Guidelines for Dairy Substitution?

[sun]

Hiya. I've searched and run across a few mentions of using trans-fat free butter substitutes (e.g. in keeping kosher), but I can't find a lot of information directly about the best kinds of butter, milk, cream, yogurt, etc. substitutes. I was wondering if the helpful and knowledgeble people here could help me.

I can and do eat dairy occaisonally, but too much gives me a very stuffed up nose. I hate that. (Back in college before I realized that lactose intolerance wasn't my only dairy issue, I kept telling my eating buddies not to try out the food on my tray bc I thought I was coming down with something. They learned to ignore me bc they never came down with my "colds." )

I use both real and fake dairy when I cook and bake. But I don't cook or bake regularly, and when I do, I will try to use recipes calling for little or no dairy.

Does anybody use dairy substitutes regularly? Have you ever been surprised at how much difference the sub made? Especially for baking, where exactness matters a lot more than for cooking, are there recipes where the dairy can't be substituted or omitted? Do you have favorites kinds or brands of dairy substitutes?

Thanks for any input!

Sun

[Eden]

Sun,

Do you also have problems with Sheep & Goat milk products or just Cow? I do a fair amount of subbing for dairy intolerant friends using milk from other herbivores...

Eden

[Pam R]

I use dairy subs constantly (due to kashrut, as you mentioned). Do they completely duplicate the flavours of the dairy products? No. Are they still good? Yes. Many people turn their noses up at non-dairy subs - but I'm not one of them.

The one item that is hard to replace it whipping cream - the non-dairy stuff just isn't the same. The best you can do is doctor it up with some liquor or other flavours.

If a recipe calls for butter I use Fleishman's margarine or crisco - depending on the recipe. I'm starting to experiment with the butter-flavoured crisco, but haven't done enough to comment on it yet.

If a recipe calls for milk/cream (not whipped), I will sub either water or non-dairy creamer. I'm not a fan of soy milk, but I've been meaning to do some baking with potato milk. I've baked cakes, made genache, icings and soups with non-dairy creamers.

I've baked cheesecakes using soy cream cheese - and a recipe calling for sour cream, replaced with soy sour cream. I love the soy cheesecakes.

I buy ready-to-use puff pastry - it's non-dairy but tastes buttery (I don't think I want to know how they get it to taste so good!)

There's lots you can do without the dairy - you just have to be willing to experiment.

Edited July 5, 2005 by Pam R (log)

[sun]

Eden, I tried goat milk once (from one of those ultra-pasteurized cartons) and had to spit it out. I really disliked the taste. Soy milk works well for most of my "milk" needs, so I haven't felt a real drive to spend the money and energy to experiment with other animal milks. Thanks for the tip that sheep's milk might be okay. I will try it one day.

Pam, I definately ran across posts of yours when I was searching for dairy substitution threads!

...

If a recipe calls for butter I use Fleishman's margarine or crisco - depending on the recipe.  I'm starting to experiment with the butter-flavoured crisco, but haven't done enough to comment on it yet.

If a recipe calls for milk/cream (not whipped), I will sub either water or non-dairy creamer.  I'm not a fan of soy milk, but I've been meaning to do some baking with potato milk.  I've baked cakes, made genache, icings and soups with non-dairy creamers.

←

There has been so much negative research recently about trans-fats. I haven't looked closely at Crisco or Fleishman's margarine recently, but I assume those are still made with trans-fats? I've done a little baking with Earth Balance Buttery Sticks (trans-fat free) and it turned out okay. Have you tried any of the trans-fat free margarines yourself?

Awesome! non-dairy creamer!

This is wonderful info. I'm really glad you guys are on EGullet and willing to share your experiences with other members. Thank you.

[Jujubee]

There has been so much negative research recently about trans-fats.  I haven't looked closely at Crisco or Fleishman's margarine recently, but I assume those are still made with trans-fats?  I've done a little baking with Earth Balance Buttery Sticks (trans-fat free) and it turned out okay.  Have you tried any of the trans-fat free margarines yourself?

←

Crisco has come out with a 0 Trans Fat Shortening. I haven't tried it myself, but I read a review in a food section of a newspaper and they had pretty similar results using regular Crisco and this new Crisco.

http://www.crisco.com/about/prod_info.asp?...63&FlavorId=344

I have tried Spectrum Organic Shortening, which is also trans fat free, but only in recipes that originally called for shortening, not butter. It worked fine, though I didn't bother to do a comparison with regular shortening.

[Gifted Gourmet]

one option with good ideas

another option .. good reading and ideas here!

even more from the Humane Society, no less!

Hope you find something helpful among these links!

[Eden]

Eden, I tried goat milk once (from one of those ultra-pasteurized cartons) and had to spit it out.  I really disliked the taste.  Soy milk works well for most of my "milk" needs, so I haven't felt a real drive to spend the money and energy to experiment with other animal milks.  Thanks for the tip that sheep's milk might be okay.  I will try it one day.

