The Cuisine of the United Kingdom

[ghostrider]

In terms of how availability of good ingredients in the UK has changed, there is no doubt that there is an immense variety of produce in the supermarkets and specialist shops that simply wasn't there 15-20 years ago. However, when I was growing up in the late 60's/early 70's I clearly remember accompanying my mother to the local butcher, fishmonger, and grocer and buying fresh ingredients for our meals. I still recall seeing the carcasses being delivered to the butcher and that he would often cut a joint to order. Now, meat is often delivered to butchers pre-portion and even pre-packed. 

My memory of food at home is that it was mostly cooked from scratch, despite my Mother hating the task. Of course we had fish fingers and burgers and the like, but more often than not it was freshly cooked fish or meat with veg, or a stew or salad and possibly a home made apple pie for dessert.

Today, I have a very good butcher just around the corner from my house, but the nearest grocer's is the city centre open market, and the nearest usuable fishmonger is a 20 minute drive away. If I want to buy really good cheese and bread I have to find a deli whose prices are now aimed at those who can afford to treat food as a hobby rather than a necessity.

So the situation today is that the good basic food that was available to me as a child on my doorstep at prices my family could afford is now only obtainable as part of a treasure hunt around a 10 mile radius of my home, and at premium prices. This is progress?

i can recognize that picture from denmark, and from the rest of what i know of scandinavia. crap for the unthinking masses, luxury for the rich gourmets, and almost nothing in between. ham for instance, is either soggy stuff in supermarket plastic, or it's cut for you by a butcher who knew the pig's grandmother's name

Oddly (or perhaps not), Andy Lymes' words there also mirror my experience of growing up in rural/suburban St. Louis, Missouri, USA, in the 1950s/early 1960s, vs. my current life here in suburban New Jersey.

It's the way of the world I guess.

OK back to your puddings!

[John Whiting]

Some further unhappy thoughts from George Monbiot on the demise of British produce.

[tigerwoman]

chocolate covered (plain chocolate or dark choc to us yanks) digestives

my husbands aunties fresh scones

clotted cream and freshly picked raspberries

a good cup of tea

roast dinner - especially lamb and roasted potatoes

why do the potatoes in the UK just taste so much better?

Wholemeal shortbreads (Walkers used to make them 20 years ago but I havent seen them recently)

Desserts and Dishes with great names liked Spotted Dick, Sussex Pond Pudding - they just roll off your tongue

English Trifle with lots of custard, and good whipped cream

again the dairy seems much better -

given that dairy is so rich and prevalent in UK - it has amazed me that the UK took so long to bring good dairy icecreams to the market (commercially prepared that is - I used to laugh about Walls on a continuous basis)

[Adam Balic]

Some further unhappy thoughts from George Monbiot on the demise of British produce.

God how depressing. Apples are a great symbol of British (or at least English) food culture. If only 0.1% of the people that have bought Jamie's, Nigella's or Delia's books would buy some traditional British produce, like these apples.

What a pity that organisations that look after some much of British heritage, largely ignore food. There are increasing amounts of articles published on 'saving' some of the monsterous 1960's concrete buildings and one on British food. And this from a nation of newly converted 'foodies'.

[clb]

Some further unhappy thoughts from George Monbiot on the demise of British produce.

God how depressing. Apples are a great symbol of British (or at least English) food culture. If only 0.1% of the people that have bought Jamie's, Nigella's or Delia's books would buy some traditional British produce, like these apples.

What a pity that organisations that look after some much of British heritage, largely ignore food. There are increasing amounts of articles published on 'saving' some of the monsterous 1960's concrete buildings and one on British food. And this from a nation of newly converted 'foodies'.

Adam, it's not an either/or thing.

I'm happy to say that I'm as keen to save rare variety apples (planning to plant another espalier in the tiny back garden to join the Blenheim Orange that's there already) as I am the Barbican (done, thank goodness, or the Twentieth Century Society).

Concrete buildings are as much part of our history as apples and each give me a lot of pleasure.

Which is not to say that I disagree with the thrust of Monbiot's article. WHY do people - people who have enough money to choose, that is - buy apples grown outside the UK? I just don't get it.

clb

[John Whiting]

There's a small gleam of hope. Tim Lang, one of real food's most ardent champions, is now allowed to play the Prophet Jeremiah in the echoing halls of power.

I've known Tim for years, ever since his days with the London Food Commission. Unlike so many campaigners, he's passionate not just about food politics but about food itself.

