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The Punch Topic

281 posts in this topic

The trouble is that any prepared items to be consumed at the venue will have to be prepared in the venue's kosher kitchen that afternoon. And I doubt I can claim much if any space there -- it's really small. I might be able to do ice soccer balls at home but probably not syrups and such.


Steven A. Shaw aka "Fat Guy"
Co-founder, Society for Culinary Arts & Letters, sshaw@egstaff.org
Proud signatory to the eG Ethics code
Director, New Media Studies, International Culinary Center (take my food-blogging course)

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Your kosher kitchen at home isn't good enough for them?


Samuel Lloyd Kinsey

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So since the Regent's Punch came up I thought I might ask a few questions since I was thinking about making a batch this Friday for a little get-together we're having. I had seen this recipe quoted here before but couldn't remember on what thread so I had been working off the one from Killer Cocktails, which differs only in a few minor details. So I was wondering about the following points of the recipe and would appreciate any pointers from Mr. Kinsey, Mr. Wondrich, or anyone else who has made this.

How clutch is the inclusion of seville oranges? I was going to just use all Valencias but is it still worth proceeding this way? I've never had a seville but my image of them suggests they would supply some additional acid and bitterness from the peel. Could this be compensated for by adding more lemon and/or a spoon of orange bitters, or is it even necessary?

The KC recipe calls for Wray & Nephew Rum in place of the then-unavailable Batavia Arrack. In such a small quantity is there a marked difference? I have some Arrack brought back by a travelling friend, but of course not knowing when I could get more I'd prefer to use the readily available WNOP. If it makes a significant difference to the end result I'll use the Arrack though of course, why have it if you're not going to use it?

How much champagne (or sparkling wine in my case) do you recommend? The recipe above suggests 1-2 bottles, which would be 2-4 bottles in the larger KC recipe. Is more really more here, or is just 'sportier'? I would assume that more wine would help dry out what appears to be a slightly sweet recipe (although I imagine punch in a bowl needs to be sweeter than individual drinks). Any thoughts on quantity here, and while we're at I assume inexpensive Spanish Cava or French Cremant will do fine here as it normally does for my purposes, any that you would avoid or will Cristalino suffice?

Thanks in advance, this is only my second or third attempt at large-bowl punch making, and I definitely want to minimize the trial and error with the expense involved.

-Andy


Andy Arrington

Journeyman Drinksmith

Twitter--@LoneStarBarman

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How much do you think that would suffer from being made with crap bar orange juice from concentrate? I figure that's what we're looking at if any fruit juices are utilized.

Some of the pasteurized, not-from-concentrate juices are decent in cocktails. One thing about citrus juice and club soda, though -- make sure you strain the pulp out of the juice (or buy the kind without pulp, if you're buying it), because when you pour in the club soda, the bubbles will attract all the pulp and bring it to the surface in a nasty looking raft.


Janet A. Zimmerman, aka "JAZ"
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jzimmerman@eGullet.org
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Author, The Healthy Pressure Cooker Cookbook and All About Cooking for Two

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Boy, this is up my alley.
That was my first thought too!

Peter Gamble aka "Peter the eater"

I just made a cornish game hen with chestnut stuffing. . .

Would you believe a pigeon stuffed with spam? . . .

Would you believe a rat filled with cough drops?

Moe Sizlack

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I was searching around for some credible punch recipes and came across this one for Rocky Mountain Punch in a piece by Julie Besonen in the New York Daily News. It appears to be an old recipe handed down by Dave Wondrich. I wonder if this might be appealing to a mass audience.


Steven A. Shaw aka "Fat Guy"
Co-founder, Society for Culinary Arts & Letters, sshaw@egstaff.org
Proud signatory to the eG Ethics code
Director, New Media Studies, International Culinary Center (take my food-blogging course)

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don't know if this is helpful, but my first thought was "habanero". could do a nice margarita with a slight habanero kick...i prefer a 2-1-1 with don julio reposado and agave nectar to taste.

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How clutch is the inclusion of seville oranges? I was going to just use all Valencias but is it still worth proceeding this way? I've never had a seville but my image of them suggests they would supply some additional acid and bitterness from the peel. Could this be compensated for by adding more lemon and/or a spoon of orange bitters, or is it even necessary?

The KC recipe calls for Wray & Nephew Rum in place of the then-unavailable Batavia Arrack. In such a small quantity is there a marked difference? I have some Arrack brought back by a travelling friend, but of course not knowing when I could get more I'd prefer to use the readily available WNOP. If it makes a significant difference to the end result I'll use the Arrack though of course, why have it if you're not going to use it?

