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New Yorker need inputs


vienna

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Hi all,

I'm visiting London next week for 5 days for the first time. I'd like suggestions on restaurants that could give me a "wow" and the best London offers that is not available in NYC, as I live in NYC where I'm very satisfied with choices we have here. I don't want to end up in a tourist trap places and would like experts'opinions. I did some research and came up with:

1. Fine Dining at Gordon Ramsay at RHR (How is it compared to say Alain Ducasse or Jean Georges?)

2. Best Afternoon tea, is it still Brown's? Please compared with Claridges, Savoy, Orangery. Has to be excellent food, ambience and posh decor.

3. St. John

4. Need best authentic indian food

5. How's London's dimsum compared to NYC's? I think the best in nYC is Ping on Mott's for the authentic one.

6. Trendy,young places...heard about Nahm, Hakkassan..or others?

7. Need input on best lounge

FYI I'm in mid 20s.

Any opinions are greatly appreciated, thank you.

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Ramsay is harder to get into than Ducasse & Jean Georges - but substantially cheaper (and probably better than ADNY, anyway). Alternatives - Club Gascon; Le Gavroche; The Captial; The Square. Out of town Le Manior near Oxford (a treat). I'm sure others will offer alternatives.

St John - v good choice

Afternoon tea - not quite my cup of tea - but if you want a grand experience probably claridges (btw - I have not done this myself)

I cant really help on the rest as I'm neither, young, cool or hip :wink:

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And don't forget a decent pub. I'm not a londoner so I can't really give a decent suggestion (Unless you fancy a detour into Hampshire!)

I'm sure someone can give you a recommendation (Wenlock arms?)

I love animals.

They are delicious.

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Nahm is probably not the best if you're looking for a trendy, young atmosphere. The dining room is pretty unprepossessing - fairly standard hotel dining room fittings (not chintzy but not designer cool either), and the time I went there (admittedly a weeknight) there wasn't a particularly young vibe.

Having said that, I loved Nahm: the Thai banquet was fantastic (especially when compared to the standard green-curry-orama experience of workaday Thai places in London or the US). The service was great as well - I remember a great Australian sommelier who chose us a really good South Australian Viognier. Disclaimer: I haven't been to the fabled Lotus of Siam in Las Vegas, although I understand that those who've been to both LoS and Nahm still thought Nahm was worth the visit.

So in short: Nahm doesn't aspire to be wildly trendy, but is great anyway.

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Dim sum - I hear Hakasan does the best dim sum in town (I'm sure you can find a lot of discussion by doing a search). Controversial, but I don't think dim sum in general is as good here as it is in NYC. Places that are good (for London) are Royal China (several branches, one in St John's Wood; one in Bayswater and a couple of others - but I haven't been enough times to all of them to be able to compare) and Phoenix Palace, Glentworth Street just behind Baker Street Tube. To me the main appeal of dim sum is that it accommodates a large group and you can be stuffed for £10 a head.

re: Indian food - again, loads of lively debate and discussion - the gist of which is that "best Indian" is like saying "best Italian" - India's food is highly regional and you'll get recommendations based on what kind you want to eat. Parsi? The Parsee in Highgate (though I haven't been there in awhile). Punjabi? Southall. Goan? Ma Goa. "High end" Indian with a mix of different styles, in a more elegant/refined setting - include The Cinnamon Club; Zaika; and Tamarind. Be prepared to pay. Cheap and cheeful Indian - another mix but more on the 'nouvelle', trendy and/or upmarket streetfood end of the spectrum include Mela, Chowki and Masala Zone (though I really like the first two much more). Again, search the boards for loads of commentary.

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> 1. Fine Dining at Gordon Ramsay at RHR (How is it compared to say Alain Ducasse or Jean Georges?)

GR at RHR is very good although I find the tables too close together and they like to turn their tables way too quickly for me. Also I found the maitre d' to be a bit patronising and pretentious. Booking up is difficult in the evenings especially. Basically, call up at 10am one month before you want to go (they don't take bookings beyond this).

Alternatives I use regularly, and often I can call up all of these an hour before to gain a table...

