Cooking Extravagantly

[itch22]

I was flipping through Ursula Ferrigno's book, Truly Madly Pasta: The Ultimate Book for Pasta Lovers and she mentions that she cooks her pasta in Italian bottled water. She says it makes a difference. Now, I can sort of see how bottled water or even filtered water may make a difference. However, Italian bottled water? Call me cheap but I'll use tap water.

What I am curious about is, how extravagant are you are in your kitchen? What are your opinions about extravagance, such as what I mentioned above?

[iriee]

what a joke! why would you ever use bottled water for pasta unless you were without water or camping where there was no water. i guess you would call me frugal!

[Jake]

Heck, go right ahead and call me cheap!! No bottled water being used for pasta here.

[SobaAddict70]

Well, it depends on what your definition of extravagance is.

A truffle can be extravagant where white truffle oil is not. Vanilla beans can be extravagant. Foie gras lobes can be extravagant but not foie gras mousse. Aceto balsamico tradizionale instead of the fake balsamic-flavored shit that you can get at any supermarket these days.

Your attitude will depend on how far you're willing to stretch your dollar or how willing you are to sacrifice quality for economics.

As far as I'm concerned, some things are more essential than others like good quality EVOO, fleur de sel and freshly cracked black pepper...but cooking pasta in Italian bottled water is a bit ridiculous when plain tap will do.

Soba

[slkinsey]

With all due respect to Ursula Ferrigno, that is one of the stupidest things I have ever heard with respect to cooking ingredients. Right up there with using ultra-expensive sea salt for salt-baked fish and pasta water.

That said, and as Soba suggests, there is good extravagance (aceto balsamico tradizionale, A-grade foie gras, white truffles, even things like artisinal Italian pasta asciuta and heavy stainless lined copper cookware) and there is bad extravagance (see above). The point, I think is that you don't waste your money, but rather spend it in places where it will make the most impact.

[Jake]

That said, and as Soba suggests, there is good extravagance (aceto balsamico tradizionale, A-grade foie gras, white truffles, even things like artisinal Italian pasta asciuta and heavy stainless lined copper cookware) and there is bad extravagance (see above). The point, I think is that you don't waste your money, but rather spend it in places where it will make the most impact.

Excellent point - I am a master of good extravagance (or good for me, shall we say) but not of the variety that will a) make no difference to the dish or b) have no basis is fact (see above).

[Richard Kilgore]

However, I do use filtered water for pasta and coffee, because my local water has such a vile off-taste. It does make a diference.

[Carolyn Tillie]

Heck, my sister thinks I am extravagant because I use Plugra butter in all my baking and cooking (she uses <hack-cough> MARGARINE, or worse, BUTTER-FLAVORED CRISCO!!!!).

[itch22]

BUTTER-FLAVORED CRISCO!!!!

[fresco]

I wonder if Sandra Lee would recommend bottled water for pasta because it is more "convenient" than tap water?

[SobaAddict70]

Well, a cursory look through one of my cupboards shows the following:

EVOO

fleur de sel

Morton's table salt

almond oil

ginger honey vinegar

three tins of oil packed anchovies

two cans of Bumblebee water-packed tuna

canola oil

green Tabasco

chipotle/mango/habanero hot sauce

kosher salt

light brown sugar

date sugar

regular Domino's granulated sugar (I keep this in a ceramic jar and have a few vanilla beans inside)

regular honey

eucalyptus honey

mixed peppercorns

5 vacuum packs of soy milk (b/c I'm lactose intolerant, this is one of the ways I get my calcium)

ground turmeric

cardamom pods

ground cardamom powder

dried Hungarian sweet peppers (these are great in place of red pepper flakes)

yellow mustard seeds

black mustard seeds

dried orange peel

dried lemon peel

crystallized ginger

saffron threads

Arborio rice

gohan

Hawaiian red rice

mushroom soy

mirin

tamari

sushi vinegar

rice vinegar

cider vinegar

among other things. Is this extravagant? My mom would probably say so. I know people who'd say to me, "Why buy all of those spices when you can just buy a little curry powder? It'll save you $ in the long run and effort instead of grinding/toasting the spices yourself." One wannabe foodie friend I have, I can just see right now saying "what's the difference between rice? Rice is rice, a potato is a potato. Just substitute, it's not a big deal."

I cook a lot, however. Some of the ingredients above are indispensible for making garam masala, which is vastly superior over that of commercial/store-bought curry powder or store-bought masalas. Other ingredients are indispensible for certain dishes (i.e., risotto, Italian food in general). Still others are things I've picked up over the course of several occasions, on a whim.

I think it would be helpful to keep in mind that one person's extravagance is another person's needful thing.