How much champagne (or sparkling wine in my case) do you recommend? The recipe above suggests 1-2 bottles, which would be 2-4 bottles in the larger KC recipe. Is more really more here, or is just 'sportier'? I would assume that more wine would help dry out what appears to be a slightly sweet recipe (although I imagine punch in a bowl needs to be sweeter than individual drinks). Any thoughts on quantity here, and while we're at I assume inexpensive Spanish Cava or French Cremant will do fine here as it normally does for my purposes, any that you would avoid or will Cristalino suffice?

If you can't get Seville oranges, don't let that get in the way of having a nice bowl of punch. You could try orange bitters, or just say to hell with them. They do add a special something, but it's not an essential special something.

The arrack, however--well, if you've got some, what are you waiting for? This is exactly what it's for. A little bit will aromatize any punch recipe, and it really is irreplacable.

Finally, the champagne. I've ruined more punches by using bad-tasting cheap bubbly. Cava and prosecco both lack the acidity and leanness to make good punch, IMHO. I do, however, like the Gruet, from New mexico, and it's cheap.

I hope this helps!


aka David Wondrich

There are, according to recent statistics, 147 female bartenders in the United States. In the United Kingdom the barmaid is a feature of the wayside inn, and is a young woman of intelligence and rare sagacity. --The Syracuse Standard, 1895

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...

I hope this helps!

It does indeed, thank you, I think I'll try it out with the Gruet. Since Arrack is sadly not available here, I am going to test it once without, to see how it does for work purposes. I might toss a jigger or so in ofter tasting it though, I can only imagine how delicious it would be in that context.

Hopefully I can do it just this once without being kicked out of the club :wink:

Many thanks for the pointers.

-Andy


Andy Arrington

Journeyman Drinksmith

Twitter--@LoneStarBarman

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Oh cool!

We are having a few people over for election day shenanigans. A punch is a most excellent idea that hadn't occurred to me.


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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I've got a batch of Regent's Punch in the fridge for tonight, I'll let you know how it goes.


Andy Arrington

Journeyman Drinksmith

Twitter--@LoneStarBarman

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the holidays are upon us... what are people making?

And with that being said, anyone (I'm looking at you, Katie and slkinsey) care to expand on some of the punches that were mentioned in this thread? Katie you mentioned a few variations of Fish House punch, and slkinsey mentioned something about "Jersey Lightning" punch. I'd love to rip ideas from all of you then shamelessly pawn them off as my own at the various parties I'll be at this season.


I would kill everyone in this room for a drop of sweet beer...

Homer Simpson

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I can now personally vouch for the Regent's Punch (listed here) and have been trying a few others scaled down to a practical size for home experimentation. On the Fish House Punch angle, I would not recommend Apry as a substitute for peach, and as the Brizzard Peach is, in my experience, quite difficult to obtain, I might recommend the variation of replacing the original quantity of peach brandy with Laird's Bonded, resulting in a recipe similar to this:

1 lb (~2 cups) sugar

pint lemon juice

24 oz Cognac

12 oz dark Rum

12 oz Laird's Bonded

3 qts water

Big ice, etc.

Apple House Punch? I donno but damn if it isn't delicious, and the Bonded Applejack, while apparently tricky to locate in some places, is, in my experience, waaaay easier to find than quality peach brandy (and you definitely need quality there).


Andy Arrington

Journeyman Drinksmith

Twitter--@LoneStarBarman

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Okay, so tonight I got together with some of the other parents for a tasting of my first crack at a punch (working title "Builder's Punch"). The recipe I started with is called Rocky Mountain Punch and I found it in a New York Daily News article by Julie Besonen. The recipe was contributed by Dave Wondrich, from a book by a guy named Jerry Thomas called "How to Mix Drinks," which was published in 1862 and apparently contains 59 punch recipes.

The recipe calls for Champagne, Jamaican rum, maraschino liqueur, lemons and superfine sugar.

Bearing in mind the restrictions above, I found a kosher sparkling wine that I thought was quite nice and a bit on the sweet side (I figured that would be desirable for the punch, and might even eliminate the need for added sugar): a sparkling muscat from Teal Lake in Australia.

Of the Jamaican rums in my cabinet (I was surprised to find three, then again I've been accumulating liquor for about 17 years and drinking very little of it), none had kosher certification on the label nor could I find online references guaranteeing their kashruth, however I did find evidence that all Bacardi unflavored rums are kosher. I chose Ron Bacardi Reserve, which I think is like a Jamaican rum in style. I don't think they still make that bottling, however it may be similar to Bacardi 8. I'll have to taste to be sure, but I used what I had.

