• Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create an account.

Kerry Beal

Cooking with "Chocolates and Confections" by Peter Greweling (Part 1)

595 posts in this topic

hi,

yesterday i tried the "kitchensink caramel" well kind of.. everything works fine up to the moment when the stuff really starts to boil. its an evil mixture that spatters all over the place, and its just as if it says "go on whisk me as much as you want IAM GONNA SCORCH ANYWAY" i only managed to cook it to like 105 c. i have now idea what it will be like.. any idea ?? i still have about 9 kg of chocolates left....

cheers

t.

p.s. to what degree is a soft but cuttable and enrobable caramel cooked anyway ???


toertchen toertchen

patissier chocolatier cafe

cologne, germany

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hi,

yesterday i tried the "kitchensink caramel" well kind of.. everything works fine up to the moment when the stuff really starts to boil. its an evil mixture that spatters all over the place, and its just as if it says "go on whisk me as much as you want IAM GONNA SCORCH ANYWAY" i only managed to cook it to like 105 c. i have now idea what it will be like..  any idea ?? i still have about 9 kg of chocolates left....

cheers

t.

p.s. to what degree is a soft but cuttable and enrobable caramel cooked anyway ???

I was thinking that you'd have to take it to about 123C.


John DePaula
formerly of DePaula Confections
Hand-crafted artisanal chocolates & gourmet confections - …Because Pleasure Matters…
--------------------
When asked “What are the secrets of good cooking? Escoffier replied, “There are three: butter, butter and butter.”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay, first attempt at posting images...

I made the lemon logs for the second time...first time I kind of cheated and didn't use fresh lemon (becasue I didn't have a zester). Well, I went out and bought a zester for a whole $2.49 and it made all the difference.

The only things that really caused me trouble were getting the fondant to incorporate really well and piping the logs at a steady pace so the logs would be even.

gallery_56969_5776_63125.jpg

gallery_56969_5776_23145.jpg

gallery_56969_5776_70766.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Okay, first attempt at posting images...

I made the lemon logs for the second time...first time I kind of cheated and didn't use fresh lemon (becasue I didn't have a zester).  Well, I went out and bought a zester for a whole $2.49 and it made all the difference.

The only things that really caused me trouble were getting the fondant to incorporate really well and piping the logs at a steady pace so the logs would be even.

gallery_56969_5776_63125.jpg

gallery_56969_5776_23145.jpg

gallery_56969_5776_70766.jpg

Hey, that's quite nice. How'd you like the texture? Did they have enough lemony 'zing?'


John DePaula
formerly of DePaula Confections
Hand-crafted artisanal chocolates & gourmet confections - …Because Pleasure Matters…
--------------------
When asked “What are the secrets of good cooking? Escoffier replied, “There are three: butter, butter and butter.”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Those lemon logs look nice. I've been meaning to make them, but with my wife out of town I have no one to make them for! Maybe in April...


Chris Hennes
Director of Operations
chennes@egullet.org

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the compliments.

John, the texture is rather nice actually, but I’m not quite sure how to describe it. Kind of cheesecake-like but also with the smoothness and meltiness of butter, and a bit fluffier when compared to a normal cream ganache.

The first time I made these I had only dried lemon zest and lemon juice from a bottle. They were fairly lemony until I dipped them. Once the chocolate was around the centers the lemon taste was really hidden. The second time, however, I used fresh lemon zest and freshly squeezed lemon juice. Before dipping these ones, they had as lemony a taste as lemon squares. Once dipped in the dark chocolate it became more like essence of lemon…which is what I was hoping to get.

Since I really liked the taste and the texture, I plan on trying small batches of them with other citrus fruits: orange, lime, and grapefruit.

Chris, these ones weren’t for my wife since I’m the big citrus person in the family; she did like them though. And, she does have the pages marked for all the recipes she wants me to make.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

this sounds like something perfect for using meyer lemons. if you up the amount of juice (since meyers are a bit milder than regular lemons)...i'll have to take a look at the recipe.

merlicky, they look great, by the way :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey Everyone

After skimming through all 15 pages, I've placed my order for this book. I always walk past in the the store, without really paying attn to it..(big mistake!)

A couple of qns..

1. Chocolate viscosity - When in temper, I find my chocolate a little too thick for my liking......as for cocoa butter, do I add it in BEFORE tempering or AFTER tempering? Not too sure about that one! ;o

2. How do you guys store your chocolates? I find that I have to store them in the fridge cos I'm afraid that the fillings may go off since they contain cream etc...however, once they're taken out of the fridge, there tends to be ugly condensation on it...sigh :o(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hey Everyone

After skimming through all 15 pages, I've placed my order for this book. I always walk past in the the store, without really paying  attn to it..(big mistake!)

