Have you, would you, could you take credit?

[bleudauvergne]

This brings up a question in my mind. What about a chef who supervises his staff but in essence all the work behind the meal is executed by his staff? He's the one shaking your hand at the door, and soaking up your adoring praises. Do you see him mentioning the people who actually toiled over the details there? Would you ever say that chef X is a fake or a liar because he relies on his staff to prepare certain elements of his dishes?

[Gifted Gourmet]

Do you see him mentioning the people who actually toiled over the details there?  Would you ever say that chef X is a fake or a liar because he relies on his staff to prepare certain elements of his dishes?

←

I think that everyone who eats in a fine restaurant assumes that most of the food itself is generally prepared by sous chefs and others in the kitchen ... with the chef having developed the dishes by him/herself and then prepared under his/her supervision.

[FabulousFoodBabe]

There was a store in a neighborhood where I lived long ago, that specialized in cooking for people -- in their dishes. You could bring the stuff to their shop or they'd come to your home for an extra fee, so the food smells would be wafting about when your guests arrived. They did a hell of a business!

[FabulousFoodBabe]

This brings up a question in my mind.  What about a chef who supervises his staff but in essence all the work behind the meal is executed by his staff?  He's the one shaking your hand at the door, and soaking up your adoring praises.  Do you see him mentioning the people who actually toiled over the details there?  Would you ever say that chef X is a fake or a liar because he relies on his staff to prepare certain elements of his dishes?

←

This is comparing apples and oranges. The thread is about taking credit for someone else's creation and execution.

Most of the chefs out there are responsible for all aspects of their foods' creation and execution -- and have often prepared the dish themselves many times before it gets onto the menu. Just because they're not cranking out 200 of them, themselves, during the night, doesn't make it any less their own food.

now, if a pastry chef takes credit for the executive chef's work, that's a different story.

[Gifted Gourmet]

Nope!  Lying like that is certainly immoral, possibly illegal but definitely not fattening so why bother?

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I think it has to do with preserving one's "image" maybe?

For an average cook, this represents an exceptional opportunity to be known for some culinary endeavor ... but if all anyone has had at one's home is an average tuna noodle casserole, it might seem odd to have the individual appear with a Tian De Courgettes Aux Fruits De Mer ...

[Dryden]

I've done this, but not in the way you'd usually expect. A few years ago, my sister made some food for a party we were throwing. It wasn't good, and it went over terribly. Because my wife and I were (and are) very good cooks, several people asked if we had actually made it, as it didn't taste like something we'd do. I knew my sister was mortified. I told them I made it, and that even people who cook as well as we usually do screw up every now and then.

My grandmother, though, was notorious for this. She used to take her pans to a local restaurant and have them cook in them. Once, for a large meal, she pulled an entire turkey out of the oven to great fanfare. No one commented on the fact that the bird had already been carved...

[Beanie]

My grandmother, though, was notorious for this.  She used to take her pans to a local restaurant and have them cook in them.  Once, for a large meal, she pulled an entire turkey out of the oven to great fanfare.  No one commented on the fact that the bird had already been carved...

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[Luckylies]

Shoot me, I've done it. there have been times when I've cooked an entire dinner party and the f'd somthing up royally It's usually to late to redo it (whatever it is) so it gets picked up by the boyfriend and nobody is the wiser...

this summer I spent all day on a fantstic bbq sauce and some smoked pork and brisket. I burned the sauce really badly, and had to doctor a store bought...after being asked by the first guest about the sauce (and being honest)... I was already kicking myself, for f'ing up so badly... I lied for the rest of the night just so I wouldnt have to tell the bbq sauce story over, and over again...

I've never passed food off otherwise...

[Gifted Gourmet]

Okay, I see now .. if it is a true food emergency and you have to come up with a dish because the one(s) you made flopped badly, it is then acceptable ...

That makes more sense ethically than simply substituting someone else's food as a whim or out of sheer laziness ...

[Luckylies]

I can't really imagine subbing on a whim, that's just...weird. Nonetheless it make me feel dorky and a bit like a food obsessive when I've fudged the results...

I work as a professional cook. Even within a restaurant -ideas are stolen and used by others, and credit is given where it is not due. You get over it...

Edited January 12, 2006 by Luckylies (log)

[Kim Shook]

Nope, couldn't do it. I am a natural born blabber and a terrible liar. I am the kind of person who confesses to using store bought mayonnaisse! I always assume that everything I eat in everyone else's house is from scratch, though and have embarrassed a few people by asking for their recipe !

[Mottmott]

No, if I haven't made it, I won't claim it.

I am guilty on the other side, though. Whenever my DIL serves quiche to her guests, I've made the pastry and prebaked it for her. I don't know - or care- whether she fesses up to not having made the pastry. But now I'm curious.