Soba

[AlexP]

My guess is that cooks use tap water in Italy. Based on this premise, Ursula Ferrigno should use tap water imported from Italy. By using bottled water (that probably comes from a spring) she is not using the true water mostly use by Italian cooks: "tap water". She is definitely making a huge mistake on her cooking. Please, somebody in Italy should send her a few gallons of tap water so she can taste the difference. Also, please, post regard the best area for tap water to cook pasta in Italy.

Alex

[mikeycook]

At the current time my extravagances are:

Butter - Celles sur Belles (To me it just tastes better and I found a decent price on the large rolls at my local supermarket.)

Salt - Sel Marin for boiling veggies and Fleur de Sel for finishing dishes and on the table. I like trying different salts when possible (price determines how liberally I use it), but I avoid iodized at all costs. I use a cheaper kosher salt if a large volume is needed (such as dishes wrapped in a salt crust).

Oil - Extra virgin Olive whenever possible. Sometimes other oils for frying (depends on how much I need).

Cookware - Copper and cast iron are the only metals I use for cookware, except for my non-stick fry pan, which is All-Clad. Nothing against stainless, but I just like the feel and look of the copper.

Edited March 8, 2004 by mikeycook (log)

[Boris_A]

Also, please, post regard the best area for tap water to cook pasta in Italy. 

Oh, at certain places, water quality in Italy is so bad the the use in fact .. Italian bottled water.

Extravagancy there would be the use of ... American bottled water.

[itch22]

My guess is that cooks use tap water in Italy. Based on this premise, Ursula Ferrigno should use tap water imported from Italy. By using bottled water (that probably comes from a spring) she is not using the true water mostly use by Italian cooks: "tap water". She is definitely making a huge mistake on her cooking. Please, somebody in Italy should send her a few gallons of tap water so she can taste the difference. Also, please, post regard the best area for tap water to cook pasta in Italy.

Alex

In a blind taste test I doubt she would notice the difference. I am assuming that knowing she is using Italian bottled water simply alters her perception so she thinks its better.

Oh, and SobaAddict70, those are the BASICS!

[Boris_A]

Now I know what's really extravagant : using tap water bottled by Coca Cola:

Coke's water comes straight from the tap with a cool mark-up of 3,000 per cent

[SG-]

  One wannabe foodie friend I have, I can just see right now saying "what's the difference between rice?  Rice is rice, a potato is a potato.  Just substitute, it's not a big deal." 

Here's my regularly consumed rice collection

Nozomi Super Premium Short Grain Rice for sushi

Calaspara Rice from William Sonoma for Paella

Acquerello Organic Aged Carnaroli for risotto

3 elephants mew crop Jasmine Rice

Himalayan aged basmati rice.

[Anna N]

Now I know what's really extravagant : using tap water bottled by Coca Cola:

Coke's water comes straight from the tap with a cool mark-up of 3,000 per cent

Mine wasn't bottled by CC but by my daughter! The builder in the sub-division we just moved into suggested we should use bottled water for at least a month until the construction debris was flushed from the water lines. We purchased one case of bottled water and then got wise! We saved the bottles, sent them home with my daughter and had her re-fill them from her tap. So, for a month we have used bottled tap water - but it was "free".

[Jon Tseng]

I think cooking extravagantly - with the best quality and/or special ingredients - with truffles, foie gras, the best spanish ham etc. DOES make a difference

However I think microscopic attention to detail sometimes makes a difference and sometimes does not e.g. using Italian mineral water - who will taste the difference if, say, there's a big plug of charcuterie and garlic floating around in the dish? Using the finest sea salt instead of table salt in a soup where the salt will dissolve in the broth (chemically they are virtually identical - its the shape of the crystals which makes the difference), cooking vegetables with the lid off to make them greener (simply not true)

One of the great benefits of the incursion of food science into the kitchen is to debunk some of the urban myths which people think make a difference to the food, but do not. Yes attention to detail sometimes matter, no it doesn't always matter. But extravagence does make a difference

J

[Gale]

However, I do use filtered water for pasta and coffee, because my local water has such a vile off-taste. It does make a diference.

I solved this problem at my home by cutting in a whole house water filter. I have well water which used to require a water softener. My fridge and such have their own filters, but it left me with water softener water, which is pretty bad. The whole house filter works great, is easy to maintain, and actually helps your appliances like the DW and W/D out because they don't get the sediment or mineral build up.

Some of my friends with public water have done this as well, and really think it saves a lot of hassle.

[Carlovski]

I could imaging a particularly mineral rich water slightly altering the taste (but not necessarly in a good way) as in carrots vichy, but I doubt it would be very perceptible.