A couple of qns..

1. Chocolate viscosity - When in temper, I find my chocolate a little too thick for my liking......as for cocoa butter, do I add it in BEFORE tempering or AFTER tempering? Not too sure about that one! ;o

2. How do you guys store your chocolates? I find that I have to store them in the fridge cos I'm afraid that the fillings may go off since they contain cream etc...however, once they're taken out of the fridge, there tends to be ugly condensation on it...sigh :o(

If your chocolate is too thick when in proper temper, I'd add the extra cocoa butter before tempering. What kind of chocolate are you using? You might want to think about getting a different chocolate that has a better viscosity for what you want to accomplish.

I store my chocolates at room temperature in an air tight container. The ingredients you add to the cream should reduce the available water sufficiently that they are safe at room temperature.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hey Everyone

After skimming through all 15 pages, I've placed my order for this book. I always walk past in the the store, without really paying  attn to it..(big mistake!)

A couple of qns..

1. Chocolate viscosity - When in temper, I find my chocolate a little too thick for my liking......as for cocoa butter, do I add it in BEFORE tempering or AFTER tempering? Not too sure about that one! ;o

2. How do you guys store your chocolates? I find that I have to store them in the fridge cos I'm afraid that the fillings may go off since they contain cream etc...however, once they're taken out of the fridge, there tends to be ugly condensation on it...sigh :o(

If your chocolate is too thick when in proper temper, I'd add the extra cocoa butter before tempering. What kind of chocolate are you using? You might want to think about getting a different chocolate that has a better viscosity for what you want to accomplish.

I store my chocolates at room temperature in an air tight container. The ingredients you add to the cream should reduce the available water sufficiently that they are safe at room temperature.

I vary between using Valrhona and Cadbury..........Thanks for the tip on the cocoa butter!

What is your room temperature? Room temp here is around 30 degrees celsius....quite warm and humid.

Also, I find that when stored in the fridge, they have a real *bite* to them (the crispness of the tempered chocolate), which is lost when they're stored @ room temp. But then again, it could just be the warm climate here....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Also, I find that when stored in the fridge, they have a real *bite* to them (the crispness of the tempered chocolate), which is lost when they're stored @ room temp. But then again, it could just be the warm climate here....

If you must refrigerate or freeze your truffles I suggest placing them in a vacuum bag first. That will eliminate the condensation problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

David, If i vac-pac my chocolates in the bag as you do and they freeze them will the content of the chocolate expand and crack the covering?


“Do you not find that bacon, sausage, egg, chips, black pudding, beans, mushrooms, tomatoes, fried bread and a cup of tea; is a meal in itself really?” Hovis Presley.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Also, I find that when stored in the fridge, they have a real *bite* to them (the crispness of the tempered chocolate), which is lost when they're stored @ room temp. But then again, it could just be the warm climate here....

If you must refrigerate or freeze your truffles I suggest placing them in a vacuum bag first. That will eliminate the condensation problem.

Do you have to be really careful when vacuuming it? I would imagine the chocolates being crushed if too much air is sucked out

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

AmritaBala, as you're living in Singapore, I would think that humidity and warmth (climate) would have an effect on your chocolate tempering.

If you're storing in the fridge and you're losing texture when it comes to room temp, then the chocolate might not have been in proper temper in the first place (or maybe wrapped incorrectly). The professionals do vacuum seal and store in the freezer. In order to defrost properly and avoid condensation (and sugar bloom), the chocolates are moved from the freezer to the fridge on the first day and then out to room temp the second day. The packaging is not removed until the chocolates have reached ambient temp.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
David, If i vac-pac my chocolates in the bag as you do and they freeze them will the content of the chocolate expand and crack the covering?

The trick to keep from cracking your truffles is to pass through the refrigerator on the way to and from the freezer. Place them in the fridge for a day before moving them to the freezer, then back in the refrigerator for a day before taking them out to come to room temperature. The slow temperature change prevents differential shrinking and resultant cracking.

Even so, they aren't all the delicate. I chucked a number directy into the freezer before I read the instructions carefully and they didn't crack.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Do you have to be really careful when vacuuming it? I would imagine the chocolates being crushed if too much air is sucked out

The only time I was carefull not to pull as much vacuum as the device would draw was when I had some delicate chocolate curls decorating the tops and I didn't want to crush them. Standard truffles will hold up fine to the small amount of pressure that comes from the vacuum.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I vary between using Valrhona and Cadbury..........Thanks for the tip on the cocoa butter!

