Yauatcha

[Izabel_blue]

Yeah I read Popbitch this morning too and thought ohmigawd what is wrong with some people-- I mean they're ignoring the food!!!! And god only knows that one doesn't go to Yauatcha for the service...

[origamicrane]

let me just state once again I love the food but hate the service .

very much a love hate thing.

So I wrote a reasonably polite complaint letter to the management about the bellini waiter, the dodgy £19.50 charge, the mess up with the deposit and the fact it took 3 days to get through to a manager.

I stated that I wanted them to invest and improve their service so that it could match their great food. I didn't ask for a written apology or any form of compensation just that they improved their service.

They responded by saying they spoke to the waiter and duty manager to investigate my complaint. They said that the waiter was just being over zealous with the repeated request for us to have bellini's but they understood that it could come across as being rude and pushy.

They apolgised for the mess up with the deposit and assured me that it was an honest mistake and not an attempt to defraud me.

They said they discussed my complaint at the waiter training session to help improve the service. They would also make sure that all calls and messages are immediately transferred to the duty manager.

They also gave me a £80 voucher to use at yauatcha.

I am reasonably happy with their response. The £80 voucher is pretty nice too yeah afraid I am easily bought sigh!! the youth of today!

I would have been happy with just the £19.50 refunded

well let see if their service does improve the next time i go.

[camp_dick]

They also gave me a £80 voucher to use at yauatcha.

Cool, that's like two grammes?

[origamicrane]

better then a slap in the face

my mate got £100 last time

but they did drop sauce all over her head when they were clearing the table

Edited June 4, 2005 by origamicrane (log)

[Andy Lynes]

Thanks for posting the restaurant's response. Sounds like they took your complaint seriously and looked into it properly.

[origamicrane]

Thanks for posting the restaurant's response. Sounds like they took your complaint seriously and looked into it properly.

←

Its only fair, praise and criticism where its deserved.

Afterall I've had to deal with my fair share of complaints.

Their response was very good they ticked all the right boxes to resolve my complaint and the compensation was generous.

I just really hope their service does improve.

The excellent kitchen deserves to have an equally good front of house.

[cachan]

Lovely place and excellent and friendly service. Prices are so reasonable considering that I started to reel off ten dishes to the waitress and she stopped me and told me that they recommend three dishes per person which we later found to be a good recommendation as we were struggling by the end.

Big disappointment is that I expected that MSG/flavour enhancer/monosodium glutamate/E621 would not rear its ugly head in a place of this class but it was very clear that they do use it. A Michelin starred restaurant should not have to resort to any chemicals to make its food superior to all other eating places. They should rely on superior ingredients and techniques and creativity.

Are there any restaurants in London serving Chinese food which do not utilise MSG ?

[circeplum]

Big disappointment is that I expected that MSG/flavour enhancer/monosodium glutamate/E621 would not rear its ugly head in a place of this class but it was very clear that they do use it.

how do you know?

[cachan]

After eating MSG-laden food, I have a very dry mouth and extreme thirst and drink plenty of water. I think that this is the most common symptom for most people, but others might have their own MSG radars.

[Matthew Grant]

Wow! That's the same symptons of too much salt!

[origamicrane]

too much salt you can taste straight away

whereas too much MSG you won't taste it but you will feel the symptoms.

The only chinese restaurant that i know that didn't use MSG was Four Regions in County Hall but not sure if that is true anymore.

You could just ask for no msg.

[Matthew Grant]

I don't think its always the case that you can taste the salt if the dish is well balanced, I think that people would be very shocked to see how much salt goes into a lot of dishes in a restaurant.

[camp_dick]

Are there any restaurants in London serving Chinese food which do not utilise MSG ?

←

Probably not, especially as Cantonese chefs tend to view their judicious use of MSG as being one distinction between their culinary professionalism and home cooking. (The Four Seasons, which Origame mentions, had/has the distinction of not being a Cantonese kitchen).

The slang name for MSG is Chi Fu, which in martial arts means ‘the teacher.’ The chef can enlist the help of the teacher to make the taste of the dish come alive, but a ham fisted cook may try to compensate for his lack of skill, or attempt to disguise inferior ingredients, by overdoing the MSG. As Cachan says, sensitives do tend to feel MSG in the throat first, before starting to feel sweaty and a little delirious.

