Fish in a packet

[stevea]

Having found a really decent fish market, we've been preparing a lot of "fish in a packet" meals lately. Essentially, a fillet of whatever's freshest (salmon, true cod, snapper, etc), with flavoring ingredients (oriental -- ginger, fennel root, etc., medditerranean -- black olive, cherry tomato, basil, etc.), a bit of olive oil, seasonings, and a bit of poaching liquid (white wine or stock) all wrapped up in a packet and cooked (steamed) in the oven for ten minutes at 475F. Very easy, healthy, and quite tasty.

Some recipes call for the fish to be wrapped in a parchment paper packet. Others call for aluminum foil. I haven't really noticed any difference between the two, but then I've never done a test where I've cooked the same recipe using both wrappings. Does anyone have an opinion on whether parchment paper or foil is better, and why?

[Jinmyo]

Parchment. More expensive (in bloody pennies, yis cheap batardes!) than nasty foil but less nasty.

[Lyle]

I always use parchment, but in a pinch last year I baked a salmon (I think) over couscous in foil. The fish came out fine but, not surprisingly, the couscous had a metallic tinge to it.

Of course, we could always graduate to cryovac bags.

[Carolyn Tillie]

Agree with Jinmyo - parchment.

My en Papillote recipe calls for a few slices of yellow yukon potatoes, portobello mushrooms, sliced fennel bulb, and roma tomatoes on the bottom. Atop the fish goes the leafy part of the fennel, a lemon slice, a splash of Pernod, a splash of white wine, a generous sprinkle of Chef Paul Prodhomme's Seafood Magic, and a dollop of butter.

Hmmmm... think I'll make it over the weekend! Thanks for the reminder!

[Gifted Gourmet]

If the result is about the same using both, I would always opt for parchment, if for no other reason, the presentation looks nicer and opening the paper for service is somewhat more interesting ... I cut the parchment into a heart shape ...

[chromedome]

Parchment as well, just 'cuz I find that peeling my nice delicate fish off the damn' foil is disheartening....

[GG Mora]

Another vote for parchment. I like to do a whole-meal-in-a-packet chicken breast thing. Thinly sliced new potatoes, mushrooms and brussels sprouts tossed together with some OO and slivered garlic, seasoned with S&P. Slap a boneless breast on top with a rosemary sprig tucked underneath, splash with white wine & season the chick with more S&P, seal up the packet and bake at 350° til the chicken's cooked through (30 - 40 minutes). You could sear the breast aforehand just for color if you really needed to.

[Gifted Gourmet]

Parchment as well, just 'cuz I find that peeling my nice delicate fish off the damn' foil is disheartening....

You know that Reynolds makes that new "Release" foil ... but it is still foil ...

reminds me of "take home" food ... ick...

[itch22]

Banana leaves work very well for certain styles of food.

[MegaloMatt]

I agree with gifted. There's just something nice about those crimped half-moons of parchment, that when you open at the table bathe you with aromatic steam. Foil is not table ready.

[stevea]

My en Papillote recipe calls for a few slices of yellow yukon potatoes, portobello mushrooms, sliced fennel bulb, and roma tomatoes on the bottom. Atop the fish goes the leafy part of the fennel, a lemon slice, a splash of Pernod, a splash of white wine, a generous sprinkle of Chef Paul Prodhomme's Seafood Magic, and a dollop of butter.

Hmmmm... think I'll make it over the weekend! Thanks for the reminder!

Carolyn, that sounds delicious! I may do the same. Parchment it is!

[johnjohn]

A couple questions -

Are the cooking times the same for foil as parchment?

What vegetables do you parcook in advance when cooking en papillote? I've seen recipes that call for potatoes and brussel sprouts (partly) and mushrooms (fully) to be cooked before placing in the pouch.

Anyone ever notice a reaction between the foil and any acids they used in the steaming process?

Any guidelines as to cooking times for shrimp or sea scallops? Do clams or mussels get overcooked when done en papillote?

Any good books out there on this subject?

Thanks.

[qrn]

A couple questions -

Are the cooking times the same for foil as parchment?

What vegetables do you parcook in advance when cooking en papillote?  I've seen recipes that call for potatoes and brussel sprouts (partly) and mushrooms (fully) to be cooked before placing in the pouch.

Anyone ever notice a reaction between the foil and any acids they used in the steaming process?

Any guidelines as to cooking times for shrimp or sea scallops?  Do clams or mussels get overcooked when done en papillote?

Any good books out there on this subject?

Thanks.

←

I do a shrimp and scallop in parchment that is very simple.

