader. All that will expand to a copious amount of text.

What if one created a sort of summary article for eggs that listed all these considerations, but didn't try to answer them all - but instead linked to relevant existing content?

e.g.

Egg

An egg is a [blah, blah, blah]

Egg Dishes

There are at least 100 dishes that feature eggs as a main component[blah, blah, blah], but the egg also [blah, blah, blah]

Some of these links could certainly go to eGCI, or sometimes even eG threads. Over time, the wiki nature could bring these 'in house' so to speak, by creating better content based on that original inspiration, but that fits it into the framework better. Sometimes, a better 'in house' version may not be feasible (for instance, some 'HowStuffWorks.com' content is really well done) but it could be a symbiotic relationship.