Travelling to and around Florence

[VivreManger]

Inspired by Adam Balic's magnificent posts (Tuscan Food Diary http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=62033) of last year (among other reasons), I am planning a trip to Prato this coming April-May. Travel to Florence until sometime in May will be complicated by the closure of its own airport. Instead it will depend on Pisa, about 80 km. away. While the Pisa airport boasts its own train station on the line to Florence. service (particularly on Sunday) is infrequent and Italian trains are notoriously unreliable. Does anyone have experience on this route? Are coaches (American, buses) any better?

[rjs1]

Inspired by Adam Balic's magnificent posts (Tuscan Food Diary http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=62033) of last year (among other reasons), I am planning a trip to Prato this coming April-May.  Travel to Florence until sometime in May will be complicated by the closure of its own airport.  Instead it will depend on Pisa, about 80 km. away.  While the Pisa airport boasts its own train station on the line to Florence. service (particularly on Sunday) is infrequent and Italian trains are notoriously unreliable.  Does anyone have experience on this route?  Are coaches (American, buses) any better?

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The Pisa to Florence train service is fine, even on a Sunday. However, if you are staying in Prato, why not fly to Bologna and get the Florence train from there (it stops at Prato just before Florence)? Tends to be cheaper than Pisa, too (and also spend some time in Bologna itself if you can).

[docsconz]

Inspired by Adam Balic's magnificent posts (Tuscan Food Diary http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=62033) of last year (among other reasons), I am planning a trip to Prato this coming April-May.  Travel to Florence until sometime in May will be complicated by the closure of its own airport.  Instead it will depend on Pisa, about 80 km. away.  While the Pisa airport boasts its own train station on the line to Florence. service (particularly on Sunday) is infrequent and Italian trains are notoriously unreliable.  Does anyone have experience on this route?  Are coaches (American, buses) any better?

←

The Pisa to Florence train service is fine, even on a Sunday. However, if you are staying in Prato, why not fly to Bologna and get the Florence train from there (it stops at Prato just before Florence)? Tends to be cheaper than Pisa, too (and also spend some time in Bologna itself if you can).

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On the whole Bologna is a more interesting city than Pisa IMO, especially gastronomically. This is a good suggestion.

[VivreManger]

Interesting suggestion which I am now exploring. I could take an early Sunday AM flight from Stansted to Forli airport, arriving around 10, take the train into Bologna Center, arriving around noon, spend a few hours in Bologna, and then train to Prato, later in the PM. Does anyone know the Forli airport which seems to be a 10 minute shuttle from the train station, but how frequently does it run?

[menton1]

Inspired by Adam Balic's magnificent posts (Tuscan Food Diary http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=62033) of last year (among other reasons), I am planning a trip to Prato this coming April-May.  Travel to Florence until sometime in May will be complicated by the closure of its own airport.  Instead it will depend on Pisa, about 80 km. away.  While the Pisa airport boasts its own train station on the line to Florence. service (particularly on Sunday) is infrequent and Italian trains are notoriously unreliable.  Does anyone have experience on this route?  Are coaches (American, buses) any better?

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Actually, Pisa has always had more international flights using it than Florence; I also have to disagree about the FS (trains) being unreliable; of course, when there is a "sciopero", (strike) which can happen at any time, everything stops. But in normal times, the trains are highly reliable and mostly within a few minutes of their schedule, in my experience.

P.S. A check on the official FS website shows about 1 train every hour from PisaAE (aeroporto)-Firenze, even on Sundays. (I checked May 7) Here is the site:

http://www.trenitalia.com/

Type in "Pisa AE" in the departure field, there are actually a bit more than 1 train/hour...

Edited February 5, 2006 by menton1 (log)

[VivreManger]

Thanks for the update on the schedule. My original information was based on the inaccurate train schedule posted on the Pisa airport website. Trenitalia does give much more detail, as you correctly note. That said, it is still true that if the final destination is PRATO (a suburb of Florence), the Bologna starting point is better since it is one straight route from its central station, with no train changes, directly to the station nearest my conference. From Pisa central station to Prato requires at least one or two changes of train. While the direct train connection from the airport to Pisa center is an advantage, the rest of the trip may not be.

Be all of that as it may, what will finally determine my choice is whether the friends and food in the Florence area prove more attractive than the options in Bologna. So far Bologna has not attracted the supporters I anticipated.

[rjs1]

Interesting suggestion which I am now exploring.  I could take an early Sunday AM flight from Stansted to Forli airport, arriving around 10, take the train into Bologna Center, arriving around noon, spend a few hours in Bologna, and then train to Prato, later in the PM.  Does anyone know the Forli airport which seems to be a 10 minute shuttle from the train station, but how frequently does it run?