Customers can specify no MSG if they wish when ordering dishes that are cooked to order, but that's obviously not feasible when you're eating dim sum that has been prepared in advance, with a litle touch of the sensational spice in the fillings.

[origamicrane]

True msg is considered a seasoning to a chinese chef.

I doubt you will find many that would consider msg to be cheating, although they would look down on it if it was overused.

other symptoms are neck tension and a splitting headache

not nice.

[Matthew Grant]

I've always viewed the use of MSG as similar to the way non-chinese chefs would use salt, it enhances flavour, am I wrong? I'm sure we've all cooked dishes, tasted them , added a little salt and noticed a big transfromation. Why is MSG viewed as such a baddy yet salt is OK? If MSG is used effectively who complains about it's use? My guess is that it is only people that suffer an adverse reaction to it.

[origamicrane]

I've always viewed the use of MSG as similar to the way non-chinese chefs would use salt, it enhances flavour, am I wrong?

←

yep you are correct.

msg sit equally along side salt, pepper and sugar in a chinese kitchen.

Used correctly it can really enhance a dish, used incorrectly it can give you a splitting headache.

But salt used incorrectly can probably kill you and i got a feeling more people have died from salt poisoning then from msg poisoning. (any medics out there that can confirm this?).

The main reason for msg's bad press is probably because historically chinese "chefs" did overuse it, I use the term chef here very loosely.

The main wave of chinese immigrants came to the UK was in the 60's and 70's and pretty much none of these guys had any cooking knowledge at all

(my old man was an engineer by trade) they were just here to make a buck.

As such they would use the cheapest ingredients and use msg to hide there lack of quality and culinary skill.

Back then the British public were eating vesta meals, spam and boiled to death yellow cabbage so they didn't know any better anyway.

I think it was in the early 90's there was a newspaper article highlighting the potential side effects of msg and the article specifically mention "chinese restaurant syndrome".

Because of this article a lot of my restaurant customers

raised their concerns as such we decided to stop using MSG and food colourings.

In the space of a week we had about 20 complaints about 'bland' food and that the sauces tasted different (even though all we did to the sauces was take the food colouring out!).

As such the msg and food colourings were back in the dishes.

But since then the Britsh public have become more aware and demanding, travelled more and become more health concious too.

As such the catering trade as a whole has respond and quality has improved and

the young chinese immigrants that arrived in the 60's and 70's finally did learn to cook and can officially be called chefs now.

but having said that the most popular dishes in my takeaway and restaurant are still chicken curry and sweet and sour chicken balls

UK Chinese restaurant can only change if the general public want it

msg is all about economics, supply and demand.

Edited July 1, 2005 by origamicrane (log)

[Matthew Grant]

Following on from our discussion on the use of MSG:

Observer Food Monthly article

[Jon Tseng]

Following on from our discussion on the use of MSG:

Observer Food Monthly article

←

An insightful and genuinely informative article from OFM

Which is, in itself, a remarkable achievement. Makes a change from the usual "Girl off of last year's Big Brother... Whats in UR Shopping Basket" type pap

J

[origamicrane]

thats was a pretty interesting article

and i agree with the conclusion

nothing wrong with msg but i wouldn't use it at home.

[cachan]

The article is very informative and glutamate / glutamic acid is an amino acid and part of our bodies. The article did not tackle the question of what substance causes Chinese Restaurant Syndrome and it is caused by the consumption of monosodium glutamate (MSG) as opposed to the pure glutamate as found in its natural form as in the seaweed, but the food industry would prefer to reduce their own costs and feed us manufactured MSG instead of the natural product glutamate.

[Matthew Grant]

The article is very informative and glutamate / glutamic acid is an amino acid and part of our bodies.  The article did not tackle the question of what substance causes Chinese Restaurant Syndrome and it is caused by the consumption of monosodium glutamate (MSG) as opposed to the pure glutamate as found in its natural form as in the seaweed, but the food industry would prefer to reduce their own costs and feed us manufactured MSG instead of the natural product glutamate.

