Jump to content
  • Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create a free account.

If You Had To Pick One


robyn

Recommended Posts

My husband and I will be going to London in May - first time we've been there in 7 years. A week long vacation. Lots of museums, theater, the Chelsea Flower Show - and - of course - food. We like all kinds of food (from the fanciest to the plainest) - as long as it's good. So - if you don't mind - I'd like to pick your brains a bit. If you had to pick your one favorite restaurant/bar/pub in any of the following categories in central London - which would you pick - and why?

1. Really fancy;

2. New English cuisine (don't know if that's the right phrasing - I mean what the best chefs are doing to reinterpret English food);

3. Indian;

4. Ethnic (non-Indian);

5. West End after theater;

6. Lunch near Chelsea flower show;

7. South Bank or anyplace near Marriott County Hall Hotel (we will be staying there couresty of Marriott Rewards program so we'll have lots of money left over for food);

8. Outrageously good interior design.

Also - what is your favorite extravagant food store?

Note that I have been reading a bit about the "fancy" restaurants (reviews and the like). I was thinking of the Gordon Ramsey restaurant in Chelsea - but then I read somewhere that it is now a two-seating restaurant. Perhaps it is a prejudice of mine - but I think restaurants of that alleged caliber should only have one seating. So comments about this restaurant and the two seatings would be appreciated too. Thanks for your help, Robyn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1. Really fancy; RHR. No contest. Don't worry about table turning. Just go.

2. New English cuisine (don't know if that's the right phrasing - I mean what the best chefs are doing to reinterpret English food); St John Bread and Wine. Have an Eccles Cake with Lancashire Cheese.

3. Indian; I went to Mela last week and thought it was OK. Other people will make better Indian recs than me.

4. Ethnic (non-Indian); Hakkasan (Chinese)

5. West End after theater; The Ivy, just in case Rupert Everett is there ;-)

6. Lunch near Chelsea flower show;

7. South Bank or anyplace near Marriott County Hall Hotel (we will be staying there couresty of Marriott Rewards program so we'll have lots of money left over for food); Go back to RHR for lunch. Spend some of that money on a cab there

8. Outrageously good interior design. Hakkasan makes me feel like a Bond Girl. Not sure if that has anthing to do with the interior design though.

Shopping? Borough Market (early on a Friday. Not on a Saturday like I did last week) Books for Cooks in Notting Hill.

Have a good trip :-)

Suzi Edwards aka "Tarka"

"the only thing larger than her bum is her ego"

Blogito ergo sum

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tarka - Lunch and dinner at RHR. That is quite an endorsement! On the other hand - I was surprised that after all these years - London only has 2 Michelin 3 stars (and of course - this is one of them). I haven't been to that many Michelin 3 stars - and most of them were/are in France - but I have never been disappointed.

By the way - last time we were in London - we went to a place called Chez Nico on Park Lane. Not great but very good - the chef was rumored to be a lunatic but we saw no evidence of that the night we dined :). It seems to have closed - and the chef now seems to run a small chain called Simply Nico. Are any of those worth a lunch or dinner?

I suspect if I wore a short enough skirt and had enough champagne - I might feel like a Bond girl's mother :). Robyn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tarka - Lunch and dinner at RHR. That is quite an endorsement! On the other hand - I was surprised that after all these years - London only has 2 Michelin 3 stars (and of course - this is one of them). I haven't been to that many Michelin 3 stars - and most of them were/are in France - but I have never been disappointed.

By the way - last time we were in London - we went to a place called Chez Nico on Park Lane. Not great but very good - the chef was rumored to be a lunatic but we saw no evidence of that the night we dined :). It seems to have closed - and the chef now seems to run a small chain called Simply Nico. Are any of those worth a lunch or dinner?

