Identifying and Using Old Le Creuset

[wkl]

I recenetly purchased a 5 qt cast iron dutch oven and I'm pretty sure it is Le Crueset.The design is very similiar to the current models.However it doesn't have the ceramic coating.

Does anyone have any experience with these pieces?Do they need to be cared for (ie washed,or used on certain heat settings) differently?Will certain foods react to exposed cast iron interior?Is there a "life" these have before imparting any kind of "off" flavors to food?

Thanks.

[slkinsey]

If it does not have a ceramic coating, it is highly unlikely it is Le Creuset. Sounds like a regular raw cast iron Dutch Oven to me, and you should treat it as you would any piece of cast iron (seasoning, etc.). There are, of course, serious limitations that come along with uncoated cast iron. I wouldn't use it to cook anything acidic (e.g., with tomatoes) and I wouldn't use it to cook anything for a long time. Some people don't mind the iron taste, though, so ymmv.

[wkl]

I used to own some uncoated Le Cresuet (unless my memory is failing) it was a long wooden handled sautee pan that had a non stick coating that slowly peeled away, so I tossed it.

Have they always had made their cookware with the ceramic coating?

[JAZ]

Some Le Creuset pieces are made with a matte black enamel coating on the interior -- skillets and grill pans, primarily. It looks much like uncoated cast iron, but is duller and entirely black. I don't think they ever made the casseroles with that finish, though. And with the exception of the reversible grill/griddle, all of their pieces will have the hard colored enamel coating on the outside.

Staub, which is another French manufacturer of coated cast iron cookware, is a different story. All of their pieces have the matte black enamel interior; some also have that finish on the outside of the pot as well. The round casseroles are very similar to LC in shape, although the lids look different, and the knobs are brass, not the black bake-lite type material that the LC knobs are made from.

[slkinsey]

You can usually tell if it's Staub (my favorite) by the nodules on the underside of the lid.

wkl: afaik Le Creuset has always made enameled cookware. The following is from the Le Creuset web site:

All the Le Creuset cookware is made from enameled cast iron. Cast iron has been used for cooking utensils since the Middle Ages. The Le Creuset factory is at Fresnoy-Le-Grand in Northern France.

In 1925, the foundry began producing Cast Iron by hand-casting molten cast iron in sand molds-still the most delicate stage of the production process. Even today, after casting, each mold is destroyed and the cookware is polished and sanded by hand then scrutinized for imperfections. Once declared good for enameling, the items are sprayed with two separate coats of enamel and fired after each process at a temperature of 800°C.

[jayt90]

wkl: afaik Le Creuset has always made enameled cookware. 

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The above is imply not true. I have several Le Creuset pots and pans, from the early 70's, which are lined with a semi-smooth black surface designed to imitate Teflon, although it was not supposed to be non stick. After some use, it flaked and scaled and went to my basement, or under a plant. But it was stamped Le Creuset, and it did not have a smooth creamy enamel lining...

Edited November 10, 2004 by jayt90 (log)

[slkinsey]

wkl: afaik Le Creuset has always made enameled cookware. 

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The above is imply not true. I have several Le Creuset pots and pans, from the early 70's, which are lined with a semi-smooth black surface designed to imitate Teflon, although it was not supposed to be non stick. After some use, it flaked and scaled and went to my basement, or under a plant. But it was stamped Le Creuset, and it did not have a smooth creamy enamel lining...

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According to their own PR and marketing material, they make enameled cast iron.

What was on the outside of those pans if not enamel? What you describe sounds like they sprayed on a nonstick coating over enamel. It's pretty unlikely that they were or are applying the nonstick coating directly to raw cast iron. What is more likely that they don't use the familiar creamy white enamel when they are going to be applying a nonstick coating, and use a different base coat of enamel instead. That is exactly what is indicated on pages like this one, which says: "Le Creuset's unique Nonstick process combines a special base coat enamel plus three coats of Silverstone® Nonstick finish to the Le Creuset cast iron cookware."

[wkl]

In my initial post what I meant was that the interior or cooking surface was not coated.The outside is coated with a orange enamel.That's why I was wondering about food developing off flavors.

There was definetly Le Cresuet produced with a non stick or teflon like coating as oppossed to the creamy coating of today, on the cooking surface.

To belabor this, this particular piece doesn't have the black knob on the lid.There is a depression in the center of the lid with a thin strip or "bridge" of iron which you can grab to lift off the lid.Also, there is the familiar circumfrence size stamped or imbedded on the underside of the lid and the bottom of the pot. In this case a 26.I think this means it is the 5 quart size.Prehaps alot of French cookware has this size marking on it?

Anyway, It looks alot like Le Cresuet.

[slkinsey]

So, you're saying that the exterior is coated with enamel but the interior is raw cast iron? Are you sure it isn't coated with a different kind of coating on the inside? I just can't imagine why anyone would go to the trouble of enameling the outside of a piece of cookware and leave the inside raw.

