Student's Corner

[minichef]

I have started studying an elective advanced wine module as part of my culinary arts degree, with a view to carrying on to do the WSET(Wine and Spirits Education Trust) diploma. This module is roughly equivalent to the WSET advanced level, which is necessary for entry to diploma level. In 2005 I completed the WSET intermediate course, which was great fun, and covered the fundamentals of wine. This course is much more advanced, and highly interesting, and we are moving along at a rapid pace, having covered vit/vin; France ie Bordeaux & SW, Burgundy, the Rhone, Alsace, & the Loire.

If any other eGulleters are studying wine, formally or informally, I would appreciate any comments regarding resources, books, tasting techniques (I find tasting excruciating but exiting , in a weirdly masochistic way....altough I'm told all it takes is practice) or anything else any one finds interesting in the way of learning about wine.

A good resource for total newcomers is winefornewbies.net with Bill Wilson, totally unassuming and educational.

Our class is invited to a Californian tasting on Monday, so I will let you know how that goes.

mini.

[Rebel Rose]

Excellent, mini! It will be great to have some more in depth coverage of the WSET coverage, and the requirements for your culinary courses as well. We've had some brief threads on WSET before, but they were only asking if the course was worth taking, and there has not yet been any in-depth notes on the experience of taking the courses.

Maybe Brad can chime in with some more links on related learning literature--I was able to find this thread: Wine Literature for the Serious Student It's also still fairly brief, so I hope our members can add to the list for our budding wine-savvy chefs like minichef!

Good for you for tackling this extensive topic! I hope if you have any questions that are not covered in your course materials, that you will ask them here, and I hope you will feel welcome to share the full range of your wine learning experiences with us. (We're particularly fond of really embarrassing stories!)

[minichef]

thanks for the encouragement!

Well we went to our first trade tasting today, held in Dublin Castle, a Californian tasting,

pretty interesting in light of the Gallo brothers stuff in the news. I must say I felt intimidating walking into that huge room, and seeing row upon row of bottles, sitting there waiting for me. It was a very well organised tasting, with plenty of room, plenty of table water crackers and plenty of spitoons. The first thing I realised was that I really had no idea how to approach the whole thing (apart from starting with whites, of course).

I decided that I would go around the room tasting chardonnays, as I tend not to order Californian chardonnays when eating out; and felt I could use some practice at eking out all the grape's styles. (Then, after maybe 20 chards, I remembered our teacher's word of warning; many Californian wines tend to be similar.... I'll probably be shot for saying that, but it turned out not to be untrue!). I tried to ask the more friendly stall holders what they reccommended, other than the chards, and got to taste some lovely unusual (?) things like an Artesa Carneros Estate albarino 2005, a great Delicato Clay Station viognier 2005, an Eos late harvest moscato 'tears of dew' 2005, and so on.

Then it came to the reds, and to be honest by this time i was feeling a little jaded, not only on the palate, but by the crowd, the other students acting silly (grrr), and by the wine hogs talking to the stall people and taking up their attention so i could only stand there grinning wanly and feeling sheepish until, five or six minutes later, it was finally my turn, and the stall holder asks my opinion and all I can manage is a squeaked... 'nice?' So I tasted a good few more then decided to call it a day.

Any way, it was a great experience, and I would love to go to another one, I just think I need a little more direction next time...For example our teacher was only tasting pinot noirs, which i thought was reasonable, but I wanted to pack more in to my tasting experience, and besides, she knows her stuff. I imagine it would be easier if you are in the trade, and have an idea what you're looking for, for a winelist or a whatever, and have certain criteria to meet.

So, bottom line, has any one got any advice for a systematic approach to tastings?

[Rebel Rose]

When you are just starting out, it can indeed be overwhelming. And you're right, people in the trade, such as your instructor, will normally confine themselves to what I call a "tasting quest" when approaching these large tastings, as it's easier to compare and calibrate when you're tasting from the same variety or region.