What is your room temperature? Room temp here is around 30 degrees celsius....quite warm and humid.

Also, I find that when stored in the fridge, they have a real *bite* to them (the crispness of the tempered chocolate), which is lost when they're stored @ room temp. But then again, it could just be the warm climate here....

Amrita,

Humid conditions and 30C are going to make for some frustrating chocolate work. Wow, that's warm! From my own experience, if the humidity gets near or above 50% and the temperature is above 22C, it's not going to be a fun day. In other words, the chocolate is going to be thick thick thick.

Is there any way you could work in a small cooled and dehumidified room?

At 30C, I wouldn't even consider storing chocolates. Properly packaged and refrigeration is the only way to go. I would say, only take out what you want to eat immediately. Don't uncover for about 20 mn; then uncover and eat. They should still be a tiny bit cool from the refrigeration and thereby retain some "bite."

I was going to say that perhaps you could increase the ratio of chocolate to cream in your ganaches so that they would be firmer at your ambient temperature; however, I'm not sure even that would do it.

Keep in mind, 30C is approximately the *working* temperature for tempered chocolate!


John DePaula
formerly of DePaula Confections
Hand-crafted artisanal chocolates & gourmet confections - …Because Pleasure Matters…
--------------------
When asked “What are the secrets of good cooking? Escoffier replied, “There are three: butter, butter and butter.”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Amrita,

Humid conditions and 30C are going to make for some frustrating chocolate work.  Wow, that's warm!  From my own experience, if the humidity gets near or above 50% and the temperature is above 22C, it's not going to be a fun day.  In other words, the chocolate is going to be thick thick thick.

Is there any way you could work in a small cooled and dehumidified room?

At 30C, I wouldn't even consider storing chocolates.  Properly packaged and refrigeration is the only way to go.  I would say, only take out what you want to eat immediately.  Don't uncover for about 20 mn; then uncover and eat.  They should still be a tiny bit cool from the refrigeration and thereby retain some "bite."

I was going to say that perhaps you could increase the ratio of chocolate to cream in your ganaches so that they would be firmer at your ambient temperature; however, I'm not sure even that would do it. 

Keep in mind, 30C is approximately the *working* temperature for tempered chocolate!

I know, its like a Sauna here. I feel lethargic all day long!

When I made Pierre Herme's Plaisir Sucre, the milk chocolate ganache (which was supposed to be pipeable, was as runny as soup).....I had to alter the cream:chocolate ratio the second time I did it.

Yeah, isn't it weird, I'm practically tempered chocolate myself! (living in a 30C climate)... :wacko:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey everyone. Tried my hand out at tempering WHITE chocolate for the first time today. It practically set before I could even pour them into my moulds!!!

Perhaps this is a mis-conception, but I always thought that white/milk would actually take a LONGER time to set.....hmmmm. It was also a pain in the a%% to get out of the mold. Probably because I didn't temper it well.

I hate how you have to master tempering 3 diff. types of chocolate all on their own. I thought because I had mastered dark chocolate, that milk and white would be a piece of cake...WRONG!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

RE:Turkish Delight

I received the special cornstarch that is suppose to be 60% fluidity. I made the turkish delight but it is soft. I think I need to use a refractometer instead of a thermometer. Has anyone had good success with the turkish delights? Should they be quite firm?

I have never had turkish delight! (but I have people requesting it)

Maybe I didn't cook the starch mixture long enough?


Edited by prairiegirl (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
RE:Turkish Delight

I received the special cornstarch that is suppose to be 60% fluidity. I made the turkish delight but it is soft.  I think I need to use a refractometer instead of a thermometer.  Has anyone had good success with the turkish delights? Should they be quite firm?

I have never had turkish delight! (but I have people requesting it)

Maybe I didn't cook the starch mixture long enough?

I don't know that I would describe turkish delight (lokum) as firm, not like Pate de Fruit firm, instead it's a softer more jelly like texture, but without the spring you associate with jelly. I'm not sure if that description makes any sense.

If you feel it is too soft, then I'd probably recommend trying a refractometer. Also perhaps purchasing some turkish delight to see what texture the commercial ones have.

