Seitan

[Pickles]

I am curious about this product--a wheat gluton used as meat substitute. I have a couple cookbooks and the authors seem to really like it, and say it has a meaty texture. But...what does it taste like? Most soy meat products are pretty lousy in my opinion. I have used them for my vegetarian clients, and finally settled on "Gimme Lean" for "sausage" stuffed peppers, and in quiches made with soy milk. It's not half bad. Especially sauteed until crispy and drowned in ketchup. But I digress. How that's SATAN (I'm leery already...that's how you pronounce it!!) stuff??

[Mudpuppie]

I've never tasted the devil, so I can't really answer your question.

But, seitan I like. In fact, I had it for dinner last night. It's not a soy product -- it's wheat. It can taste like sawdust if you don't flavor it well enough, but fortunately it's pretty amenable to such things.

I don't like the brands that come already flavored. They're usually drowned in soy sauce, which obviously makes them much less versatile. The one I buy is made buy White Wave.

The whole point is the texture which, unlike tofu, I find really enjoyable. It's chewy and sort of meat-like (especially if, like me, it's been years since you've eaten meat). Mostly it becomes an agent for whatever sauce or flavoring you add to it.

I like it in fajitas. I "marinate" for a while in lime, cumin, chipotle powder, and garlic. Then I pan fry with onions and peppers until it's browned. (I like it crispy.)

I also like it with barbecue sauce.

I'm not sure it's something meat-eaters will automatically appreciate. For the rest of us, though, it's something of a godsend.

Edit: I've always heard it pronoucned SAY-tann (like bedpan), not SAY-tunn (like satan).

Edited February 16, 2004 by Mudpuppie (log)

[chezcherie]

oh, pickles, you just gave me a good laugh, remembering when a friend was shopping from an ingredient list from a visiting chef....she was clueless as to what to look for, seitan-wise, so seeking advise from a clerk, she said (to the clerk, whose back was turned) "excuse me, do you know about seitan?". the clerk wheeled around, and drew back in horror, thinking she was being approached by an evangelical devil-worshipper.

sorry--can't help with the seitan thing...recently had to "recipe-test" with veggie bacon, and it nearly made me weep--looked exactly like bacon my kids woulda made from play-doh when they were little. tasted like it , too (tho i will admit that the brown sugar and chipotle poder we sprinkled on improved it a bit!)

[nessa]

I've had seitan. It was really quite tastey the way my Chinese friends prepared it. I think she said she put in star anise, soy and a touch of sugar? I was quite impressed with it.

[Pan]

Chalk me up as another fan of seitan. I don't have it frequently but used to enjoy eating a salad featuring seitan at a local vegetarian restaurant. It's got a nice texture and taste.

[Pickles]

Sounds like a skilled hand might be able to tame Seitan! I think with me it's always a textural issue. So if it remotely gives me the "chew" that a soy product can't deliver, it may be worth a try. I will buy a small amount and give it shot. I have some "pot roast" kind of recipes for it. That might be a good place for me to start! Crescent Dragonwagon (yep..that's her name!) has a recipe for "Sliced Brisket of Seitan, Jewish Style" in her Passionate Vegetarian cookbook. I might try that. This book is a monstah! Just HUGE!! http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...=glance&s=books

[Mudpuppie]

My advice: Don't try to make mock pot roast or mock anything. Think of it as its own thing, not a poor imitation of something else.

[redfox]

That sounds like good advice, indeed, mudpuppie. I have used canned wheat gluten (rinsed thoroughly) very successfully to make a saucy sort of Asian-ish dish that is very good over rice: stir-fry onions and other vegetables if you want them, add grated fresh ginger and minced garlic, then the gluten plus broth, a splash of rice wine, a splash of vinegar, dark soy sauce, a bit of cornstarch and a lot of freshly ground black pepper. Add some scallions, cut into 1" pieces, and simmer until the sauce is thick. Not authentic anything, but not mock meat, either, and very tasty. (Hm, maybe it's time I made that again soon.)

I like the canned gluten better than the shrink-wrapped seitan in a package I've had. I don't know why that should be. I was thinking of trying to make fresh seitan some time, since I have a jar of vital wheat gluten around for baking purposes. I don't know if it would taste any better than storebought, but it's an appealing idea. I think it's quite easy if you're already starting with the gluten, rather than whole flour.

[Mudpuppie]

I was thinking of trying to make fresh seitan some time, since I have a jar of vital wheat gluten around for baking purposes. I don't know if it would taste any better than storebought, but it's an appealing idea. I think it's quite easy if you're already starting with the gluten, rather than whole flour.

I've made it before with varying degrees of success. It's the texture that's usually the problem -- it runs between pencil eraser and dishwater-soaked bread. When it's bad, it's very very bad. When it's good, it's still not as good as the store-bought stuff.

Maybe I just need a new recipe.

[Jinmyo]

In Chinese this called mein-jin. It is available in tins at just about any Chinese grocery I have ever encountered for about $2 a tin.

It is often called "mock duck" or "mock pork." Just ignore that.

Just rinse in very hot water, then marinate and flavour as you will.