I suspect if I wore a short enough skirt and had enough champagne - I might feel like a Bond girl's mother :). Robyn

Simply Nico was sold off by Nico Ladenis some time ago, and became a deeply mediocre and overpriced chain of ugly restaurants in crappy locations. I think they've now all closed down, but I'm not sure.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tarka - Lunch and dinner at RHR. That is quite an endorsement! On the other hand - I was surprised that after all these years - London only has 2 Michelin 3 stars (and of course - this is one of them). I haven't been to that many Michelin 3 stars - and most of them were/are in France - but I have never been disappointed.

By the way - last time we were in London - we went to a place called Chez Nico on Park Lane. Not great but very good - the chef was rumored to be a lunatic but we saw no evidence of that the night we dined :). It seems to have closed - and the chef now seems to run a small chain called Simply Nico. Are any of those worth a lunch or dinner?

I suspect if I wore a short enough skirt and had enough champagne - I might feel like a Bond girl's mother :). Robyn

if only we did have two places with three stars...I think only RHR has this honour.

Suzi Edwards aka "Tarka"

"the only thing larger than her bum is her ego"

Blogito ergo sum

Link to comment
Share on other sites

New English how about the Rhodes 24 place? Cooking always at its best when its recently opened (and there are hordes of slavering restaurant critics to feed...)

Ethnic non Indian yes, Hakkasan

South Bank, Baltic perhaps (but only cuz I've always meant to go there but never got round to it!) - nouveau polish, lots of different vodka! Or RSJ.

J

More Cookbooks than Sense - my new Cookbook blog!
Link to comment
Share on other sites

if only we did have two places with three stars...I think only RHR has this honour.

Tarka - When you look up London on the Michelin web site - it also lists Waterside Inn in Bray-on-Thames - which I suspect is a suburb of London. Robyn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

.Simply Nico was sold off by Nico Ladenis some time ago, and became a deeply mediocre and overpriced chain of ugly restaurants in crappy locations. I think they've now all closed down, but I'm not sure. 

Clerkenwellian - Thanks for the heads up on this. It is hard to keep up with what's happening in a trendy city like London even if you live there. And - since I am 3000 miles away - and only visit every 5-10 years - it is really impossible. I have mixed feelings about "trendy" in general. I used to like old traditional French restaurants - where you went because the chef had perfected a half dozen dishes - and that's why you went to his restaurant - to savor a few of those dishes. I have never had the urge to try grouper cheeks or other concoctions because the chef has run out of good ideas using more expensive cuts of food (although I am a big fan of organ meat). On the third hand - if everyone in the UK had rested on his laurels since the first time I went there in the 1960's - I don't think I'd be on this web site now asking about restaurants :).

Do you know what happened to Nico Ladenis? We had a really nice meal at Chez Nico. And a very pleasant evening. My husband and I are both lawyers - and we were seated next to a couple who were both doctors from Kent celebrating an anniversary - we had a great time for over 3 hours talking and eating and drinking. That is why I worry about 2 seatings in a 2 or 3 star restaurant. If the place is really good - and you're having a good time - you don't want to be rushed out in less than 2 hours - and you don't want to show up for an 8:30 reservation and wind up getting seated at 9:30. Take care, Robyn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

New English how about the Rhodes 24 place? Cooking always at its best when its recently opened (and there are hordes of slavering restaurant critics to feed...)

Hi Jon - I took a look at the menu there. Perhaps I am dumb - but you guys in the UK have perhaps the best lamb in the world (I haven't been to New Zealand - but your lamb is fabulous compared to ours in the US). Makes sense - you have a country full of sheep - I must have 200 pictures my husband took of me over the years in the UK posed with sheep :). It was a real epiphany for me the first time I went to Gidleigh in Devonshire in the 1980's and had amazing baby lamb. It was the first time I'd ever eaten a boneless tenderloin of lamb - seemed like an outrageously extravagant cut of meat - which it is! My husband had always hated lamb - because his mother's idea of lamb was always an old leg of lamb (mutton). But he loved that lamb at Gidleigh. So why should I pay big money for mutton on the Rhodes 24 menu (which is basically what I get in my grocery store in Florida when I try to buy lamb)?

