In China and eating

[jokhm]

ah and gary, thanks for the words of encouragement. Without people's interest I'd quickly begin to question my own. Since this obsession of mine borders along the insane.. but look how many others are into it!!

Herbacidal.. I hope to be back in Chengdu for more food and photos to make up for the short amount of time spent in such a rich area. Is that wrong of me? Am I nuts to go so far to eat in place that I've already visited? Am I giving up many other important things to do this? heh,,, I'll see I guess

[jo-mel]

jokhm -- I googled "Chinese menu translations" and came across these two sites:

http://asiarecipe.com/chimenu.html

http://onefootprint.com/news/downloads/ch-en-menudoc.doc

They both have pin yin, but the first one is limited, as far as variety. The second one is quite complete, however, the pinyin is kinda screwed up. For instance, the first item:

Spiced Snow Peas has the pin yin reading as:

me iwe ihe la ndo u ------------The spacing throws you off. It should read"

mei wei he lan dou

Don't know if this helps or hinders!

[herbacidal]

Well, if you're okay with going to go back to places you've been,

I'd go back to Yunnan and check out Dali, Xishuangbanna, Kunming and Lijiang.

Although I'm curious if you've been to some of these places already since you've been to Tiger Leaping Gorge. But I'm guessing there's at least some of those you haven't been to.

[hzrt8w]

http://onefootprint.com/news/downloads/ch-en-menudoc.doc

.....

me iwe ihe la ndo u ------------The spacing throws you off. It should read"

mei wei he lan dou

LOL. At first I thought I was reading some Japanese or other languages.

I took a glance at the second link. It is a very interesting menu translation. Especially there is one item unter "Specialty Dishes":

"Stick-cracked monkey's head". It is a direct translation of the Chinese name 棒打猴头. Does anybody know what it is? I don't think they are serving monkey's head, are they?

[Gary Soup]

I took a glance at the second link. It is a very interesting menu translation. Especially there is one item unter "Specialty Dishes":

"Stick-cracked monkey's head". It is a direct translation of the Chinese name 棒打猴头. Does anybody know what it is? I don't think they are serving monkey's head, are they?

I don't think you want to know what that is.

[jokhm]

Wow....!! That DOC file is unbelievable.

I can work with the pin yin, just have to put it back together in my head.

So.. umm.. really, what's the monkey stuff about?

I never did make it to tiger leaping gorge. Too ambitious a travel plan, especially immediately after emei shan. What was I thinking!? On the other hand, the day I would have gone I met a fantastic couple moving up from Yunnan through Sichuan who informed me that it was currently closed for rain. Good thing I left it alone. So yes, I will definitely be heading to Kunming, Dali, lijian... maybe Xichuangbanna, though I've been just south of there in Northen Laos 3 months ago. Yunnan appears to be jam packed with great things to see. I'm looking forward to it, or really to just getting back to China again.

[jo-mel]

Don't forget the Stone Forest in Kunming. Interesting!

I was with a travel agent friend, and we stayed at the Stone Forest Hotel. My food log shows that at breakfast there was a rice noodle dish with pork, red pepper, and salted vegetable that was "spicy and good". I also had a note saying 'coffee - I think it was coffee'!! LOL!

I'm really enjoying your trip!

[Gary Soup]

So.. umm.. really, what's the monkey stuff about?

Relax, it's illegal, so you aren't likely to encounter it, unless you're a filthy rich and depraved businessman with connections.

There's a fairly sanitized reference to the notorious monkey brain dish in this article. Even so, it's not for the squeamish.

It's the Year of the Monkey, After All.

No recipes for Jo-mel, either.

BTW, Shanghainese people seem to think that this is what Cantonese people have for dinner every day.

Edited August 26, 2004 by Gary Soup (log)

[hzrt8w]

There's a fairly sanitized reference to the notorious monkey brain dish in this article. Even so, it's not for the squeamish.

I am aware of the practice of eating monkey brain. But I don't think what's on that menu is real monkey brain but just a name for something that resembles "stick cracked monkey head". For one thing, the name is quoted in "double quotes" while no other names were quoted. For another thing, there is no way you can buy a real monkey brain dish for only RMB 18 (or roughly US $3).

[Gary Soup]

I am aware of the practice of eating monkey brain.  But I don't think what's on that menu is real monkey brain but just a name for something that resembles "stick cracked monkey head".  For one thing, the name is quoted in "double quotes" while no other names were quoted.

The linked "menu" didn't appear to represent any particular restaurant, and it was my impression was that it was a composite or prototype offered as an example of a translation company's work. I took the "monkey head" entry as an attempt at humor, albeit a tasteless one.

For another thing, there is no way you can buy a real monkey brain dish for only RMB 18 (or roughly US $3).

I don't think the RMB has been that high in 15 years; it would be more like $2.20 now.