But you did the right thing by asking for recommendations from the pourers. That's the best way to taste the wines they are exceptionally proud of. As for the "buttonholers," those guest who grab the lapels of every visiting winemaker or winery rep and won't let go . . . my advice is to be rude (and relish the opportunity while you're at it). Okay, maybe not rude, but at least assertive . . . the pouring party will THANK you for rescuing them from the clutches of drones!

[KatieLoeb]

and got to taste some lovely unusual (?) things like an Artesa Carneros Estate albarino 2005, a great Delicato Clay Station viognier 2005, an Eos late harvest moscato 'tears of dew' 2005, and so on.

Wow! These all sound very interesting. Having visited Artesa and being a big fan of Spanish varietals, the Albarino sounds particularly intriguing to me. I'll have to snoop around and see if I can dig any up in a <cough> neighboring state.

Your insights into the WSET program will be something I'll look forward to.

[JohnL]

thanks for the encouragement!

Well we went to our first trade tasting today, held in Dublin Castle, a Californian tasting,

pretty interesting in light of the Gallo brothers stuff in the news. I must say I felt intimidating walking into that huge room, and seeing row upon row of bottles, sitting there waiting for me. It was a very well organised tasting, with plenty of room, plenty of table water crackers and plenty of spitoons. The first thing I realised was that I really had no idea how to approach the whole thing (apart from starting with whites, of course). 

I decided that I would go around the room tasting chardonnays, as I tend not to order Californian chardonnays when eating out; and felt I could use some practice at eking out all the grape's styles. (Then, after maybe 20 chards, I remembered our teacher's word of warning; many Californian wines tend to be similar.... I'll probably be shot for saying that, but it turned out not to be untrue!). I tried to ask the more friendly stall holders what they reccommended, other than the chards, and got to taste some lovely unusual (?) things like an Artesa Carneros Estate albarino 2005, a great Delicato Clay Station viognier 2005, an Eos late harvest moscato 'tears of dew' 2005, and so on.

Then it came to the reds, and to be honest by this time i was feeling a little jaded, not only on the palate, but by the crowd, the other students acting silly (grrr), and by the wine hogs talking to the stall people and taking up their attention so i could only stand there grinning wanly and feeling sheepish until, five or six minutes later, it was finally my turn, and the stall holder asks my opinion and all I can manage is a squeaked... 'nice?' So I tasted a good few more then decided to call it a day.

Any way, it was a great experience, and I would love to go to another one, I just think I need a little more direction next time...For example our teacher was only tasting pinot noirs, which i thought was reasonable, but I wanted to pack more in to my tasting experience, and besides, she knows her stuff. I imagine it would be easier if you are in the trade, and have an idea what you're looking for, for a winelist or a whatever, and have certain criteria to meet.

So, bottom line, has any one got any advice for a systematic approach to tastings?

←

The WSET has its pluses and it also has its minuses.

You should make sure you understand what you are getting into.

One drawback is the course is a distinctly European (read British) approach to wine. It relies upon studying wine from the perspective of place and is heavy on the geography. It also promulgates the stereotyping of wine.

A perfect example is "many california chardonnays tend to be similar." I would posit that they "tend" to be no more or less similar than wines from any particular region anywhere in the world.

In fact, upon closer scrutiny, one can discern distinct differences among wines from just about anywhere in the world including California.

The problem with the stereotyping of wines is that while once more valid, today the wine world has changed and is changing. it has also grown rapidly. Obtaining a MW (or diploma or...) twenty years or more ago was a lot easier than it is today. The old canards do not apply so easily any longer. (if they ever did)

The future focus (really the present) of wine knowledge is moving toward flavor profile and away from place of origin.

The "old world" and "new world" descriptors are more applicable to denoting a general style of wine and less so regarding a specific geographical location.

There is some unrest with the MW approach and also as to its validity or worth as a professional benefit. Check out Jancis Robinson's web site as well as some recent pieces in Decanter et al.