Could it be... Seitan? How con-veeen-ient."

[redfox]

Oh! Well, that is very good to know. Maybe I will stick to my good old "mock duck." I have a sudden urge to stock up!

[chow guy]

maybe I just need a new recipe

Brother Ron Pickarsaki 's Friendly Foods has a time consuming recipe for Seitan.

I like White Wave brand unflavored. The trick is to marinate or slow cook it in a tasty sauce or marinade.

[Katherine]

I've always made my own from gluten flour aka vital wheat gluten. I never had any recipes to work from, so I just winged it. Kung pao seitan and seitan green chili were a huge hit with the vegans my daughter used to hang out with. Also the seitan in the style of smoked pork belly (fakin). And last week I had seitan cubes (resembling stew beef) with green beans, garlic, ginger and chili oil that nonvegetarians were drooling over at work.

Looking into writing a cookbook.

[ErinB]

Former vegan here.

Seitan, IMHO, is the best meat substitute. I like to buy locally made, so depending upon where you live check out the local brands. Sometimes the commercially made can have a tougher texture, in my experience.

I have this really good dish from a Lorna Sass cookbook that is udon noodles, scallions, ginger, seitan, sesame oil, dark sesame oil, garlic and a vegetable that you want to add.

That's been my favorite dish. Seitan definitely doesn't compare to meat, and tofu can sometimes be a more interesting unique texture, but if you want to lower your calorie intake, seitan has the lowest calorie and fat content of all of the meat protein substitutes.

[AzRaeL]

wait!

is Gluten good or bad?

[sml311]

I have used Seitan before in chili. It works pretty well if you brown it first, but if you don't it has a texture that's too chewy in my opinion. I think it adds a little more heft to a veggie chili.

SML

[picaman]

I've always made my own from gluten flour aka vital wheat gluten.

Very easy to make and much, much cheaper than buying it pre-made. I just combine vital wheat gluten with spices (often various flavors of sausage seasoning) and water, until it's firm but a bit sticky. Then I boil the "dough" in a broth made of tamari, water and a bit of kombu (optional) for about an hour. It will swell up, but shrinks when cool.

It's very versatile, and does make a yummy BBQ sandwich when thinly sliced.

Jamie

EDIT: Added cooking time.

Edited February 17, 2004 by picaman (log)

[Katherine]

wait!

is Gluten good or bad?

As long as you don't have celiac disease or a wheat allergy, gluten is good food. It's the goodness of wheat without massive quantities of starch.

If you tried to get all your protein from whole grains and beans, veganism would be an extremely high-carb diet.

[redfox]

Also the seitan in the style of smoked pork belly (fakin).

Ooh! That sounds intriguing. Tell us more?

[Katherine]

Also the seitan in the style of smoked pork belly (fakin).

Ooh! That sounds intriguing. Tell us more?

I can tell you approximately what I did, as I don't currently have an exact recipe. If I end up writing the cookbook, I will end up with specifics.

The moisture level in the dough can be varied, and the moister it is, the softer it cooks up. So I made two batches (seasoned well with salt and pepper), one moister, and one with cocoa, beet juice, and paprika to color it deep pink, in a meatlike sort of way. Both pieces were shaped roughly into rectangles, and pressed together. They were simmered (not too long) in salted water, which caused the white layer to get softer than the dark section. I sliced it 3/8" thick, and simmered it in a liquid which contained vinegar, sugar, spices, mesquite smoke flavored oil, and cabbage.

The vegans loved it, but I'm not sure they would have liked it so much if they realized it was mock pork belly they were eating.

[Toasted]

I love seitan. Grilled teriyake seitan kebobs are very tasty with vegetables

and/or rice. One of my most popular recipes is a "not beef stew" using cubes

of seitan, a vegetarian gravy, and stew vegetables. This is very good over

noodles. When I make seitan at home I freeze most of what I make which

results in a firmer, chewier texture. One of the benefits of making seitan

at home is that you can make it into any shape you want. I have a seitan

cookbook that includes some pretty cool recipes using raw seitan. You can

roll it out and stuff it and than bake it with various sauces. It's a good

book, I'll take a look for it and post the title if I find it.

[redfox]

I got bit with the bug to try making homemade, so I've put together a batch (seasoned with salt and pepper and a little sesame oil) and will use it in kung pao gluten tonight. It looks a little super-chewy right now, but then it hasn't had its braising yet, only the original simmering, so we'll see how it comes out.

[alacarte]

I always thought it was pronounced "SAY-ton."

[Pickles]

I always thought it was pronounced "SAY-ton."

I've heard it pronounced all different ways, but I like the "SAY-ton" one the best because I have a 7th grade sense of humour. I am happy to see so many *postive comments* about the flavor and texture, especially and now I am looking forward to getting some seitan and taking it for a test drive...perhaps using my friends as guinae pigs this weekend. This time, I hope they won't be... glutons for punishment.

[Moopheus]

One problem I've had making my own is that the dough is very very sticky. It is very easy to make, but don't let the dough dry on the utenstils, it'll dry like cement.