Aubergine is my favourite, but then I go in there so often (about once a week) I'm almost part of the furniture. Can seem stuffy if you're not a regular, but it needn't be so: Maitre d' Thierry Tomassin (ex Gavroche) always has billions of anecdotes ready to tell. I really like the food that Billy Drabble puts out there - classic French style with enough variation to make it exciting, but not too off the wall to turn you off. Wine list is quite good, but the gouge is rather high. When it's very busy service can be a little slow. IMHO the best pan fried foie gras in London - perfectly caramelised on the outside, melts in the mouth on the inside. An astoundingly good truffle tasting menu when in season - the best tasting menu I've ever had. Snail Tortellini starter highly recommended at the moment, as is the gingerbread foie gras. Good table separation, but wooden flooring can make you feel like your voice can be heard everywhere. Avoid the table for two behind the pillar unless you like romantic tete-a-tetes: you may get overlooked by service... in fact, I'm going there tonight.

Gavroche is excellent in general, and I recommend the eight+ course Exceptionel menu every time (£80), and the somelier can match wines by the glass with it for each course (£40) which is astonishingly good value. Service is perfection itself. I contest anyone to find fault in this respect. Chef Michel Roux Jr does a couple of tours each night, and he's a really charming guy. Fantastic wine menu. Some find it a little too formal. Surroundings are rather eighties, but you're coming for the food and the booze, right?

The Connaught is fairly new, with an Italian bent on the cuisine. Fairly classic fine dining, and some like the slightly less formal atmosphere. Run by chef Angela Hartnett, one of GR's proteges. I prefer the main restaurant rather than the grill room. Lamb is just out of this world at the moment. The Chef's table is awesome - lots of chances to have a go yourself. Sample menu at http://www.nezbrun.com

The Capital is wonderfully understated. Food is perfection, wine list good. Favourite tables for me are those by the window. Service good. Never failed to please.

Petrus has recently moved to the Berkeley hotel. Run by Marcus Wareing, a GR guy, some of the menu can seem formulaic in the GR style. Still very good. Chef's table is good, but there's no hands-on. Atmosphere can be rather power crazy with movers and shakers doing their deals. Service has always been excellent for me, but not quite up to Le Gavroche standard. Sample menu at http://www.nezbrun.com

Other favourites of mine - Glasshouse (Kew), Pied a Terre (Fitzrovia), Escargot Picasso room (Soho), Savoy Grill, Orrery (Marlebone), Putney Bridge, 1 Lombard Street fine dining restaurant (City), Sketch lecture room (Mayfair - make sure your credit limit is up to it), Foliage (Knightsbridge), Richard Corrigan (Soho).

More downmarket, but nevertheless deserving a go is Racine. Quite exciting French food at a very reasonable price. The best steak tartare in London IMHO.

Where I avoid...

o GR at Claridges (service bad, two hour table turning, formula GR food)

o The Square (service bad, chef has a cappuccino fetish with his sauces)

o Club Gascon (service appalling, atmosphere way too loud, they know a milllion different ways to mess up foie gras)

o Mirabelle (nothing special about the food or anything here)

o Hakkasan (way too up themselves, perhaps I'm getting too old, but food is good)

o Any Conran place (except Orrery)

o Anywhere where Jamie Oliver has an interest

o Anywhere with a long waiting list

o Anywhere with a line at the door

o Anywhere with fast table turning.

> 4. Need best authentic indian food

Not sure if you'd call them authentic, but my favourites are Zaika (try the eight+ course tasting menu with selected wines), Tamarind (for Michelin starred kebabs!), Bombay Brasserie (Sunday brunch buffet).

> 6. Trendy,young places...heard about Nahm, Hakkassan..or others?

I avoid them all, but then I'm in my late thirties. I stopped queuing to get into places ten years ago ;-) The only trendy place I regularly go is Ubon for lunch.