[hzrt8w]

The linked "menu" didn't appear to represent any particular restaurant, and it was my impression was that it was a composite or prototype offered as an example of a translation company's work.

It seems that the linked "menu" might have been taken from a real restaurant who had gone through the trouble of translating the dishes that they offered. They included very realistic prices for each dish.

I thought "stick cracked monkey head" might have been a "look-alike" name for a dish, such as "ants on a tree" or Shanghai's "lion head".

[herbacidal]

For another thing, there is no way you can buy a real monkey brain dish for only RMB 18 (or roughly US $3).

I don't think the RMB has been that high in 15 years; it would be more like $2.20 now.

Yea, you're about right.

Evidently, the current rate is about 1-8.28, so that'd be about $2.17.

[liuzhou]

The Yuan is pegged to the US Dollar and so, the exchange rate stays the same. It has been 8.28 for almost as long as I can remember.

[Qing]

If you want to try the best food in China, the simplest way is to follow the crowed. On the other hand you may need couple of more preparations:

1.You must be brave! Any ingredients or the methods to cook won’t scare you.

2.You need a strong stomach, or even stronger than strong. Sometimes the good restaurants do not have enough time to clean themselves very well.

3.Never go to the restaurants in hotels, for they are expensive and the foods are all “unified.” There is not too much chance for the chef to show their creativities in hotels’ banquets.

4.If possible, follow a local friend, but not the tour guides.

[Gary Soup]

The Yuan is pegged to the US Dollar and so, the exchange rate stays the same. It has been 8.28 for almost as long as I can remember.

You must be a youngster, Liuzhou. I think it was under 6 RMB per dollar in 1992 when I first started going to China. In those days, actually, foreigners could only buy "FEC", not real RMB, legally, but you could sell them at a premium on the street for RMB.

But what does this have to do with food? It means that you can buy the world's best xiaolong bao for about 7 cents per baozi

[chengb02]

3.Never go to the restaurants in hotels, for they are expensive and the foods are all “unified.” There is not too much chance for the chef to show their creativities in hotels’ banquets.

I agree with everything you said, except this point, as firm and fast rules. For the most part, it is true, but there are some hotels (mostly the upscale ones) that are doing some interesting things. I try to avoid eating in hotels, but I dropped that principle for a meal at Made in China in the Grand Hyatt Beijing and was very impressed with the food. Sure, the prices were far more than what they would be anywhere else, but the food had some elements (for the most part) that made it worth the price, it was clean, and a very nice dining room. I also remember a meal a few years ago at the Shangri-La Wuhan where they were doing an all you can eat dim sum for a moderate price that was terrific. However, these are just exceptions to the rule, as my meal at Jing confirmed, hotel dining is typically very uninspired and the prices are jacked up.

[herbacidal]

The Yuan is pegged to the US Dollar and so, the exchange rate stays the same. It has been 8.28 for almost as long as I can remember.

You must be a youngster, Liuzhou. I think it was under 6 RMB per dollar in 1992 when I first started going to China. In those days, actually, foreigners could only buy "FEC", not real RMB, legally, but you could sell them at a premium on the street for RMB.

But what does this have to do with food? It means that you can buy the world's best xiaolong bao for about 7 cents per baozi

Well yea, to the best of my knowledge, it's still pegged, despite indication they'll be changing that within the next few years.

I was using what I saw here as accurate.

Interestingly, I did the conversion again today, and they used the 8.28 rate.

[Laksa]

Sometimes the good restaurants do not have enough time to clean themselves very well.

This brought a smile to my face. Well said!

[hzrt8w]

2.You need a strong stomach, or even stronger than strong. Sometimes the good restaurants do not have enough time to clean themselves very well.

I grew up in Hong Kong so I have a fairly "strong" stomach. My wife, on the other hand, grew up in the USA and she does not have the same immune system as I do. When she first visited Hong Kong, I took her out to sample lots of street food. The day after, she developed a severe stomachache. She ended up lying on the hotel bed for almost a week. From that experience, she would never touch any food from street vendors again.

Last time we went to Beijing, we just went to Wangfujing to "look" at the food street. The food was highly tempting... but... she didn't have any.

While there is no guarantee that what they cook in restaurants will be cleaner than the street vendors, which one would you rather trust? The ones in hotel restaurants or more established restaurants or the ones on the street?

All it comes to is be aware of the consequences and take a more informed risk. Be aware of that if you grew up in a relatively gem free environment such as the USA, you may not have the same immunity to certain bacteria as people who grew up elsewhere. Would you be willing to risk lying on the bed for days during your limited vacation time in a foreign land in exchange for a "cheaper" or "tastier" local meal? Make sure you have the "stomach" (pun intended) for it. My wife and I choose clean as the number one criteria over taste in deciding where to eat.