I likewise couldn't find a guarantee that maraschino was kosher, however I tasted some and found that to my palate it had a lot of common ground with amaretto liqueur. And the website I've been relying on for kosher liquor information said that Amaretto di Saronno was okay. So I used that.

I made 1/5 of the recipe: 1 bottle sparkling wine (full = 5 bottles), 6.4 oz rum (full = 1 quart), 3.2 oz (amaretto) liqueur (full = 1 pint), and 1.5 lemons sliced (full = 6 lemons), soaked in the rum and (amaretto) liqueur for 4 hours.

The recipe calls for a soccer-ball-sized ice sphere but for this experiment we just used ice cubes.

The resulting beverage was quite tasty to me and, more importantly, to the parents who tried it. But I thought it could use some bitters. At the same time, I knew that adding bitters would take it too far away from the minimum sweetness level needed by the general population. So I added 2 ounces of simple syrup and 6 drops of Regan's Orange Bitters to the remaining 1/2 of the recipe. This dramatically improved the cocktail -- really brightened it and gave it added subtlety.

Now I have to do a little research to see which bitters are kosher, though, because I don't think Regan's are. In addition, I need to verify that Amaretto di Saronno is nut-free. I believe that, though it has an almond taste, it's actually made with apricot kernel oil just like the cookies. But I have to check.


Steven A. Shaw aka "Fat Guy"
Co-founder, Society for Culinary Arts & Letters, sshaw@egstaff.org
Proud signatory to the eG Ethics code
Director, New Media Studies, International Culinary Center (take my food-blogging course)

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Now I have to do a little research to see which bitters are kosher, though, because I don't think Regan's are. In addition, I need to verify that Amaretto di Saronno is nut-free. I believe that, though it has an almond taste, it's actually made with apricot kernel oil just like the cookies. But I have to check.

Hate to rain on your parade, but almond allergic people shouldn't eat/drink apricot kernels either.


Edited by Kerry Beal (log)

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It's not that there's actually likely to be an almond-allergic person in attendance. The school has a policy. The entire building is a "nut-free, seed-free zone." So the question is does Amaretto di Saronno liqueur qualify as a nut-free, seed-free product. I should probably email the company and see if they have an allergy statement. If the amaretto doesn't work out I'm thinking Cherry Heering for the next round of experiments.


Steven A. Shaw aka "Fat Guy"
Co-founder, Society for Culinary Arts & Letters, sshaw@egstaff.org
Proud signatory to the eG Ethics code
Director, New Media Studies, International Culinary Center (take my food-blogging course)

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My multi-day Thanksgiving prep and cooking marathon is being fueled by the fantastic Milk Punch from Wondrich's Imbibe! I suggest whole milk (even with a bit of cream) and do not suggest that you cut back on the cognac or rum.


Chris Amirault

camirault@eGstaff.org

eG Ethics Signatory

Sir Luscious got gator belts and patty melts

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I made the Regent's Punch following the Saveur recipe and it was fantastic. It's worth hunting down the specific ingredients for this one, as Wondrich states. For example, your local Latino mercado will likely have sour oranges. Finding the arrack is trickier, though worth the hunt.


Chris Amirault

camirault@eGstaff.org

eG Ethics Signatory

Sir Luscious got gator belts and patty melts

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Five of us went through one recipe of Regent's Punch for Thanksgiving. It's a bona fide sensation among my friends. Fish House Punch is a 40+ year tradition in my family, so that's not new news for me. So now I'm wondering which punch I should make next...


Samuel Lloyd Kinsey

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For Thanksgiving we did a batch of Bombay Government Punch to the recipe handed out at Tales from D. Wondrich and A. Katz (and I think is much the same as posted on Chowhound). Yum... Depleted our house stock of H cognac, so our shopping list grows.


Edited by eas (log)

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Five of us went through one recipe of Regent's Punch for Thanksgiving.  It's a bona fide sensation among my friends.

I'm going to make this on saturday to celebrate my birthday Sam have you tweaked Dave's recipe at all or are you still going by what you linked up thread?

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I haven't been able to get any Seville oranges, so I've been including some orange bitters. That's about it.


Samuel Lloyd Kinsey

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I haven't been able to get any Seville oranges, so I've been including some orange bitters.  That's about it.

5 or so dashes?

This will be the first bowl of punch I've ever attempted to make, I'm pretty excited about it.

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