To clarify re Le Creuset nonstick, it appears to me as thought the nonstick coating is applied over a base coat of enamel rather than directly onto raw cast iron.

[wkl]

The exterior is coated with enamel, the interior feels a little rough and "iron like" much like a Lodge pan.I'm just not sure if it is raw cast iron or not.My guess is the interior is similiar to those old black cast iron pans.

[trillium]

They make something they call matte enamel like JAZ said, here in the US you mostly see it on grill pans and fry pans. It's a little sparkly almost, and rough, and finishes similiarly to a raw cast iron, but doesn't react with acid in its bare state. And they do make casseroles and ovens with that interior coating, just not for the North American market. I have a couple of the marmites in 2 different sizes with this finish and I adore them. I think they were originally for the Australian market. Go figure...

I also have some really old Le Creuset ovens that don't have black knobs, they have a cast piece for the handle that is coated in the same enamel on the outside as the rest of the pot. They're coated inside with a grey enamel. Lastly, I have a crepe pan that is raw cast iron, no enamel at all, and is made by Le Creuset. HTH!

regards,

trillium

[bleachboy]

I have a dutch oven too, that I bought as a "second" at the Le Creuset outlet, that has a raw cast iron interior -- although I suppose it could be the "matte black" coating metioned before. Not sure how I could tell. I use it as a pot for baked beans exclusively, as it's very attractive that way.

[jayt90]

My Creusets were neither cast iron on the inside, nor were they enamel. They were definitely not Teflon, aand they did not scratch, they peeled . The product is not well known, and it disappeared by '75. But they flaked and deteriorated with use, the cook-ware stores in my area did not continue to sell them. When the flakes came off, there was cast iron exposed.

I can't see the point in defending Creuset for a bad product sold over a short period of time.

[wkl]

My Creusets were neither cast iron on the inside, nor were they enamel. They were definitely not Teflon, aand they  did not scratch, they peeled .  The product is not well known, and it disappeared by '75.   But they flaked and deteriorated with use, the cook-ware stores in my area did not continue to sell them.  When the flakes came off, there was cast iron exposed.

I can't see the point in defending Creuset for a bad product  sold over a short period of time.

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We're not defending anything.Just verifying if they existed or not.

Edited November 10, 2004 by wkl (log)

[slkinsey]

Oh, I'm not defending them. It was just counter to the other information I've read, including their own materials. But it's entirely possible they applied a nonstick coating to raw cast iron for a short period of time until they figured out it was a horrible idea.

I'm still inclined to think wkl's pan is coated with LC's "black stuff."

I am thinking here mostly of cocottes (aka French ovens). As Trillium points out, Le Creuset does make raw cast iron crêpières.

[jayt90]

Oh, I'm not defending them.  It was just counter to the other information I've read, including their own materials.  But it's entirely possible they applied a nonstick coating to raw cast iron for a short period of time until they figured out it was a horrible idea.

I'm still inclined to think wkl's pan is coated with LC's "black stuff." 

I am thinking here mostly of cocottes (aka French ovens).  As Trillium points out, Le Creuset does make raw cast iron crêpières.

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Well. we know it is not Teflon , or cast iron on the inside, but we still don't know what it is, or why they stopped. I can assure you it was not a Teflon knock-off, it was more like a roughly sanded ceramic. It was described by LC as the latest coating material, less likely to stick and easier to clean.

After that purchase, I avoided any Creuset for at least 20 years, until they demonstrated long term sensibility.

Even now, I would look at Creuset knock offs, such as La Campagne, at Hudson's Bay. These are Chinese, 1/3 the price, and not as well finished. But they may do the job as well as my '75 Creusets.

[Richard Kilgore]

wkl -- Can you post a photo of your mystery pot?

Does it say France on it anywhere? Anything in addition to "26"?

In tracking down the origin of a mystery French Oven on another thread, I discovered that the same company that makes Staub also makes several other lines of French ovens, all of which have the basting knobs on the lid, as Sam described, or in the case of the Bocuse branded ones, knobby ridges in the lid for the same effect.

So any ridges or tiny knobs in the lid?

[wkl]

Richard,

I'll try and post a photo.It may take a little while, however.

It doesn't say "France" anywhere.Just the 26 on the inside of lid and on the bottom of oven.There are no knobs, just some raised circles on top of lid that are only for decoration.There are two or three each smaller and inside the one previous to it. (Confusing,yes, but I don't know how else to describe them)

Trillium ,reply #11, describes the handle on the lid better than I did.His/Her description of a cast piece in the same enamel is exactly what I have.

It would be interesting to find out the origin of this piece.

[Richard Kilgore]

Hmmm. The ridges and little knobs (much like the point of a pencil) Sam and I are talking about are on the inside of the lid.

