Dessert Philosophy from "Trad to Avant Garde"

[alex stupak]

i have had no problems using sorbitol.....or glycerin for that matter....i f you eat a bowl of it it might cause some problems......but not in small amounts.....i didint think lacitol was dairy based.....i still dont think so....ill triple check though.....if your against sorbitol than your against isomalt too, sorry to say....

and as far as carnuba wax.....it depends on the application.....

the point is where do you draw the line? Gellan gum does not exist in nature but no one has a problem with it....silica does occur in nature and it is legal to put up to 2% of it in food yet that would freak people out.....why.....where is the logic?

[chiantiglace]

I thought gellan was biologically produced from bacterial substances?

[Sethro]

Me too, I thought it was basically a cellulose.

I'm not against using anything, so long as its undetectable. I can taste dextrose if its anywhere around or above 10% of the sucrose weight and its bitter.

Otherwise I can't think of anything that I would intentionally avoid.

[xdrixn]

other than sugar work what else is isomalt good for because I hate it in my nougatine. based on the el bulli recipe it sticks to my non-filling teeth.

[alex stupak]

gellan is produced that way but its done in a lab it doesnt occur in anything naturally....that was my point is all......its synthesized in a lab.....i personally have no problem with using anything if its a means to an end.....i am however against using a substance for the sake of using it.....someone heres that this place is using that stuff and everyone wants it and they dont even know why...they just do....

[alex stupak]

gellan is produced that way but its done in a lab it doesnt occur in anything naturally....that was my point is all......its synthesized in a lab.....i personally have no problem with using anything if its a means to an end.....i am however against using a substance for the sake of using it.....someone heres that this place is using that stuff and everyone wants it and they dont even know why...they just do....

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someone hears i meant....i really should spell check these posts befor i put them out there....

[alex stupak]

gellan is produced that way but its done in a lab it doesnt occur in anything naturally....that was my point is all......its synthesized in a lab.....i personally have no problem with using anything if its a means to an end.....i am however against using a substance for the sake of using it.....someone heres that this place is using that stuff and everyone wants it and they dont even know why...they just do....

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someone hears i meant....i really should spell check these posts befor i put them out there....

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before

[Sethro]

There is an edit function too. Just sayin!

[alex stupak]

other than sugar work what else is isomalt good for because I hate it in my nougatine.  based on the el bulli recipe it sticks to my non-filling teeth.

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i was never really sure why el bulli was puting isomalt in there caramel systems.....it would only reduce sweetness a minimal amount....i think they thought it would hold up better amidst humid conditions but isomalt loses that property when mixed with other sugars.....i have good results using it in croquants and such without any texture issues but again i dont think it helped anything.....

other than sugar show pieces its not good for much......although i did see someone do something really cool with it this one time....

he put olive oil in a vita prep and let it go full blast....and then carefully poured in

melted isomalt......the result was a pate de fruit like texture.....it was almost jelly like....

[peteswanson]

gellan is produced that way but its done in a lab it doesnt occur in anything naturally....that was my point is all......its synthesized in a lab.....i personally have no problem with using anything if its a means to an end.....i am however against using a substance for the sake of using it.....someone heres that this place is using that stuff and everyone wants it and they dont even know why...they just do....

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Thats the nature of the beast unfortunately....and ditto to what Alex said as it being "a means to an end"...something many do the opposite of...

Edited June 19, 2006 by peteswanson (log)

[xdrixn]

oops. I was working on a post during which 5 other people did...forget about it. can't delete.

Edited June 19, 2006 by xdrixn (log)

[chiantiglace]

I agree with you Alex on not using something for the sake of using it. I have a personal battle with that myself because I feel I am playing a game of catch-up, even though I am younger than everyone. So in my catching up nature I put a lot of ideas in my head just to play with something different/new. I thinks its more on the lines to teach myself how something works than rather impress someone with something they haven't heard of, or thought of.

I still think its a balance I have to control myself with.

[skye]

other than sugar work what else is isomalt good for because I hate it in my nougatine.  based on the el bulli recipe it sticks to my non-filling teeth.

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i was never really sure why el bulli was puting isomalt in there caramel systems.....it would only reduce sweetness a minimal amount....i think they thought it would hold up better amidst humid conditions but isomalt loses that property when mixed with other sugars.....i have good results using it in croquants and such without any texture issues but again i dont think it helped anything.....

other than sugar show pieces its not good for much......although i did see someone do something really cool with it this one time....

he put olive oil in a vita prep and let it go full blast....and then carefully poured in

melted isomalt......the result was a pate de fruit like texture.....it was almost jelly like....

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was that somebody Johnny Iuzzini? Because they have excellent evoo pate de fruit @ jean-george that I'd love to know how to make

[gingersweetiepie]

other than sugar work what else is isomalt good for because I hate it in my nougatine.  based on the el bulli recipe it sticks to my non-filling teeth.

←

i was never really sure why el bulli was puting isomalt in there caramel systems.....it would only reduce sweetness a minimal amount....i think they thought it would hold up better amidst humid conditions but isomalt loses that property when mixed with other sugars.....i have good results using it in croquants and such without any texture issues but again i dont think it helped anything.....

other than sugar show pieces its not good for much......although i did see someone do something really cool with it this one time....

he put olive oil in a vita prep and let it go full blast....and then carefully poured in

melted isomalt......the result was a pate de fruit like texture.....it was almost jelly like....

←

was that somebody Johnny Iuzzini? Because they have excellent evoo pate de fruit @ jean-george that I'd love to know how to make

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Glad someone mentioned it - there's great flavor in that pate de fruit! Could taste it straight away. It was noticably softer in texture then the accompanying jellies, though. I wonder if it's resistant to jelling or if adding more pectin detracts from the flavor.

[xdrixn]

actually, with the heat we've been having in my new home town Los Angeles I've been adding 15% isomalt in my croquant with results I'm please with. I have the el bulli 95 book and couldnt get the oo pdf to work.

[AlexForbes]

Although I find very interesting the discussion of what is avant garde, these days I am even more interested in understanding what's behind the opening of new dessert-centric restaurants, mostly in New York, where desserts are not only avant-garde, but the stars of the show.

I wasn't sure if this would be off-topic on this forum, so I started a new topic. I'd love to hear the views of A. Stupak and Akwa and others on this....

the link is

dessert-centric restaurants