I personally know of many industry professionals of rather high standing here and abroad who question the whole wine education situation today. (really the WSET and MW approach as opposed to formal schooling at Davis or other enological institutions around the world).

I can say that there are some benefits to the WSET. One should determine if the courses are for them after some careful consideration.

Best of luck!

[minichef]

I think those aspect of the course; of region and geography are going to be important for me. I have always been interested in that area, so it's like an extension to my schooldays geography course. I realise that the WSET approach is not infallible, and its a good idea to keep your mind open to possible flaws in the teaching methods, just like with any other course of learning. But, in Ireland, it is the only academically recognised option. Learning about the similarities or differences of a wine from a particular are for me at this stage, invaluable, as I am still trying to get a handle on varietal characteristics.

I think the comment about chardonnay was made RE commercial level wine and the wine-making style... if that makes a difference.

I should reiterate that this course is part of my culinary arts degree and isnt actually WSET certified. I would still have to do the advanced cert if I wanted to go on and do the diploma. It is equivalent, and the methods are the same, and our school is working on integrating with WSET, but I think WSET view this as economically unfeasible or somesuch.

Thanks for the great responses!

[MattJohnson]

I ran across this blog a few days ago and thought it might be applicable for you: How to taste 200 wines and not die trying.

http://www.vinography.com/archives/2007/03...es_and_not.html

I too am very interested to hear how it goes. I came to realize my love for food and wine only after I've started my current career and didn't have a chance to consider culinary school (from what I've read around, this may have been a blessing...who knows ). However, its nice in that we can be students at home. My wife and I love taking a systematic approach to wine tasting - we use it as a way to travel without leaving our home.

I've found the wine atlas very helpful.

http://www.amazon.com/World-Atlas-Wine-Hug...73799044&sr=8-1

And of course the wine bible.

http://www.amazon.com/Wine-Bible-Karen-Mac...73799093&sr=1-1

These are kind of defacto standards for wine tasters, but I thought I'd post anyway - in case someone doesn't already know. I'm sure you have even better resources. And more importantly, you have access to big time tastings and instructors! I'm not able to do that much financially, but I enjoy what I can do. I look forward to reading about your experience!

Edited March 13, 2007 by MattJohnson (log)

[Rebel Rose]

Here's some incentive for study!

Institute of Masters of Wine announces winner of 2007 scholarship

The Institute of Masters of Wine is delighted to announce the winner of the 2007 Constellation Scholarship, offering the winning student a round-the-world business class trip to visit Constellation’s wineries and vineyards in Australia, New Zealand and the USA, where he will have the opportunity to meet the winemakers, vineyard managers and key people in the business.

[minichef]

I think Ive got a couple of years ahead of me before I reach that level......

[phlox]

The restaurant where I work is having our wine director teach a wine course and I am taking it. It's a lot of fun so far! We are using the Kevin Zraly's Windows on the World book. I am also reading the corresponding chapters of the Wine Bible for a bit more background.

[JohnL]

I've recommended it before but:

"Wine Style" by mary Ewing Mulligan and Ed McCarthy (her husband) is an incredibly helpful book--a great companion to the Wine Bible.

Most books (the Wine Bible) approach wine from a geographical standpoint. Wine Style approaches wines from a flavor profile--what the wines taste like.

Ewing Mulligan (the first female MW in the US) runs the International Wine Center (WSET course in America)

is a great teacher and writer.

[lala]

I just took a wine course and we used the Sotheby's wine guide as a textbook, which I found onerous - the author's personal comments were overbearing. I bought the Oxford Wine Dictionary (Jancis Robinson) and really like it.

[JohnL]

The Oxford is unparalleled in its scope and overall quality.

I would say a near perfect library for learning about wine would consist of:

The Oxford

The Wine Bible

Wine Style

I agree that the Sotheby's is annoyingly rife with opinion.