[Mabelline]

The only thing I have against that kind of fatuous remark, as well as others of the ilk, is the fact that some poor unsuspecting bride or inexperienced cook reads that book, attempts her crap recipe, and ends up trashing an attempt to graduate to better food preparation or enjoyment.

As Katie Loeb has remarked, there's a special place in Hell for people like her

[bleudauvergne]

I think that 10 years ago I might have considered it extravagant to have at my disposal in the kitchen 4 types of rice, 4 different grades of wheat flour, 4 flours from other grains or beans, 3 different types of butter, a tub of duck fat, three different grades of olive oil, 2 different nut oils, polenta or corn meal in 3 different grades (including the masa harina), 7 different vinegars, 5 types of pasta (of which I will include couscous), 3 types of salt; table, sea for cooking (which I sometimes grind for table use), and fleur de sel for presentation, 24 canisters of various spices and home mixed spice mixes ready to use, (I do not count the baggies of things I rarely use I keep in a box in the safe), the 6 varieties of mushrooms I have in both dried and frozen form, plus my choice to pay premium for certain meats, currently 6 cheeses on my cheese plate, vegetables always fresh and in season, etc.

Some people might also consider my repetitive trips to market to be an extravagant waste of time, the time I spend preparing, the lists I make, the entire days planned around food, waiting in line for 20 minutes so I can have just the right bread with the soup, the energy I spend on devising a technique of keeping ice cream cool on a morning hike so we can enjoy it in the face of an alpine panorama, the trip across town for a simple lemon tart that I have tried to recreate but cannot thus leaving it to the expert. Waiting until Saturday for fresh fish, and paying for wild, line fished kind, rather than last weeks farmed filet in Styrofoam. A big extravagant frittering away of my life that could be otherwise put to better, less selfish, more “raisonnable”, stoic, citizenly pursuits.

The prices are not as important as they would be should I have to completely stock everything at once, because we pick things up as we need (or find) them, we don’t eat terribly expensive things absolutely all the time, and we use precious things judiciously. We are careful to preserve them properly so we can profit from them longer, and we make use of the freezer and other preserving methods for further enjoyment.

But once you have worked with different kinds of ingredients and you know what makes things work just the way you had them once, what cannot be substituted if you are going to make something the best it can be and create memorable experiences for your loved ones and guests, it becomes natural to make your ingredient choices according to how you have researched and tested a thing to work best.

Extravagant would be doing something simply wasteful, like the mineral water for the pasta, or using beluga caviar to make a tarama, or drinking a bottle of La Tache without a really good meal and really nice people to share it with. I can’t go down to Spain to the producer and get a bottle of the premium olive oil whenever the whim strikes me, so I do what I can to make it last as long as possible. The idea of just using it full on all the time is enticing, but the idea of the waste (and the subsequent dry spell) trumps the impulse.

I can understand why sometimes when my family comes to visit they might go home murmuring about what they perceive as extravagance, but then again, they make their own life choices. I can say no one seems to mind while they're at the table!

edited typos

Edited March 9, 2004 by bleudauvergne (log)

[Cusina]

The one thing I do know is that I get more extravagant (aka, picky) as I get older. Especially in the realms of alcohol, food freshness and seasonings. By the time I'm 105 I'll be down to dew drops and fresh honey, but only if it is from very discerning bees.

And from my (albeit less than scientific) understanding, the water in America is on the whole purer that the water in Europe. Logic based on the fact that it hasn't been in use by a dense population of humans for as many centuries. A helpful London resident warned me against drinking the London tap water saying it had been through a human body at least seven times prior to being in my glass. Definitely enough to have me brushing my teeth with the bottled stuff. Plus it gave me a good excuse to drink mostly beer and cider. Much healthier I'm sure.

[itch22]

Bleudauvergne,

I am similar to you, I make several trips to the market (as much as twice a day) for a variety of items. I always buy organic and from farms before I go to rocery stores. I'll even go to several grocery stores to find the freshest produce and highest grade of cheese available. To avoid waste I usually plan a two or three day menu around a paticular item I'm forced to buy a lot of, such as a bushel of organic baby spinach. Day 1 would be a spinach salad, day 2 would be spinach and goat's cheese ravioli, and on day 3 I'd dump any remaining spinach intoa mushroom spinach lasange.

When it comes to condiments, I aim for the highest quality of oils and vinigars I can find. In fact I am looking to buy a small 5 or 10 gallon oak barrel for making my own wine vinigar.

There are limits though, such as using a $100.00 bottle of port in a pan sauce for steak when, in my opinion, a $20.00 bottle will do. If I am cooking a French recipe that calls for potatos I use Canadian potatos, not ones shipped over from France. Same goes with mushrooms, settling for Canadian ones and not, lets say, portibellos grown in Italy.