I read some some discussion about this restaurant on this forum - and I recall that one reader basically said - why should you spend almost 200 pounds for a somewhat disappointing meal. That is kind of the way I feel. I don't mind spending a whole lot of money for a terrific meal. I do mind spending a lot of money for a ho-hum meal (on the other hand - my standards are flexible - I don't expect or demand the same things from an inexpensive restaurant as I do from an expensive one). I am a somewhat decent cook (have to be - because I live in a city that doesn't have a lot of decent restaurants) - and I know it's easier to make a terrific dish when you start with terrific ingredients - like lamb instead of mutton.

So who is dishing out the best little baby lamb in London these days :)? Robyn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My husband had always hated lamb - because his mother's idea of lamb was always an old leg of lamb (mutton).  But he loved that lamb at Gidleigh.  So why should I pay big money for mutton on the Rhodes 24 menu (which is basically what I get in my grocery store in Florida when I try to buy lamb)?

Unless you have a very unusual butcher in Florida, it is probably not mutton that you are getting, but rather mature lamb. Even in the UK, mutton is hard to find -- and delicious when cooked appropriately. Mutton thread

Jonathan Day

"La cuisine, c'est quand les choses ont le go�t de ce qu'elles sont."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jonathan - I read the thread you referenced - and you are probably right that we are getting old lamb instead of mutton. Just like it is almost impossible here to get a proper cut of brisket these days. I.e., a whole brisket where every ounce of fat isn't trimmed off - it's almost impossible to cook a flat cut of brisket without any fat on it and have it turn into something other than shoe leather. And when you do get a proper cut of brisket - it requires a lot of braising (not the 7 hours you say is needed for mutton - but about 3 hours).

That said - I have had older lamb in the UK - and younger - and - as a matter of personal preference - I prefer the younger.

And - have you tried the restaurant which was mentioned - 24 Rhodes I think it is. And is their mutton as good as yours :)? I will try anything at least once if someone thinks it's delicious. Robyn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mutton vs. lamb different not better or worse

Mutton probably has scarcity value in this country as people hardly ever do it. cf oysters used to be dead cheap, food for the poor. Now they're quite posh. Can get lamb everywhere so can't get mutton so ergo I might try mutton. Also more flavour than lamb.

So yes, a bit wierd but it makes sense.

eg if I'm in a posh restaurant and get offered the fillet steak with a truffle sauce of the oxtail I'd probably go for the oxtail. Filet is sooooo nineties ;-)

cheerio

J

More Cookbooks than Sense - my new Cookbook blog!
Link to comment
Share on other sites

South Bank & New English cusine - Anchor and Hope on the Cut

Great new restaurant in a former pub. Chef worked at St John and the menu reflects this. I went about a month ago and the food was great and very reasonable. Mutton featured too I seem to recall.

Service was friendly and the style very relaxed. Only catch is that they don't take bookings so it might be best to arrive early.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And - have you tried the restaurant which was mentioned - 24 Rhodes I think it is. And is their mutton as good as yours :)? I will try anything at least once if someone thinks it's delicious. Robyn

the mutton suet pudding at rhodes 24 is a serious contender for my dish of the year award. moist, fluffy, squidgey, suetey crust stuffed with meltingly tender slow-cooked mutton (3 years old, rhodes couldn't find his desired 5 year old) and onions. it comes with three little jugs of sauce - an onion soubise, a caper sauce and really intense mutton gravy - so if you chemistry-set it about with these you can have a different tasting mouthful each time.

i want it again. NOW.

m

Link to comment
Share on other sites

if only we did have two places with three stars...I think only RHR has this honour.

Tarka - When you look up London on the Michelin web site - it also lists Waterside Inn in Bray-on-Thames - which I suspect is a suburb of London. Robyn

ah, sorry. ihave my zone one blinkers on :-)

Suzi Edwards aka "Tarka"

"the only thing larger than her bum is her ego"

Blogito ergo sum

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1. Really fancy; GR RHR

2. New English cuisine (don't know if that's the right phrasing - I mean what the best chefs are doing to reinterpret English food); St John just has to be the one.