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Forli to Bologna is a long way. You really ought to fly to Bologna itself, then it's a few minutes in a taxi to the centre of Bologna and/or the station for the Prato/Florence train. I think from memory that Ryanair fly to Forli and Easyjet to Bologna itself, but I could be out of date on that. If only Forli is available, I'd go to Pisa instead.

[rjs1]

  So far Bologna has not attracted the supporters I anticipated.

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That's probably why Bologna is so attractive - no tourist hordes, unlike Florence which has got increasingly like Oxford Street on the last Saturday before Christmas over the last twenty years or so. To be fair, Prato is fairly tourist free, probably becasue the outskirts are so hideous.

Anyway, don't you owe it to yourself to try Spaghetti Bolognese in Bologna?

[VivreManger]

Bologna proper seems no longer to be on the cheap routes. The traffic has moved to Forli. I have a distant cousin who used to run a very good simple restaurant outside Bologna, if I can meet up with her and her husband and hang out around town for a few hours, the detour might be worth it.

Florence during the first week of May should not be as intolerable as Florence at the height of the summer tourist season.

[albiston]

Anyway, don't you owe it to yourself to try Spaghetti Bolognese in Bologna?

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AAARRRRGGGGHHHH!!!

Sorry, I'll get a grip.

Nonetheless, if you are in a Bologna, asking for spaghetti Bolognese will immediately identify you as an ignorant foreigner (no offence meant). If you manage to find a good traditional trattoria, most of which now seem to be outside the city according to the locals, you should order Tagliatelle al Ragu.

Spaghetti bolognese is the southern Italian imitation of the dish which has unfortunately become widespread in Italian restaurants around the world. It's not half as good as the original.

Edited February 6, 2006 by albiston (log)

[hathor]

Bologna is worth more than a few hours!! We (my husband and I) love Bologna and try to think up 'excuses' to go there! There are excellent hotel bargains there as well.

Now, Forli is sort of interesting...and a few hours there is all that you need. But you need at least a day in Bologna.

[menton1]

Just a personal opinion, but I'll take Florence over Bologna any time. Much more charming, and, in spite of all the hype, I have found the Florentine cuisine to be the equal of Bologna. A much more attractive place too.

I know Bologna has its fans, but there is good reason why Florence is so much more popular. And you can't get Ribbollita in Bologna!!

[rjs1]

Anyway, don't you owe it to yourself to try Spaghetti Bolognese in Bologna?

←

AAARRRRGGGGHHHH!!!

Sorry, I'll get a grip.

Nonetheless, if you are in a Bologna, asking for spaghetti Bolognese will immediately identify you as an ignorant foreigner (no offence meant). If you manage to find a good traditional trattoria, most of which now seem to be outside the city according to the locals, you should order Tagliatelle al Ragu.

Spaghetti bolognese is the southern Italian imitation of the dish which has unfortunately become widespread in Italian restaurants around the world. It's not half as good as the original.

←

Sorry, my Italian accent is so bad I find it best to just point at what they're having at the next table and grunt hopefully. However, I've seen it on the menu as Spag Bol at every restaurant I've been to in Bologna and haven't been disappointed with the offering yet.

[albiston]

Sorry, my Italian accent is so bad I find it best to just point at what they're having at the next table and grunt hopefully.  However, I've seen it on the menu as Spag Bol at every restaurant I've been to in Bologna and haven't been disappointed with the offering yet.

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I have to admit that a place serving spaghetti bol in Bologna would make me very suspicious, but if you're happy I won't argue.

Still, next time you go there let me at least give you one or two addresses of places that do good traditional Bolognese cooking and, if you feel like it, try the tagliatelle al ragu there. Just to make me happy .

[menton1]

Ahh, Florence. The Ponte Vecchio, the Duomo, Michaelangelo, and: Ribbollita, Gnudi Ravioli, Bistecca, Penne ai fiori de zucca, Tagliatelle di cinghiale.

Who needs Bologna for great food?

Edited February 7, 2006 by menton1 (log)

[divina]

checking in from Florence...

why staying in Prato?

I think Adam has family there.. but not on my top 10 lists of places to stay.

It is a nice tiny downtown.

have you been to Florence before?

also why flying into Forli?

I think you can get cheap flights from stanstead to Bologna.. I just did BMI london Venice which was nice...

then stayed in Venice for a couple of days and trained down to Florence.

when I am flying to the states in March.. I am going up a day early to eat in Bologna.. and then it is easy to get to the airport by bus.

I have been living in Florence for 22 years.. so let me know if I can help..

[Adam Balic]

I would always take Bologna over Pisa, which is not as interesting as one might think. Also, while Italian trains are actually very good (and cheap), I would avoid Florence to Pisa on a Sunday (on the basis of one hellish experience).