Saute shallots in butter,then add a little white wine and reduce to almost dry.

Add a bit more butter, then flour, and when roux is cooked add a bit of water, s&p and fresh tarragon, to make a really, really thick white sauce

. Let it cool a bit and then add peeled small shrimp, bay scallops, and maybe a few small cod or salmon chunks to the sauce, mix, Put in a parchment bag and bake till it is done .

.

The shrimp, scallops, and fish ,during the bake, will release a lot of juices, and thin the sauce, and add tons of flavor.

Serve with rice ,couscous etc.

Bud

[johnjohn]

A couple questions -

Are the cooking times the same for foil as parchment?

What vegetables do you parcook in advance when cooking en papillote?  I've seen recipes that call for potatoes and brussel sprouts (partly) and mushrooms (fully) to be cooked before placing in the pouch.

Anyone ever notice a reaction between the foil and any acids they used in the steaming process?

Any guidelines as to cooking times for shrimp or sea scallops?  Do clams or mussels get overcooked when done en papillote?

Any good books out there on this subject?

Thanks.

←

I do a shrimp and scallop in parchment that is very simple.

Saute shallots in butter,then add a little white wine and reduce to almost dry.

Add a bit more butter, then flour, and when roux is cooked add a bit of water, s&p and fresh tarragon, to make a really, really thick white sauce

. Let it cool a bit and then add peeled small shrimp, bay scallops, and maybe a few small cod or salmon chunks to the sauce, mix, Put in a parchment bag and bake till it is done .

.

The shrimp, scallops, and fish ,during the bake, will release a lot of juices, and thin the sauce, and add tons of flavor.

Serve with rice ,couscous etc.

Bud

←

How long do you cook it?

[Vadouvan]

Some recipes call for the fish to be wrapped in a parchment paper packet. Others call for aluminum foil. I haven't really noticed any difference between the two, but then I've never done a test where I've cooked the same recipe using both wrappings. Does anyone have an opinion on whether parchment paper or foil is better, and why?

Neither Actually......both have been eclipsed since the advent of FATA PAPER a year ago.

Now you can see your food cooking in the package.

http://www.jbprince.com/index.asp?PageActi...ROD&ProdID=3583

[Rebecca263]

Ooh, Vadouvan, that is truly a beautiful invention. Can you tell us what it is made of? I can't seem to find any "clear" information on it.

[rmillman]

I have used fata paper recently with good success: particularly when presenting it still wrapped like a gift on the plate.

However, in geneal, I prefer the texture and flavors I can get using sous vide with fish. I generally do a two step process where I first sous vide cook the fish and then flash sear it to give the surface extra texture and flavor.

[annecros]

Parchment.

[qrn]

[

Thanks.

←

[paul o' vendange]

Anyone ever notice a reaction between the foil and any acids they used in the steaming process

Yes, definitely, which is why I go with parchment.

[fiftydollars]

Anyone ever notice a reaction between the foil and any acids they used in the steaming process

Yes, definitely, which is why I go with parchment.

←

Has anyone tried this with those new fancy coated (non-stick) aluminum foils? Do they still react?

[Vadouvan]

I have used fata paper recently with good success: particularly when presenting it still wrapped like a gift on the plate.

However, in geneal, I prefer the texture and flavors I can get using sous vide with fish. I generally do a two step process where I first sous vide cook the fish and then flash sear it to give the surface extra texture and flavor

Fata isnt competing with sous vide.

It's an alternative to parchment or foil.

There is no point comparing Fata and sous vide.

REbecca.

Its just high temperature thermoplastic and much safer than say teflon for example.

Edited January 29, 2007 by Vadouvan (log)

[Tess]

Oh, coolness. I just ordered some fata paper. Sometimes I am so glad I read this board.

[Kajikit]

I had mahi-mahi to cook tonight, so this thread gave me the idea to try it. It was easy to make the parcels out of parchment paper but the results were very disappointing - the parcels never puffed up so I had to guess when the fish was done and it ended up overcooked, watery and flavourless. It definitely looked better than it tasted!

Edited January 30, 2007 by Kajikit (log)

[russ parsons]

yeah, that's a problem with papillote. so much of it depends on the quality of the fish, which is highly variable. i remember cooking a dinner party for some friends and i did a bunch of sole en papillote. thought i'd really lucked out when i found dover sole at the fish market at a pretty good price. when i opened the packets (at the table, of course), the fish had melted to a kind of fish goo. welcome to slime sole (the alternative name for the fish called dover sole on the west coast).

sounds to me like maybe your fish had at one time been frozen and then badly defrosted.