Edited August 27, 2004 by hzrt8w (log)

[Laksa]

I grew up in Hong Kong so I have a fairly "strong" stomach. My wife, on the other hand, grew up in the USA and she does not have the same immune system as I do.

I think the good news is, given enough time, a traveller can gain immunity to the "germs" that don't appear to trouble the local residents.

The bad news for a "local" is that if you spend enough time away, you could lose the immunity that you had developed in childhood.

When I first went back to Malaysia after spending many years abroad, I went through several weeks of agony. I didn't care because I wanted to eat the tasty stuff and I could cope well enough with some medication.

After some time, I no longer needed any medication.

[liuzhou]

You must be a youngster, Liuzhou.

Quite the reverse! An oldie. Hence the short memory!

What were we talking about?

[jo-mel]

In China, I have eaten in just about every venue possible, over a span of 13 years --- Top hotels, bottom hotels, clean places, spit-on-the-floor places, touristy places, strickly Chinese places, peoples homes, train food, boat food, street food, plane food, tent above/dirt below places, dormatory food, train station kiosk food----what have I left out?

With all that -- I was sick only once, in China, and charcoal took care of it in a day. No one else with me became sick, so it still mystifies me.

I also became sick from mussels, here in New Jersey, at a respected restaurant. (The Great Ko Shing)

So I guess it depends if you are in the wrong place at the wrong time. Some places I used my own chopstick & bowl, and sometimes, in questionable places, I only ate stuff right out of boiling water/oil or a grill and into my own bowl -- but not always.

But then again, I just might have an iron stomach!!

[jokhm]

Getting sick appears to be part of the fun here. But I'd understand that a different reality exists when you are traveling for a short period of vacation time. Spending two days laughing at the toilet is never any fun, but I can deal with it because I don't feel guilty about losing time. Maybe that is also a problem on its own..?!

Either way.. the chances of getting sick in some of these places is very slim, providing you stick to a few principles. Until now this has been:

1.Attempt to eat during normal eating hours

2.Stick to places with more than one guy sitting alone eating at the back

3.NEVER eat in foreigner targeted eating establishments, especially in heavily touristed areas throughout Thailand.

4. If you meet other tourists on the street, be VERY skeptical about their desire to eat anything more than Phad Thai, and then either tell them where to eat or walk the other way. Yes, this actually occurs in many countries surrounding Thailand as well.

5. Take precautions on all ingested food from Burma. This has been the source of much of my bathroom agony.

6. If they are too anxious to get you to come into their restaurant, avoid!

7. I can't remember any others at this time.. It will come back.

There have been three points on this entire trip where I have been terribly sick. Yangon, Burma - twice. When I arrived and right before leaving back to Bangkok. And once in Pai, northern Thailand. Nice place but sickeningly infested with people who lost the plot while trying to change the world. The restaurants that feed them cannot be trusted.

So far in China, I've eaten many strange things and from not-so-trustworthy places... but all has been well.

On to better things.

Yesterday, after having a light dimsum brunch (standard but very good) we were taken out at 2:30pm to Superstar on Nathan rd. (Small chain, medium HK prices) and sampled a ridiculously large set of Dim sum.. including those fantastic crab +broth dumplings. Can't remember their names, but they are about 28HKD each. I have photos of most of it which will be posted soon. Afterwards at night we headed to the Saigon area and had a set meal-for-four which included baby abalones, clams, lobster with fried noodles, ginger crab, steamed fish and chinese brocoli. It scares me to think what this would cost in MTL. The lobsters are enormous here. I don't 'think' the Atlantic lobsters that we get at home cover half their size..

Anyway.. pictures will show more than my brief rundown of the menu. Too hungry to think about it now, and I don't know where the next meal will be. This is a major source of stress each day for me.

Joel

[Gary Soup]

Like you and Jo-Mel, I have not had any GI difficulties in China in my half-dozen stays there. Of course, I have not ventured far from the Suzhou-Shanghai-Hangzhou axis, though I indulge liberally in all manner of street food and temple fair offerings.

BTW, in my one stint in HK, I frequently gorged myself on good, cheap seafood at the "temporary market" by the Temple St. Night Market (I was staying at the Evergreen Hotel on Woosung St., a real per diem-saver, nearby). I also pigged out on seafood on Cheung Chau Island for a song.

The best option for old-line Shanghainese food, in case you're interested, was at Wu Kong in Tsim Sha Tsui. If you're in HK a month from now or anytime soon after, it's a good place to get Shanghai "Hairy crab" preparations. The female crabs will be in season, and Wu Kong should have dishes featuring the roe for less that an arm and a leg.

[jokhm]

OK... Finallly made it out of HK.. and WITH some money. Not that it matters anymore. IT's SO cheap. Even where I am now in Shenzhen. I had all these ideas in my head that things would still be pricy this close to HK.. but no - not at all. I will only be spending a day here before moving to Guangzhou; any places of interest to check out food-wise??