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Say that again?


nessa
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i once heard lynne rosetto kaspar pronounce shallots as shu-LOTS....

I believe that's the British pronunciation.

Y'know, I never thought about this before - simply assumed that it was the affected pronunciation - but now you mention it it suddenly comes back to me that that's how W.S. Gilbert rhymed it in "The Song of the Nancy Bell":

...And some chopped shallot

(Which he never forgot)

And pepper in portions true....

- so maybe it is. OR maybe it wasn't, and Gilbert mischievously distorted it, and it became common usage.

Note to self: add this to list of things to look up.

WRM, does anyone else remember a children's book called What Katy Did, by Susan Coolidge? There's a scene therein where Katy has got hold of a fancy new cookbook, sorely puzzling the poor cook, whose repertoire is extremely simple and old-fashioned. At one point the cook points to a line calling for shallots, saying, "And what's these, Miss Katy? Miss Izzy never give me no shell-outs to cook with!"

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I think you people are a bunch of snobs. How dare you make fun of people that may have never even heard the CORRECT pronunciation.

How dare these low lifes go out in public if they can't speak French!

You should all be ashamed of yourselves.

Cakes

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I'd also like to be the first one -- possibly in the history of the world -- to say, in print, that the word "onion" does not contain the letter 'g.'

In French it does.

"Onion" does not have a 'g' in French or in any other language. Nope. "Oignon" does, though, in French as well as in English.

Now, mind you, they do have the fourth of July in France.

And what about Funyuns?

Also no 'g'.

amanda

Googlista

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Or at least pronounced far differently than I've ever heard. Now, this is not to disparage those who do pronounce things incorrectly, for whatever reason. Far be it from me to do so.

Cakes... see above

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Or at least pronounced far differently than I've ever heard.  Now, this is not to disparage those who do pronounce things incorrectly, for whatever reason.  Far be it from  me to do so. 

Cakes... see above

So Nessa doesn't need to be ashamed of herself. Read the rest of the messages.

It is, in my mind, a little like telling a joke starting by saying " I know is is racist, but"

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The Queer Eye for the Straight Guy episode where the hapless chap pours his girlfriend a glass of "Ga-ZOINK-a-zing-er" (gewurztraminer) wine makes me howl with laughter. Both my home phone and cell phone rang the instant that left his lips, with friends calling me to say, "Did you hear THAT??" :laugh:

Katie M. Loeb
Booze Muse, Spiritual Advisor

Author: Shake, Stir, Pour:Fresh Homegrown Cocktails

Cheers!
Bartendrix,Intoxicologist, Beverage Consultant, Philadelphia, PA
Captain Liberty of the Good Varietals, Aphrodite of Alcohol

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My two favorites--our meat guy, Lenny the Llama, brought his girlfriend in for dinner, and she wanted rat-tat-twah.

A dummy I worked for came in the kitchen and asked if we had prosecuto and fruit.

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I don't think it's so much makin' fun of pronounciations, per se, because a whole lot of us here have parents or grandparents who could not pronounce American English well...I'm thinkin' it's mostly getting to vent about the better-bred-than-thou who actually can't even read well. It's not mean, really.

I could tell you about my uncle who could not read real well and came up to the YIELD signs on onramps, and would roll the window down and holler at the cars he was comin' up on. :laugh:

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When I was a waiter.... our favorite was the woman who came in regularly and always did the ordering for both herself and her male companion(he was not technically mute but seemed to hahve no voice of his own or it had been whipped out of him :wink: She order soup for herself followed by the definitive "and he'll have the kwee-shay!"

I hrdly think she can be blamed as out menu was full of bastardized Frenglish phrases such as "Onion Soup Gratinee". Naturally.... as one might expect in such a hoity establishment, the "melted Gruyere cheese" that topped the onion soup was from the same Kraft Swiss cheese brick as the ingredient in our Ham & Swiss sandwich.

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and he'll have the kwee-shay!"

That actually took me a second or two..but finally... :laugh: I just thought of my British relatives who pronounce margarine as "MAR-gar-EEEN." :unsure: But they were the same ones who enjoyed the dancing of "Mr. Fred ASS-taire." Ass tear, eh? Okeee.... :blink:

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I dunno, but something about Soupe Le Funyun Gratinee just doesn't work.

I think my step mother used to add canned green beans to that!

YUK!

Dave Valentin

Retired Explosive Detection K9 Handler

"So, what if we've got it all backwards?" asks my son.

"Got what backwards?" I ask.

"What if chicken tastes like rattlesnake?" My son, the Einstein of the family.

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for years when i was a kid i couldn't understand why every freeway was named the "Begin Freeway"............

Regarding shallots i do pronounce eschallot-must be that french thing.

danny

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and he'll have the kwee-shay!" 

That actually took me a second or two..but finally... :laugh: I just thought of my British relatives who pronounce margarine as "MAR-gar-EEEN." :unsure: But they were the same ones who enjoyed the dancing of "Mr. Fred ASS-taire." Ass tear, eh? Okeee.... :blink:

Ah yes -- reminds me of the last time we were in Amsterdam. A family (not American; from somewhere else in Europe) sat down in the breakfast room near us, and received their food. The father complained loudly (in English, not his native tongue): "I did not come to the land of milk and cows to eat mar-gah-REEN."

Am I being nasty, Cakes? Not a bit. After all, I was the one who, in Salzburg, ordered "Zwei more tonics" and wrote on my postcards home that they should go via "Flugelpost." And, oh yes, at Maria Worth, explained to the doctor that HWOE needed treatment because he had "baum im füss" (aka, a big mother splinter).

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WRM, does anyone else remember a children's book called What Katy Did, by Susan Coolidge?

I do! It was a girlhood favourite. Didn't she have a sister called Clover? (Pretty name.)