6. Lunch near Chelsea flower show; GR RHR but do spend more time with your food and less with the flowers

8. Outrageously good interior design.- Not outrageous, but beautifully spacious and light, Orrery is very very good on a spring lunchtime and the food is a dream. Try Duck for two cooked three ways.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Indian - New Tayyab in Whitechapel (lots about this on the board) or one of the Tooting south Indian restaurants eg Kastoori.

South Bank - Baltic is a good choice. RSJ (French) is great for pre/post National theatre but nothing unusual. Anchor & Hope is good but the service can be a bit random.

English - yes, go to St John Bread & Wine (the new one near Spitalfields). A good place for Sunday lunch after poking round the market.

Interior design - Sketch is meant to be amazing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

if only we did have two places with three stars...I think only RHR has this honour.

Tarka - When you look up London on the Michelin web site - it also lists Waterside Inn in Bray-on-Thames - which I suspect is a suburb of London. Robyn

Its actually a small and very pretty village in Berkshire whose residents would probably string you up with very expensive rope if you described it as "a suburb of London".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mutton vs. lamb different not better or worse

Mutton probably has scarcity value in this country as people hardly ever do it.  cf oysters used to be dead cheap, food for the poor. Now they're quite posh. Can get lamb everywhere so can't get mutton so ergo I might try mutton.  Also more flavour than lamb.

So yes, a bit wierd but it makes sense.

eg if I'm in a posh restaurant and get offered the fillet steak with a truffle sauce of the oxtail I'd probably go for the oxtail.  Filet is sooooo nineties ;-)

cheerio

J

Jon - Agreed. Especially about the filet of beef - which has always lacked flavor in my opinion - and is usually mushy to boot. I think the difference between me (over here) and those of you (over there) is that not only does mutton have scarcity value - so does good lamb. It's just really hard to get here. I probably feel the same way you feel about lamb when I look at shrimp. There are simply so many of them - and they are so cheap in season - that I don't give them a second thought. If I lived in the mid-western United States - I'd probably think they were an exotic item.

Also - I suspect that chefs find what I call "Depression" cuts of meat more fun to cook with than more expensive cuts. They adapt more easily to lengthy cooking methods - like braising - which can infuse them with lots of (frequently very nice) flavors. When it's cold here - which isn't that often - I have fun braising things from time to time. Robyn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And - have you tried the restaurant which was mentioned - 24 Rhodes I think it is.  And is their mutton as good as yours :)?  I will try anything at least once if someone thinks it's delicious.  Robyn

the mutton suet pudding at rhodes 24 is a serious contender for my dish of the year award. moist, fluffy, squidgey, suetey crust stuffed with meltingly tender slow-cooked mutton (3 years old, rhodes couldn't find his desired 5 year old) and onions. it comes with three little jugs of sauce - an onion soubise, a caper sauce and really intense mutton gravy - so if you chemistry-set it about with these you can have a different tasting mouthful each time.

i want it again. NOW.

m

That recommendation puts it on my "must try" list. Robyn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Indian - New Tayyab in Whitechapel (lots about this on the board) or one of the Tooting south Indian restaurants eg Kastoori.

South Bank - Baltic is a good choice.  RSJ (French) is great for pre/post National theatre but nothing unusual.  Anchor & Hope is good but the service can be a bit random.

English - yes, go to St John Bread & Wine (the new one near Spitalfields).  A good place for Sunday lunch after poking round the market.

Interior design - Sketch is meant to be amazing.

Isn't Sketch the new restaurant that is supposed to make Alain Ducasse in New York look cheap :)? I have only read a little about it - didn't get a firm impression whether the food was worth the price. Do you or anyone else have any thoughts about it? I also seem to recall that there are dining alternatives (including a bar) in addition to the main dining room. Is my recollection correct? Robyn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...