[oraklet]

Some further unhappy thoughts from George Monbiot on the demise of British produce.

God how depressing. Apples are a great symbol of British (or at least English) food culture. If only 0.1% of the people that have bought Jamie's, Nigella's or Delia's books would buy some traditional British produce, like these apples.

but, as the article tells us, they're almost impossible to get hold of for the average shopper.

[John Whiting]

One of the ironic facts about apples is that every tree grown from seed produces a new variety. Those that are preserved are from cuttings grafted onto root stock.

Come Armageddon, some New Age Johnny Appleseed may scatter seeds across the English landscape, so that thousands of new varieties may flourish when there are no humans left to eat them.

[Adam Balic]

Adam, it's not an either/or thing.

I'm happy to say that I'm as keen to save rare variety apples (planning to plant another espalier in the tiny back garden to join the Blenheim Orange that's there already) as I am the Barbican (done, thank goodness, or the Twentieth Century Society).

Concrete buildings are as much part of our history as apples and each give me a lot of pleasure. 

Which is not to say that I disagree with the thrust of Monbiot's article. WHY do people - people who have enough money to choose, that is - buy apples grown outside the UK? I just don't get it. 

True, but how many 18th century country houses, 19th century Gothic mansions or 1960's bunkers ( ) have been saved for the nation compared to its food history? One things like these apples are gone they are gone for ever. And unlike many other forms of cultural heritage, they can be used in a contempory setting.

I can appreciate that it is much easier to excite the public imagination with buildings etc, but how difficult would it be for an organisation (goverment or otherwise) to set up a store in a prominant location, that sells produce like these rare apples etc. Not as a money making exercise (although this would help) but more as an educational and promotional device. Take the British culinary heritage and give it back to the population, rather then leave it as a dying resource for a small group of foodies. Heirloom fruit and veg. varieties in season, rare breed pork produce, beef and poultry. Ditto cooked goods, cheese etc. Ah, it could be sweet.

Never will happen as the current goverment is fully in support of supermarket culture. So eat your apples while you can.

Edited March 16, 2004 by Adam Balic (log)

[Adam Balic]

One of the ironic facts about apples is that every tree grown from seed produces a new variety. Those that are preserved are from cuttings grafted onto root stock.

"Cloning" in fact. This is true of almost all plants (and animals), the great gift of sexual reproduction, the mixing of genes in every generation.

[John Whiting]

There is already the Brogdale Horticultural Trust. Ironically, it was set up with government support which has now been largely taken away, so that they are hanging on by the skin of their Knobby Russets.

[Adam Balic]

There is already the Brogdale Horticultural Trust. Ironically, it was set up with government support which has now been largely taken away, so that they are hanging on by the skin of their Knobby Russets.

I think that organistations such are this are wonderful, but I think that to survive and be relevant (food is for eating after all), this type of produce needs to be brough back into the 'public' consumption sphere of influence. I think that an apple specific store would be very difficult to maintain, hence my suggestion for a wider range of produce types.

[Stigand]

Some further unhappy thoughts from George Monbiot on the demise of British produce.

I certainly agree that it's a tragedy that British apple varieties are being buried in a deluge of Braeburns and Golden Delicious.

But I'm suspicious of Monbiot's argument that having more small shops (and fewer supermarkets) will stop the rot. If I look at the selection of produce in the small corner shops and greengrocers near where I live in London, I see exactly the same dismal monoculture as I see in Sainsbury's. Indeed if anything things are worse, as Sainsbury's does at least try to stock Coxes and Egremont Russets (at high prices, natch).

I fear that simply regulating supermarkets isn't going to solve the problem. The solution needs to focus on the demand side as much as on the supply side (as Adam B suggests).

[John Whiting]

I think Monbiot is aware that particular kinds of smaller shops are required. In fact, the "convenience" stores are being rapidly bought out by the supermarket chains, which the monopolies commission seems happy to allow. They have taken the position that the two portions of the market are independent of each other. Meanwhile in London Tesco has bought out Cullen and Europa. Left to market forces, the food suppliers can only become as narrowly controlled as the communications industry.