Bologna is a lovely city, I like it a lot and the food can be wonderful even as clueless tourist. But Florence is once of the great cities of the world. It is simply wonderful and I never get tired of it. Yes, there are a lot of tourists, but we are all tourists when visiting these places and really, you make your own experiences.

Prato is not quite a suburb of Florence and while it is great for me and has some excellent shops, there are other places that are proberly more rewarding for a day trip.

[Adam Balic]

Anyway, don't you owe it to yourself to try Spaghetti Bolognese in Bologna?

←

AAARRRRGGGGHHHH!!!

Sorry, I'll get a grip.

Nonetheless, if you are in a Bologna, asking for spaghetti Bolognese will immediately identify you as an ignorant foreigner (no offence meant). If you manage to find a good traditional trattoria, most of which now seem to be outside the city according to the locals, you should order Tagliatelle al Ragu.

Spaghetti bolognese is the southern Italian imitation of the dish which has unfortunately become widespread in Italian restaurants around the world. It's not half as good as the original.

←

Tagliatelle al Ragu (Bolognese) surely?

[VivreManger]

divina Today, 02:54 PM

checking in from Florence...

why staying in Prato?

I think Adam has family there.. but not on my top 10 lists of places to stay. It is a nice tiny downtown.

The conference on medieval history which is hosting me is taking place in the medieval downtown of Prato. Colleagues have recommended the Hotel Giardino near the Duomo as a good place to stay.

I have studied Adam's Tuscan food diary with some care. I hope to try the local wares at biscottificio "Antonio Mattei". Do you know how far that is from the Duomo? I remember that you have recommended Luca Mannori. How far is Via Lazzerini 2 from the medieval center of town? His website is very snazzy, but user-hostile since it defies simple cutting and pasting of its practical details. Between Mattei and Mannori I seem to have located good places for gifts to bring to my hosts and family on my journey home. Even my Paris chocolate loving friends should accept pralines from Mannori. And the Mattei biscotti should be popular. Do you have any idea what their closing days are? How late they stay open? And if a Monday May Day will close everything?

Adam Balic mentioned that Monday is the market day in Prato. The Monday of my stay is a holiday, May Day, so I wonder if it will be open. I believe there is also a market held on Wednesday right near the Hotel Giardino. Given its location I would expect it to be much smaller than the regular Monday market and certainly smaller than the Mercato Centrale in Florence. May should be a good time to start getting some wonderful fruits and vegetables to stock my minibar. Can you advise me in general on market days, hours, and locations in the Prato-Firenze area?

have you been to Florence before?

Over nearly fifty years this is at least my tenth or more trip to Italy and perhaps my fifth or sixth to Florence and Tuscany. I have traveled by car, plane, and train through much of the country, from Sicily to Friuli and the Dolomites.

also why flying into Forli?

I think you can get cheap flights from stanstead to Bologna.. I just did BMI london Venice which was nice...

then stayed in Venice for a couple of days and trained down to Florence.

when I am flying to the states in March.. I am going up a day early to eat in Bologna.. and then it is easy to get to the airport by bus

Since my first message my plans have been set. Now it seems that Florence-Peretola-Amerigo Vespucci Airport will be open in time for my trip to a degree. My consideration of the Bologna-Forli-Pisa alternatives was based on the assumption that it would be totally closed. It seems that Meridiana airlines, the only one based in Florence, will resume flights prior to their competitors. Two calls to them brought this insistent claim. Given that Florence is their flight center, it is reasonable that they would have priority. As for the alternative airports with cheap flights, their availability varies with the day of the week. On some days Forli seemed the only airport with RyanAir flights from Stansted, but I have not studied the issue in full detail.

.

I have been living in Florence for 22 years.. so let me know if I can help..

There is a subject on which I could use some advice. On the Sunday of my arrival in Florence I have been thinking of renting a car with some conference colleagues and driving, more or less, toward Bologna to meet some cousins. from Rioveggio. They have just sold a restaurant they ran in Zola Predosa for many years and are taking a well-deserved sabbatical trip to East Asia so until their return sometime in early April, they are unconsultable. We would have to rent a car to meet them since the only vehicle they now own is a two-seater van they used for the business.

My first question concerns any unusual gastronomic destinations in that general area where we could all meet. It would be nice if there were some mid-point rustic country Apennine inn where we could all have a reunion and a wonderful meal under a pergola. The wrinkle is that it would have to be open on the Sunday of the May Day holiday weekend.