←

I think it is a little unfair to say that the article didn't tackle the question of what does cause CRS - nobody knows. How are you qualified to claim "The article did not tackle the question of what substance causes Chinese Restaurant Syndrome and it is caused by the consumption of monosodium glutamate (MSG) as opposed to the pure glutamate as found in its natural form as in the seaweed, but the food industry would prefer to reduce their own costs and feed us manufactured MSG instead of the natural product glutamate? Have you carried out your own scientific studies?

[origamicrane]

the article did quote some scientific research and anecdotal reports that msg didn't cause chinese restaurant syndrome.

Other scientists were testing MSG and finding no evidence of harm - in one 1970 study 11 humans ate up to 147 grams of the stuff every day for six weeks without any adverse reactions.

After all wasn't that the title of the piece

"If MSG is so bad for you, why doesn't everyone in Asia have a headache? "

I have been eating MSG for my entire life and the only time i ever had a adverse effect was when this one restaurant used way too much msg in there nasi goreng. During that I felt unbelievable thirst ( went through 2 litre of water in 45 minutes) and had a headache but if the cook had overused the MSG i'm sure he over used the salt too combination of effects i think.

I got no scientific proof but my personal belief is that some people may have an allergy to msg like seafood or nuts. That is what i believe chinese restaurant syndrome really is an intolerance to msg or an intolerance to elevated levels of msg.

Also my family has been running two chinese restaurant and several takeaways now for 30 years and in that time i never once had a customer complaining about chinese restaurant syndrome and i think that because we don't overuse it.

[Ian]

Personally I think salt should be investigated as the possible source of 'Chinese restaurant syndrome'...

All the best,

--

Ian

[Kim D]

I shop at Berwick Market now and again and never noticed that Yauatcha is right around the corner. Until last night. When I had to meet my husband and another couple for dinner.

We started with drinks in the tea room. I wanted a martini and only had time to quickly glance at the menu. I ordered the 3 Grapes martini. I have no idea what was in it (other than the three grapes sitting at the bottom). It had a strong alcohol flavor that I recognized but can't quite put my finger on. Can anyone help me out?

I know nothing about dim sum. Had it not been for the suggestions here, I would have had no idea what to order. I wish I could remember everything we had because every dish (with the exception of the ribs which were good but not great) was a winner.

The Salt and Pepper Quail were delicious. The last time I had quail, I had to pick out the bones and I remembered what a bother that was. This time, the only bones were in the wings. So nice not to have to bother with that.

I was surprised by the chive dumplings. I never would have ordered them had it not been for the reviews. I split one with my husband and immediately wished there had been four dumplings instead of three so I wouldn't have had to share.

My friend ordered the duck salad. I never would have ordered that because it sounded impossible to share. I was wrong. This dish wound up being our absolute favorite. Excellent mix of flavors. I had never had pomegranate seeds but I'm now a fan. They were perfect. Juicy. Tart. I never thought a seed would taste good. I've been missing out and will have to rectify this. I also tasted cilantro among the greens and as I love cilantro, this made me very happy. There were also slices of some kind of squash like a zucchini. Words fail me. The balance of flavors was perfect. I want more of this dish.

Our bill was quite high but we did have two or three drinks a piece before dinner, a bottle of white wine with the first dishes and a bottle of red to go with the last dishes.

Afterwards we walked over to the French House for after dinner drinks. Interesting place. My husband accidentally stepped on a woman's foot and she demanded an apology. Of course, he gave her one as it was an accident and she seemed quite upset. She accepted his apology and licked his arm. I don't know why.

- kim

[camp_dick]

Afterwards we walked over to the French House for after dinner drinks. Interesting place. My husband accidentally stepped on a woman's foot and she demanded an apology. Of course, he gave her one as it was an accident and she seemed quite upset. She accepted his apology and licked his arm. I don't know why.

←

Kim, you could benefit from some assimilation lessons to familiarise yourself with the language and mores. Cilantro and zucchini are perfectly OK, quite charming, but you can't say things like, 'Of course, he gave her one...' without inviting a lot of sniggering from vulgarians.

As for the drunk woman in the French, she was evidently miming the idea of 'tasty' which, in the vernacular, may refer to more than one appetite. Either she was being tactful by not propositioning your husband directly or, more likely, she was too drunk to speak.