Cheers, Howard

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trendy...hmmm.

i'll second circe's loungelover, you might also try keston lodge in islington...it's not velvet rope but it has hoxton square feel which is a certain type of uk trendy which might be quite fun for you. for eurotrash trendy, go to noble rot or sketch.

foodwise, it has to be st john (i prefer bread and wine on commercial road and it's close to lounge lover) and hakkasan for me. i always feel not quite trendy enough for st john, they do that british cool thing almost too well, but you're almost guarenteed to spot tracy emin :-0 have cocktails in hakkasan's ling ling lounge too.

we don't have anywhere that has the buzz of, say wd-50. i think you're really spoiled there...but hopefully you can get something uniquely london...

buzz wise there's the wolesley, but i haven't been so i can't comment. you might be underwhelmed by the "celebrites" you see and i can't comment on the food.

hope this helps!

Suzi Edwards aka "Tarka"

"the only thing larger than her bum is her ego"

Blogito ergo sum

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Howard - have you tried Tom Aiken's yet?

Nope, but it is my intention to. I've tried a couple of times on the off chance but tables weren't ready until 9:30pm which is a bit late for me - I like to get my money's worth!

Billy Drabble told me the other day that he and Tom Aikens were on the same chef course.

Cheers, Howard

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One place I have been to recently, and might fit the bill is MJU.

Service great, kinda funky atmosphere, food pretty damned good actually. All round very impressive.

It's modern pacific rim food, with the occasional nod to classic french technique.

The beef tataki with truffle and horseradish cream is to die for.

A meal without wine is... well, erm, what is that like?

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Howard - have you tried Tom Aiken's yet?

not howard - but i went to tom aikens for lunch this week and had one of the best meals in a long, long, loooooong time.

staggeringly assured, astonishingly complex - what was described as a lentil 'soup' was actually (deep breath) a bowl of a kind of liquidy frothy mousse, almost truffly in flavour, separated by two strips of crispy ventreche from a 'cassonade' - like a savoury creme brulee of lentils, two slabs of stickily flawless pork belly and a giant, silky raviolo.

the rest of the meal was equally intricate, equally good. the breads alone are astonishing. and it costs £24.50 (i think...) for three courses.

i enjoyed it far more than when i'd been for dinner.

well deserving of - at least - that one star.

x

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Vienna,

I hope you are ready for the price differential, which put a damper on many of my meals here the first few months. Even when it was better than I could get in NY, it was always SO much more expensive that it was hard not to factor that into my enjoyment. Especially now with the exchange rate... I hope you can try to set that aside.

3) St John - you really shouldn't miss this. I think it is a place you will not be able to find anywhere else in the world and brings "british cuisine" right where it should be. Game, unusual cuts of meat, marrow bone salad, LOOOOVELY english dessert... or I should say Pudding here. And the restaurant has a certain hip factor to it.

4) Ah, now Indian Cuisine here is also something that is done better than anywhere in America. For Pakistani go to New Tayyeb. Personally, I was not pleased with Zaika, thought they "anglicized" the food. I agree with fusion but I don't agree with dumbing things down. Mela is very good but they are doing a "special ayurvedic menu" for the next month and I haven't been so I can't say anything about it. May be interesting for you to go try it though, when else would you get the chance to sample that sort of a menu?

5) I love Ping's. For comparable and possibly better go to the baker street branch of Royal China (but be prepared its MUCH more expensive). But I think Hakkasan shouldn't be missed, its another one of kind sort of place, very trendy, very hip, but also very good food. The only places I can think of that do comparable dim sum are in Hong Kong... or Yank Sing in San Francisco.

Have fun!

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Thanks all for the fast replies...I scored Gordon Ramsay at RHR for lunch.

St John and Hakkasan haven't made a res yet, as they are still maybe, esp Hakkasan.

So afternoon tea best is Claridges?? Looking for amazing posh place and of course good food.

Indian I prefer cheap and authentic..not looking for fine dining.

Oh, FYI, I'm a light eater, I prefer quality over quantity :biggrin:

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i've heard that browns is "better" than claridges for tea, but i have been to neither. however, i have the *beautiful* chinaware they use at claridges, green & white art deco style from memory, so if i were to go for tea, i would go there.

Suzi Edwards aka "Tarka"

"the only thing larger than her bum is her ego"

Blogito ergo sum

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