[Philanthrophobe]

No. It's not only pointlessly dishonest, it's pathetic in a very small sort of way.

[FabulousFoodBabe]

I work as a professional cook. Even within a restaurant -ideas are stolen and used by others, and credit is given where it is not due. You get over it...

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Me too. But the people who matter aren't fooled. Heck, in my experience, most people aren't fooled, in a professional or home setting.

[Megan Blocker]

I guess I just find the whole thing odd.

IMHO, there's nothing inherently embarrassing about not being able to cook or bake or both, but there is something embarrassing about serving tasteless or terrible food.

Much better to serve good store-bought than dreadful homemade.

[Gifted Gourmet]

Much better to serve good store-bought than dreadful homemade.

←

but who is to determine which is "dreadful"?

I think that a lot of people assume that purchased dishes are better than anything they might even attempt to make at home ... unless we are dealing with this eGullet community .. then, and only then, is it all moot ....

[Carrot Top]

How many chain restaurants have menus mostly composed of foods ordered in packages and reheated/dolled up?

[Carrot Top]

The answer is many. Include the family diner in this list and there will be a huge component of PROFESSIONALS who do this on a daily basis that make a good living doing it.

They have the titles of "chef", "cook", and "manager". And people pay to eat their food daily - tons of it.

Does the fact that this is the way America eats affect the home cook?

....................................................

On the other hand, how far does one take this in the other direction?

How many home cooks make their own pate brisee or puff pastry? Their own stocks or broths? Their own butter? Cheese?

Grow their own chickens? Raise their own lamb? Vegetables?

"Cooking" is a sum of many parts.

What finally hits the palate is affected as much by the original ingredient (that came from somewhere, was grown in some soil, fed on some grain or feed, butchered in some particular way, handled or aged or rushed to the market afterwards - each of these steps being performed by some human being highly competent in what they each do) as it is by the recipe (which someone developed and wrote down at some point) and by the chopping, combining, and heating or chilling that is done.

Selection of product in the store of course also affects the final product and to know how to buy well is an art or science of sorts and one that is affected by the depth of the pockets.

A simply shaved perfect truffle served over a plate of homemade (store-bought) pasta tossed with French butter.

Or a piece of bony chuck combined with packaged aromatics from the supermarket, cooked to perfection.

Which one demands more art? Of what sort? Who would be the "better" cook? The more "appreciated" cook?

.........................................................................

Each thing that we eat is combined of a multitude of small acts of collaboration.

(To good result or bad.)

Each thing that we eat should allow credit for more than just the final act.

The final act of cookery is only one small part of the whole.

So credit? Give it - don't worry about taking it.

The results will show.

Edited January 14, 2006 by Carrot Top (log)

[akebono]

no chance lance.

[fifi]

. . . . .

I confess I just can't get my brain wrapped around the mindset of someone who would attempt to pretend store-bought food was their own. I just can't identify with being so intimidated by cultural pressures, or so aggressive about wanting to impress, as to want to try to fool somebody that way. What's the point? Sooner or later the subterfuge will fall apart, and then you'd wind up looking like a total ass. And even if somehow you were never found out---well, geez, who would want to base any kind of relationship on silly little lies like that?

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mizducky expressed my sentiments better than I could have. She said so eloquently just what I was thinking. Yes, I do buy stuff to serve, quite often in fact. But that is usually in the dessert department. I am a really good cook but a lousy baker. I wouldn't inflict my pie crust on anyone, friend or foe. (Well . . . maybe some foes.) In that case, like mizducky, I boast about my shopping skills.

I also appreciate that kind of honesty in restaurants. One of my favorite hangouts is a casual seafood place on the bay. They serve some very ambitious food along with the old favorites like fried shrimp. There has been a lot of "buzz" in the past year about their desserts. Obviously, this type of operation doesn't have a pastry chef. If you ask about their Key Lime Pie (that everyone raves about) they don't tell you they made it but will tell you about the extensive tasting process they went through before selecting a supplier. Or they will tell you about the "little old lady" that makes their Blueberry Bread Pudding. To me, that says more about how much they care about what they serve than some stupid lie.

[rooftop1000]

I spent 8 yrs at an upscale takeout- catering- gourmet gift shop...beautiful store, concept, and execution.

Our very first catering order was some salads and poached lobster etc for 2. The client dropped off 2 dinner plates and requested the food delivered at 11:30am. The chef couldnt wrap her brain around the fact that the client couldnt even plate the food herself.( maybe she could have put it on a plate but not like it turned out)

We actually encouraged the nice young ladies who had married well to hide the takeout containers and knew most of them would.

Bringing a baking dish to the caterer isn't a bad idea anyway...better than putting a foil pan on the table.

and someone once told me that if you slip a Mrs. Jones fozen pie into your pie dish and defrost it before baking it will conform to you dish

tracey

cant afford most take out anyway