[wkl]

Hmmm. The ridges and little knobs (much like the point of a pencil) Sam and I are talking about are on the inside of the lid.

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Embossed on the bottom of the pot are the letters "CLUS" and next to that the numbers 551&751.

Does this mean anything to anyone?Thanks.

[fifi]

wkl... Is that a typo? Is it actually "LCUS"? That would say to me that it is a pot that was made for the US market. None of my LC has any 3 digit numbers but they are all rather new.

I did notice one thing, however. The bottom of my gratins appear to be raw cast iron. However, they actually have a "clear" base coat that I understand is applied prior to the enamel. The enamel is left off of the bottom of the gratins. This surface matches what you are describing more closely. I have a grill pan with the black coating and it looks nothing like the bottom of the gratins.

This is pure speculation... I wonder if early on, when LC was being introduced into the US market, they wanted to have a product that was not too far removed from the cast iron that our market was familiar with. That kind of marketing strategy may explain what seems illogical to us now... enameled exterior and bare interior. Today, we see that as being kinda nuts. Back then, the market may have been somewhat "suspicious" of the new concept and reluctant to give up the cast iron that they knew and loved. Then, when consumers saw the avantage of the coating, they introduced the fully coated products. Just a theory.

[slkinsey]

I did notice one thing, however. The bottom of my gratins appear to be raw cast iron. However, they actually have a "clear" base coat that I understand is applied prior to the enamel.

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Just FYI, the clear base coat is also enamel. This is from Le Creuset's UK site:

Each piece of Le Creuset receives two coats of enamel. The first is a ground coat which once fired at 840°C is clear and uncoloured. This allows for better adhesion of the second coat, the coloured enamel, to the cast iron. This special colour coat is applied internally and externally. After the enamel is applied it is air dried before being vitrified to produce a highly durable, hygienic and shock resistant finish.

This is from Le Creuset's Australian site:

Two layers of enamel are applied to all Le Creuset cookware. The initial, colourless ground coat protects against rust. A second coat of coloured enamel is then applied; giving the exterior its trademark colour and the interior a durable sand or matt black enamel finish. The rim is not covered with the second coat to allow a closer fit between the lid and base, enhancing self-basting properties of the piece. The enamel is then air dried before being vitrified at over 800°C to produce a highly durable and shock resistant finish.

Interesting how they both give information that the other doesn't have.

[wkl]

wkl... Is that a typo? Is it actually "LCUS"? That would say to me that it is a pot that was made for the US market. None of my LC has any 3 digit numbers but they are all rather new.

I did notice one thing, however. The bottom of my gratins appear to be raw cast iron. However, they actually have a "clear" base coat that I understand is applied prior to the enamel. The enamel is left off of the bottom of the gratins. This surface matches what you are describing more closely. I have a grill pan with the black coating and it looks nothing like the bottom of the gratins.

This is pure speculation... I wonder if early on, when LC was being introduced into the US market, they wanted to have a product that was not too far removed from the cast iron that our market was familiar with. That kind of marketing strategy may explain what seems illogical to us now... enameled exterior and bare interior. Today, we see that as being kinda nuts. Back then, the market may have been somewhat "suspicious" of the new concept and reluctant to give up the cast iron that they knew and loved. Then, when consumers saw the avantage of the coating, they introduced the fully coated products. Just a theory.

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Fifi,

It is definetly CLUS.Maybe this isn't LC afterall.

However, the top of the lid has the same rasied circles that new LC has.The only difference is the newer LC has Le Cresuet embossed on the top of the lid.Mine does not.Last night I placed this mystery piece next to a new piece of LC and they look remarkably similiar.(to me anyway)Also, the orange color is darker at the base of the dutch oven and gradually lightens as it comes to the top of the pot.Same dark to light on the lid from the outer rim to the center of lid.You also see this on newer LC pieces.I just bought a red 2 1/2 qt dutch oven and there is a similiar pattern of dark to lighter color.

The bottom of the pan appears to be "raw " cast iron.The colored enamel doesn't continue across the bottom of the pot.

[fifi]

Now I am getting really curious. There is a contact page for LC - US here. It might be interesting to contact them about this pot. It would be really great if they could come up with a history and product information on LC in the US and other parts of the world. (I don't see a way to send them a picture though.) I did that with Calphalon recently and got quite a comprehensive reply that we all found interesting. I included a link to the eGullet discussion topic for them. Hey... That is how you could show them a picture or pictures.

[wkl]

I called LC and they said they have no way of vintage dating their products.They said the flame orange color I have was the original LC color and they still produce it.The handle I described, they stopped making about 10 years ago.The CLUS stamp was not familiar to them.

I didn't really intend this thread to be a inquiry a sto the origin of this piece, but it is interestng.Wonder what that CLUS stamp stands for?