Eww! I hate that stuff. When I was young we lived in a place where I got fresh goat milk all the time After we moved I didn't have any for ages, and I remember bugging my mom to buy me a carton at the store thinking it was the same - when she finally broke down (it was WAY expensive comparatively) and got me some I was appalled! I thought the carton must have gone bad or something

If you have access inyour area to the fresh stuff get it - otherwise give the carton stuff a miss!

However, there's a brand of goat butter (Meyenbauer?) that whole foods & some other stores around here carry that is really quite good, no goatiness, just butteriness. a bit pricey, but there are just some dishes which really require true butter...

The sheep butter I've had (Pappilon from France) was excellent also.

You do have to be careful. the previous brand of goat butter I bought at a store was unfortunately more like a buttery goat cheese - way too much goat flavor to use as butter.

And goat yoghurt is basically interchangable with regular yogurt & makes a nice sub, if you take the time to drain it a little first, for sour cream...

Oh we made a coconut icecream for a friend a few weeks back now mixing CocoLoco and RiceDream 50/50. Dairyfree coconuty ice-cream goodness. Try it - I guarantee it will make you say "who needs cows"

[halloweencat]

i will add another vote for earth balance "butter." it's just as sweet as butter, more or less, but it still tastes rich, and works well in my baking.

it doesn't taste as heavy as butter (which i like, as i no longer like the taste of butter or cream).

cheers :)

hc

[sun]

Eden, I'm so happy to hear that goat milk doesn't always taste that bad! I so wanted to enjoy the taste of the carton goat milk and was sad spitting it out.

I love these suggestions -- esp. smoke tofu and the oil-cured black olives -- from Gifted Gourmet's Humane Society link:

Use to Replace Cheese

soy cheese

soft tofu + a dash of lemon juice instead of cottage or ricotta cheese in dips, sauces, smoothies, and pies

smoked tofu instead of provolone and mozzarella

oil-cured black olives instead of Parmesan or Romano cheese

nutritional yeast flakes

[Pam R]

There has been so much negative research recently about trans-fats.  I haven't looked closely at Crisco or Fleishman's margarine recently, but I assume those are still made with trans-fats?  I've done a little baking with Earth Balance Buttery Sticks (trans-fat free) and it turned out okay.  Have you tried any of the trans-fat free margarines yourself?

←

Until VERY recently (I'm talking about a month) the only completely non-dairy margarines I've been able to get in these parts are Fleishman's and Mother's. I just bought my first tub (no sticks ) of Earth Balance but haven't done anythign with it yet. It's on the expensive side for me to use at work - unless I can find a distributor for it - buying it retail for the quantities I need won't work.

I'm very interesting in trying the new crisco.

When I was in Toronto last year I tried some tofu mousse at Whole foods. Apparently it's just a matter of tossing some soft tofu in a food processor with flavourings - I'm sure there are tons of recipes for it online.

I also just discovered soy yogurt - I'm on a restrictive diet over the next month or so (trying to pinpoint some allergies) so I'm unable to try many things now - but I'm really interested in this - anybody else tried it?

as for Goats .... I've never tried the milk, but I'm definately a fan of goat-feta. - I liketo crumble a little into a quiche or eggs. Carmelized onion tart with some on top is amazing... that sort of thing.

I know I just mentioned the potato milk thing above - but it's supposed to be very good for people with allergies (unless, of course you're allergic to potatoes!). I've tried it in coffee - and would be hard pressed to tell the difference between it and coffee with milk. On it's own, it's definately not milk - but in other things it's very good. It doesn't have that gritty texture issue that I don't like about soy milk.

We've used some of the soy cheeses (how else do you make a kosher ruben?). I try to like them, but I find it hard. There may be better products out there - but the kosher issue limits me. I do like the soy cream cheese and sour creams though (tofutti I think).

Edited July 6, 2005 by Pam R (log)

[bloviatrix]

According to Levana Kirschenbaum in her book Levana's Table the substitue for buttermilk is combination of soy milk and lemon juice. The ratio is 1 tablespoon of lemon juice to 1 cup of soy milk. I've never tried it, but I've had luck with some of her other suggestions.

[Verjuice]

I actually prefer almond milk to regular milk in my breakfast cereal, provided that it's not too gritty in texture. Hazelnut milk is also pretty good.

The almond milk is light and mildly sweet and redolent of marzipan. I can't stand molk cold soy and rice milks because they have a tendency to get chalky and grainy.

That said, I will occasionally order a soy latte for sentimental reasons. I got hooked on the taste of hot soy milk a couple of years back. It's good: warm and earthy like a barnyard.

There are oat and multigrain milks out there, too.