Pressure Cooked Stock

[joesan]

Guy -the WMF pans are good. On a par with the KR ones. Though KR are widely held to be the best.

In my opinion you should go for the largest size since for stock you want a reasonable sized pot. As regards not making the stock cloudy that comes for free when using a Pressure cooker- it's one of main benefits together with less loss of flavour components deeper flavour and quicker production. No brainer really - get the pressure cooker...

[Patrik Svensson]

It's large but I can fit it in a drawer in my kitchen.

It's more tall than wide, it has the same diameter as the smaller ones like the 6.5 and 4.5.

I have induction and it comes up to pressure really quick.

Yesterday I used it to pressure steam cauliflower with amazing result.

[Guy MovingOn]

Thanks guys! I also asked the same queston to Dave Arnold at Cooking Issues, and he seemed to think it was a good model too! It's on my birthday list for next month now!

Also, when making stock, have any of you tried the "double stock" method? I saw it on Heston Blumenthal's In Search of Perfection when he made a Chinese duck consomme. It seems like you use half the ingredients with 1 amount of water, discard those ingredients after cooking, use the same water again with the second half of ingredients.

However, what I would like to know is whether you are essentially doubling the normal amount of ingredients for that amount of water, halving the normal amount of water for such an amount of ingredients, or getting much better results from a standard amount of ingredients and water??

I'm sorry if I'm not very clear

Edited March 19, 2010 by Guy MovingOn (log)

[joesan]

Guy - I have tried this method. It is good but, like many of Heston's roads to "perfection", a more expensive method.

You do this because the original ingredients have yielded all/most of their flavour to the stock and are a little tired. When you add the new batch of ingredients you get fresher top notes since the second batch of ingredients is not being cooked as long. To my mind this is a great procedure if you have plenty of ingredients to spare but it's not generally required for a good stock.

[Guy MovingOn]

Guy - I have tried this method. It is good but, like many of Heston's roads to "perfection", a more expensive method.

You do this because the original ingredients have yielded all/most of their flavour to the stock and are a little tired. When you add the new batch of ingredients you get fresher top notes since the second batch of ingredients is not being cooked as long. To my mind this is a great procedure if you have plenty of ingredients to spare but it's not generally required for a good stock.

Thank you joesan! You are extremely helpful! I didnt realise that it adds to the complexity of the flavour due to the different durations of cooking, so thanks for the information! I guess in this case then, that it requires double the ingredients conventionally required for a certain amount of liquid? (BTW I read many of your posts on the Sous Vide thread and found them most helpful! )

Edited March 19, 2010 by Guy MovingOn (log)

[Anonymous Modernist 3337]

So, I've been making my stocks in the pressure cooker, and they are great, but I have one, serious, problem. The stocks come out very clear. Almost consomme like when hot. However, if I add any acidic ingredient to the stocks in saucemaking, they immediately turn very cloudy. I don't remember this happening with traditionally cooked stocks. Any ideas here, guys?

[Anonymous Modernist 2882]

About the only hypothesis I can come up with is that pressure cooking leaches out more Calcium and bicarbonate ion from the bones than traditional methods. Adding acid to Calcium will alter the bicarbonate buffer system to favour carbonic acid like this:

H+ + HCO3- --> H2CO3

... which will then react with free Calcium ion to form insoluble Calcium Carbonate:

CO3 2- + Ca2+ --> CaCO3

[Emily_R]

Hi All --

I'm about to make a batch of vegetable stock with scraps I've been saving in my freezer... I was planning to use my pressure cooker for this, but when Iook online I see widely varying recommendations for how long to cook the stock for under pressure. Recommendations range anywhere from 5-10 minutes to 45 minutes. Any insight here on how long to cook it for to get the most flavor from the vegetables but not to over-extract it and get something bitter (if that's possible?)

Thanks!

Emily

[Yariv]

Modernist cuisine says 35 minutes. That's what I use and it works well. My guess is that the only problem with longer might be things falling apart (anyone know of a different reason?).

[pazzaglia]

The Veggie Queen says 5 minutes with natural release and that's what I use. Here's her veggie stock video..

It only takes about 5 minutes at high pressure to burst the cells of most vegetables to release their juices into the liquid. Don't see why you would need an extra 30 on top of that unless you have some exotic vegetable in your stock that is particularly dense. You could always open, reserve some liquid and make the rest go for 30 more and see if the difference is worthwhile.

I do 35 minutes for chicken, and 60 for beef, veal, or pork stock. Just cover the ingredients of any stock with water for a 2x concentrate.

Ciao,

L

P.S. I add yellow onions with their brown skin (without the roots) and toss in a tomato for a little acidity. It will be the darkest most luscious vegetable stock you've ever made!!

Edited November 4, 2012 by pazzaglia (log)

[Yariv]

Heston says 20 minutes and let it cool alone (as does the video above). The mc books say cool under water. That might be a small difference. Anyway, it's interesting to compare if there is a difference between the two times.

[radtek]

Modernist cuisine says 35 minutes. That's what I use and it works well. My guess is that the only problem with longer might be things falling apart (anyone know of a different reason?).

Too long and you'll go past extracting vegetable flavors and go into the realm of vegetal flavor which is pretty undesirable. Imagine what broccoli and cauliflower cooked to mushlike consistency tastes like- that's vegetal.

[Emily_R]

Well as luck had it, I had enough vegetable scraps to do two batches. I cooked one for about 28 minutes, and another for 8 minutes. And there was essentially no noticeable difference between the two! Yay for shorter cooking times.

[Yariv]

Thanks Emily, good to know.

[Emily_R]

Oh,and one other note. Don't make the mistake I did in my second batch of stock, and throw a garlic clove in there. Not good. Even with a shorter cooking time, the pressure cooker seemed to really amplify the garlic flavor (over what I'd expect with just a regular stovetop simmer)...

[mkayahara]

Having done a variety of pressure-cooker recipes, I always find pressure-cooked garlic to be unpleasant. No idea why.

[slkinsey]

Modernist cuisine says 35 minutes. That's what I use and it works well. My guess is that the only problem with longer might be things falling apart (anyone know of a different reason?).

Too long and you'll go past extracting vegetable flavors and go into the realm of vegetal flavor which is pretty undesirable. Imagine what broccoli and cauliflower cooked to mushlike consistency tastes like- that's vegetal.

In this connection, the specific vegetables used in the MC recipe may not suffer from this problem. In particular, I can't imagine why anyone would want to put cruciferous vegetables in a vegetable stock.

[naguere]

Yep, what slkinsey said, Noo cabbage.