[mags]

I think it's no contest: The UK has better dairy products, better roasts (pork roast with CRACKLINGS, damnit!), better roast potatoes, and better apples. I still remember the first time I tasted a Cox's Orange Pippin, and that was more than 20 years ago. Oh, and generally better sweets, but I say this as a person who doesn't like American layer cakes, and is not much of a cookie-eater. Trifle or Eaton Mess or Sticky Toffee Pud, by contrast.....(swooning) On the other hand, yeah, the ice cream situation was very weird for a long time. When I was living in London, in the 80s, there was a place called Marine Ices, up by Chalk Farm I think, that was widely reputed to have amazing ice cream. So some friends and I schlepped up there one afternoon (from darkest Clapham), and they were oohing and ahhhing over what, to me, tasted sort of like sub-standard Breyers.

Edited March 16, 2004 by mags (log)

[John Whiting]

I still remember the first time I tasted a Cox's Orange Pippin, and that was more than 20 years ago.  . . .

Stick with your memories. The small native Cox's are now almost impossible to obtain; the commercially available ones are grown abroad, are larger and have lost their intensity.

When I was living in London, in the 80s, there was a place called Marine Ices, up by Chalk Farm I think, that was widely reputed to have amazing ice cream.  So some friends and I schlepped up there one afternoon (from darkest Clapham), and they were oohing and ahhhing over what, to me, tasted sort of like sub-standard Breyers.

I share your indifference to Marine Ices. They are non-dairy and therefore kosher to eat with meat, which helps to explain their popularity.

[mags]

So it was some kind of proto-Tofutti? Blech. No wonder I didn't like it.

And is there something wrong with me that, nearly a quarter of a century after the fact, I remember the name of a BAD ice cream shop?

[auntdot]

The British Isles make some fine beers and ciders.

Was lucky enough to walk into a beer tasting festival.

The local ales and ciders were truly impressive.

Unfortunately the demon Budweiser is taking over the place, and many of the smaller breweries are closing.

As for Marmite, it used to be made from the yeast leavings from the brewery. They apparently gave up using the brewery dregs (from Fuller's brewery) several years ago and now make the awful stuff themselves. (Yes I know if you were brought up with Marmite or Vegemite from the get-go, you probably like the stuff. We were not, and do not.)

But to get to the topic, British food can be quite good.

Love Dubh Prais in Edinburgh (on the Royal Mile); have been going there for almost fifteen years. The chef, who also runs a B&B just outside the city, uses local ingredients and is a fine chef.

The restaurant in the Connaught Hotel is exqusite, but pricey, as is the Dorchester (Hotel) Grill Room.

Rules, a very old restaurant on Maiden Lane near Covent Garden, is well appointed and specializes in game. It is the oldest continuously operating restaurant in London, and is not overly pricey.

London is not NYC, but there are many fine restaurants.

And there is always the beers.

[nicola]

Only just found this thread which I have really enjoyed. Sorry to drag it back to the topic of UK supermarkets but thought people might be amused by this piece on who shops where and why:

I'm rich and I'm living well. Shopping here is part of that.

[mags]

You know, and with all due respect to The Guardian, I have real trouble believing many of those quotes.

[Stigand]

Yeah - makes me wonder which is greater: the British obsession with class or the Guardian's obsession about talking about the British obsession with class.

We shouldn't be too harsh on 'posh' supermarkets: Waitrose has done more than most to supply interesting, wholesome food on a sustainable basis (they know that their customers will pay for it). It's not all about snob value...

[John Whiting]

A disheartening footnote to the discussion of English apples: The torching of the orchards. Scroll to the end of the column.

Yeah - makes me wonder which is greater: the British obsession with class or the Guardian's obsession about talking about the British obsession with class.

Don't take this article too seriously. The Guardian continually plays with these obsessions, which are not class-oriented in the traditional Marxist way, but merely measure what is hip. All newspapers play this game now, which consist of DIY kits for helping readers to place themselves within whatever they conceive to be their peers' fashionable in-group.

[Stigand]

Don't take this article too seriously. The Guardian continually plays with these obsessions, which are not class-oriented in the traditional Marxist way, but merely measure what is hip. All newspapers play this game now, which consist of DIY kits for helping readers to place themselves within whatever they conceive to be their peers' fashionable in-group.

Fair enough - sorry to be such a curmudgeon.

[SobaAddict70]

What do you count among the greatest culinary contributions that the UK made with respect to its former colonies and territories?

No, Nigella doesn't count.

Soba

[SobaAddict70]

Since this week has been the week of thread bumpage, I was wondering if there were any significant food trends that you may have spotted coming out of the UK this past year....and if there are any you'd like to see coming in 2005.

We're familiar with most of the ones Stateside.

Any news?

Soba