A vendor on e-bay for a refractometer that I have bought from before is this one - gainexpress. Delivery of an item from them was less than a week from Hong Kong. It's one of the best prices I've seen for a refractometer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I used the Gingerbread Squares butter ganache recipe to create a "Hot Cross Chocolate" ... I replaced the gingerbread spices with cinnamon/allspice to replicate the flavour of a hot cross bun, and used treacle instead of molasses - I probably should have used golden syrup or something lighter in flavour again. Oh - also replaced the liquer with a bit of vodka (to get better consistency but without flavouring it). Quite pleased with the outcome - not much shine because I was trying to do them fast and using the fridge which created a bit a condensation. I would have liked the centre to be softer (but the original recipe was supposed to be slabbed, so even though I thought I had made it soft enough, they set quite hard).

Used the Sao Thome origin for the dark outsides, Lindt for the milk inside, and boring Cadbury white choc for the crosses (left over from something since I don't eat white chocolate!)

gallery_36890_5822_102149.jpg

gallery_36890_5822_71636.jpg

I also did some soft caramel filled milk chocolates (not a Greweling recipe) but thought I'd ask here ... some of them were in temper - some not ... same chocolate, same mould, right next to each other? what did I do wrong?!?! Once again - doing them fast using the fridge, so did some cool faster than others?

gallery_36890_5822_104352.jpg

(hope the pictures worked!)


Edited by LucyInAust (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

LucyInAust--Sorry, I can't see the pictures at all. I think you'll just have to send me some samples, so I can see what they look like!

:biggrin:

Seriously, beautiful stuff. And I'd certainly be willing to take the non-tempered caramel-filled ones off your hands! I love caramel-filled chocolates!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a curiosity question, what's wrong with Hershy's chocolate? I want to just get some cheap stuff to practice with and don't want to wait for an order to come in and there are 1 pound blocks on sale here. I know it's not the "good stuff", so how would I have to adjust the recipe?

PS, I am going to break down and order a marble block from sur la table after a month of rejection on the phone...LOL


"I eat fat back, because bacon is too lean"

-overheard from a 105 year old man

"The only time to eat diet food is while waiting for the steak to cook" - Julia Child

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I have a curiosity question, what's wrong with Hershy's chocolate?

Generally speaking, it just tastes bad. If you're going to experiment, you'll need to at least taste your product. If Hershey's tastes bad, then your chocolates will taste bad, but how will you know the true badness is from your recipe or from the chocolate?

I can't really help with the recipe adjustment part, but I can tell you that I once tried to use Hershey's to make hot chocolate, and it was grossly thick.

Wait a minute, are you talking baking chocolate? Or eating chocolate?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

  • Similar Content

    • By HeatherAvila
      Ideas on why enrobed marshmallows stored at room temp (68 deg F) have recrystallized sugar particles while the same batch of enrobed marshmallow stored airtight in a cooler (40 deg F) do not?
       
      I'm all ears!
       
      Thanks,
      Heather
    • By pastrygirl
      Do you ever end up with ganache that reminds you of extra-heavy mayo?  I was winging it today, testing batches that set up ok but grainy, then weirldy flexible. The 60% i usually use is 39% cocoa butter, but in this batch I used 72%, which is 45% fat.  I also made some other changes but was trying to keep a similar ratio of liquid to chocolate.  The 72% ganache is far thicker than the 60% ever is - it probably needs more cream or a splash of booze, right?  Arg, I should know this!
       
      I got annoyed and left the slab out to do whatever it will overnight - cross your fingers that it is either use-able or save-able tomorrow!
    • By minas6907
      Hey all, I got a question for you who make pate de fruit on a regular basis. I know it's quite simple to pour the finished pate de fruit into a frame, but does anyone here use a confectionery funnel to deposit them into forms? I'm asking because in Notters 'Art of the Chocolatier' it seems his primary way of making the jellies is to deposit the mixture into a flexipan, and his alternate method is to pour it into a frame. I'm wondering simply if anyone does/has done this before. The jellies seem to set quite quickly, and I'm not sure if you just need to be super fast with this or not. I want to try it, but shy away (I need to get appropriate forms first) because I keep feeling like I'll end up with half the mixture deposited and the other half solidified in the funnel. I assume warming the stainless funnel will aid the process, but I also assume that you have one attempt at this, and you cant rewarm the mixture as you would with fondant or gummies. Anyways, just a question I wanted to put out there. Thanks!
       
       
      Host's note: this is the second part of an extended topic that has been split in order to reduce load on our servers.  
      The first part is here: Pâte de Fruits (Fruit Paste/Fruit Jellies) (Part 1)
    • By elizabethnathan
      I buy pate de fruits whenever I find them, and particularly like these: http://www.recchiutichocolates.com/home.htm.
      Now I'd love to try making them. Any tips?
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.