Then there are the accidental mispronunciations that stay in the language forever because we're fond of them. My sister Julia pronounced "Chinese Food" like "Shiny Boots" when she was little, and it's Shiny Boots to this day when my parents get carryout. A friend still calls confectioner's sugar "affectionate sugar" and now I do as well. Another gave up on hors d'ouevres -- so I call them hoover doovers too.

Margaret McArthur

"Take it easy, but take it."

Studs Terkel

1912-2008

A sensational tennis blog from freakyfrites

margaretmcarthur.com

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WRM, does anyone else remember a children's book called What Katy Did, by Susan Coolidge?

I do! It was a girlhood favourite. Didn't she have a sister called Clover? (Pretty name.)

Yup! Clover, Elsie, and John; brothers Dorry and Phil.

Then there are the accidental mispronunciations that stay in the language forever because we're fond of them.  My sister Julia pronounced "Chinese Food" like  "Shiny Boots" when she was little, and it's Shiny Boots to this day when my parents get carryout.  A friend still calls confectioner's sugar "affectionate sugar" and now I do as well.  Another gave up on hors d'ouevres -- so I call them hoover doovers too.

Ah - you mean what we call Horse Ovaries?

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A little tolerance, please.

"Shallots" in American gets the accent on the first syllable, in British on the second. "Margarine" often gets the accent on the last syllable over here. "Basil" is never pronounced "bay-sil". And some (very educated) British speakers pronounce "ate" somewhat like "et".

eGullet is a global site. That means some of us say "tomayto", others "tomahto". We're the better off for that.

Jonathan Day

"La cuisine, c'est quand les choses ont le go�t de ce qu'elles sont."

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I dunno, but something about Soupe Le Funyun Gratinee just doesn't work.

Isn't that traditionally served with Spam en croute instead of croutons?

I always attempt to have the ratio of my intelligence to weight ratio be greater than one. But, I am from the midwest. I am sure you can now understand my life's conundrum.

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Then there are the accidental mispronunciations that stay in the language forever because we're fond of them. My sister Julia pronounced "Chinese Food" like "Shiny Boots" when she was little, and it's Shiny Boots to this day when my parents get carryout. A friend still calls confectioner's sugar "affectionate sugar" and now I do as well. Another gave up on hors d'ouevres -- so I call them hoover doovers too.

They're perpetually "horse doovers" in my cattle-country family...

I always attempt to have the ratio of my intelligence to weight ratio be greater than one. But, I am from the midwest. I am sure you can now understand my life's conundrum.

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Emeril often mangles words.  I love the way he calls Gnocchi..."NOKIA" like the phone.  Can't one of his staff members tell him the correct way to say it? :blink:

Yeah, that and GOLLIC.

:laugh: My personal fave: TAMPON-nade. :blink:

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A little tolerance, please.

Goodness, I don't see why! :wink:

"Basil" is never pronounced "bay-sil".

Oooh, now you're getting beyond pronunciation and into pet peeves. I wasn't going to raise this because it ALWAYS leads to tears before bedtime, but now I have to ask. WHY would anyone pronounce it "bay-sil"? What possible reason could there be? What precedent, what justification, what ... what? It simply baffles me. When I ask this question of anyone who so pronounces it, the reply is always something like "because that's how it's pronounced' - which, aside from being untrue, simply begs the question:

WHY?

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My waterloo ...

Extra points for laughing at yourself. I've got hundreds of stories I could tell about other people's mistakes, but it seems rude not to tell the thousands I've made first.

I think you people are a bunch of snobs.  How dare you make fun of people that may have never even heard the CORRECT pronunciation. 

How dare these low lifes go out in public if they can't speak French!

You should all be ashamed of yourselves.

Because, if you can laugh at yourself, you can also laugh at other people's mistakes and in the belief they will laugh with you.

We are not ashamed. We are amused.

A little tolerance, please.

"Shallots" in American gets the accent on the first syllable, in British on the second.

No comment on the first, it's just worth repeating.

I'm a one man campaign to get the accepted pronunciation changed on shallots assuming what's in the dictionary eventually reflects common usuage. I didn't know the British accent it as I do. Now I've got an excuse. I just need to work on the rest of my accent to support my pronunciation of "shallots." :biggrin:

I'm pretty good in French--as long as I'm speaking to an American and only interspersing French words or ordering wine--possibly better than I am in English on some days. My bête noir is Italian which is really quite easy to learn to pronounce. Some day, I will learn to order Barbera wine as if it's not the American girl's name.

A little ignorance is a most forgivable thing, unless it's about food and you've alread been trading on your expertise in that area. Most oral expressions of ignorance are forgivable. I can't say the same for written examples, although I was not offended by the hand lettered sign that advertised breakfast specials with "two stripes of bacon" and "oinoins" (note no "g"). I suppose I'm not really offended by such bastardized, and by now, possibly accepted, menu terms such as "du jur" as in soup du jur. They do grate on me a bit, but I suppose it won't be long before they're recognized in an American dictionary. I'm actually afriad to look.

Pretentious affectation is not relegated to the English language either. In Puerto Rico, the local custom is to often drop the "ado" at the end of words and replace it with an "ao" (ow). It's not the king's Spanish and although the pronunciation is almost universal, it's recognized as a corruption. Asopao is perhaps the national dish of PR and I've not heard anyone make a legitimate claim it derives from any word or phrase ending in "ado," but once on a nicely printed menu, we saw "asopado de pollo."

Robert Buxbaum

WorldTable

Recent WorldTable posts include: comments about reporting on Michelin stars in The NY Times, the NJ proposal to ban foie gras, Michael Ruhlman's comments in blogs about the NJ proposal and Bill Buford's New Yorker article on the Food Network.

My mailbox is full. You may contact me via worldtable.com.

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