My second question concerns the difficulty of hiring a car for one day, Sunday to Monday, since so many rental offices seem to be closed. The conference starts Monday morning and I can't use a car from that point on. This problem is exacerbated by the fact that at this moment Florence Airport is closed so the car rental offices normally in business have reduced their hours as well and don't post when they will reopen. What they will do when Meridiana flies again remains to be sorted out. Related to that is the opening hours of gas stations on holiday weekends. I have fond memories of trying to fill the car's tank up before returning it to the rental office, passing chiuso after chiuso at the stations, until the one open station appeared out of this mirage.

If car rental proves too uncertain, another solution might be to meet in a country place accessible by public transport on a Sunday. Obviously they are willing to meet us in Florence or Prato, but Prato on a Sunday may be dreary. It would be a pity to waste my day free from the conference in town, even if it be Florence to which I will have easy access for the rest of the week.

By the way I enjoyed your St. John's blog, a favorite spot that I will be visiting on the outbound portion of this trip.

PS I see that Adam has just joined this conversation. Perhaps he can add his local expertise to the discussion. By now I hope you all understand why Prato. Fortunately I will avoid Pisa to Prato on Sunday, but airfares being what they are, I will have to manage Prato to Pisa on a Friday, when I fly to Paris. According to TrenItalia there is a two hour connection that will take me from the Porta al Seraglio to the Pisa airport with only one change of trains and more than 40 minutes to spare in case of delays. I should learn what hellish experience Adam had so I can be prepared for the worst.

Edited February 12, 2006 by VivreManger (log)

[Adam Balic]

Ah well, if it is a working trip then Prato is perfect. Everything is in walking distance in the walled part of the city. Give me a few days to think about it and I will put together a list of shops etc to visit. The large out door market in my travel blog is outside the city walls, behind the Univeristy, a ten minute walk from the Duomo only. "Antonio Mattei" is less then 2 minutes walk from the Duomo - even if you hop it on one leg.

[divina]

prato is perfect then...

Mattei as Adam said is right downtown, I like the Bar next door, Alla Mattonella.. hip and fun..

near the Duomo is fabulous.

Try Mattei's new biscotti line DESCO, Biscotti with pistacchio and a chocolate one, and then a line of butter cookies, Rose, and a chili and nuts one too.

Mannori is just outside the walls of the city,, ( heading towards the hospital West?) again Prato is small so an easy walk.

I am not sure if the car rental places will stay open, although the airport is closed.. makes sense for them to stay open as it was the only place to get a car on sunday!

training to Bologna is a good lunch spot.. any day.. and Sunday lunch is usually a great day to meet for lunch ( reservations a must)

Being that Monday is May 1st.. it is a long weekend for them... so driving isn't really a good idea..

I am sure Adam will have more practical info from Prato.

Edited February 12, 2006 by divina (log)

[albiston]

Tagliatelle al Ragu (Bolognese) surely?

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Depends who's talking . The Neapolitan me would definitely say ragu Bolognese, but my friends from Emilia Romagna would never. For them there's only one ragu .

[Pontormo]

You probably have made your plans already. However, if you are flying to the airport in Pisa through London, feel free to send a PM so that I might supply some explicit advice pertaining to one particular airline. When there is little time between connections in London and Pisa, you will probably not get your luggage for a day or two, so plan accordingly.

Since the conference is on medieval history, I am sure you know that Pisa and Lucca were the major cities in Tuscany back when Florence was not even a twinkle in its eye. In Prato, be sure to visit the Pinacoteca since there are some important Franciscan panel paintings..even if it's not as rich as the Pinacoteca in Pisa where there is room after room of important works, culminating in Donatello's reliquary bust for the skull of a martyred saint (check for the latch on the lid in back). In addition to Lippi's great fresco cycle in Prato's cathedral, see Donatello's wonderful architectural reliquary for the girdle Saint Thomas caught during the Assumption of the Virgin on a feast day ranked just below Christmas and Easter in Italy. I only ate lunch there, so haven't explored the culinary scene as much as Adam has. The pasta was fine.

I agree with everyone who glows about Bologna. If you arrive on train on the right morning, the food market is immediately to your left as you leave the station.

[VivreManger]

UPDATE

http://www.aeroporto.firenze.it/pagine/a_i...e/index-ing.htm

FLORENCE AIRPORT WILL REOPEN TO AIR TRAFFIC ON APRIL 8th 2006

Florence, March 14th 2006 - Aeroporto di Firenze AdF SpA informs that Florence Airport will reopen to air traffic on the April 8th 2006 if no exceptional and unpredictable events arise, well in advance respect to initial planning.

In the next days Airlines, informed by AdF, will organize the return of their flight operations to/from Florence Airport.

For further information and reservations on flights operated at Florence Airport from April 8th 2006, AdF invites passengers to contact their Travel Agent or the Airlines direct.