Smoking a Turkey

[fifi]

What snowangel said.

All of that fiddling around before putting on the smoker isn't necessary. And what snowangel said about putting meat on cold is what I do. I think it makes a difference.

I am really puzzled about your smoker. The only one like the Weber bullet type that I have seen is the Brinkman. In fact, I bought a Brinkman charcoal pan because it fits where my Weber pan did but is deeper and gets me more water. (Come to think of it, my Weber does look like Dogbert. ) What the water does is provide a heat sink and helps to keep the temperature stable. A lot of folks think it is there for moisture for the meat but the thermodynamics don't work like that. Water has terrific heat capacity.

I have done many a whole turkey and they came out fine. However, the only way I was ever able to maximize juicy was to quarter it and monitor the temperature closely. I use a Redi Chek remote thermometer probe in the breast because it gets done first then I switch it to the thigh.

Oh yeah . . . that web site is here: The Virtual Weber Bullet

They have some great recipes and lots of tips and techniques even if you don't have a Weber.

[lcdm]

I did a test run this weekend.

I smoked on the Weber Bullet.

Brined turkey overnight (11.48 lbs.).

Rinsed well and patted dry.

Fired up bullet w/2 chimnies full of Kinsford Charcoal and 4 small peices of wood (2 cherry and 2 apple).

I placed a cutup orange and a sprig of rosemary in the cavity.

Instead of using the water pan I placed a foil pan on the bottom grate to catch the drippings.

I placed the tukey on the top grate. The bullet maintained a temp of about 350 (at the dome).

The turkey was finished in 2 hours.

I wrapped in heavy duty foil and let rest, breat side down for 2 hours in a warm cooler. The turkey was still hot and juicey when I went to carve it.

The turkey came out very good, nice smokey flavor and it was very moist.

[lancastermike]

I can only speak to the Weber bullet. I had already put my side firebox smoker in its foster home when I started getting all scientific. I can confirm that the temperature at the grates on the Weber varies by about 20 degrees F more or less. If I have 250 at the top vent, the grates are around 225 which is what I want. This is probably a result of the geometry of the Weber, with the heat circulating up around the sides. different geometry may make for very different results. The only thng I know to do is to use thermometers to get a good picture of what is going on in your set up.

I have also seen the higher temps for the turkey on the Virtual Bullet site and, while it might work, I found lower and slower more easy to control. Like I said back up-thread, cutting up the turkey helps the most.

I really don't know if I could get the Weber that hot anyway. I probably could without the water but I have never tried it. I am usually doing more than one kind of meat and I know what is going on at the 225 so I stick with it.

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Linda,

I have had my WSM up above 325. With no water in the pan and two full chimneys of charcoal it is no problem. I have done turkey both low and slow and at the higher temps that the Virtual Weber site touts. I have found no difference.

At the higher temps you must stay a little closer and watch your internal temp. The turkey does not need the long and slow heat that a butt or a brisket does. The higher temp method is the one I will be using on Thanksgiving

Into the brine with him on Tuesday night. An air dry in the fridge Wednesday night. Thanksgiving I will fire the Weber and on he goes.

Everyone who smokes knows that every time you fire it up there exisits the chance for a total unmitigated disaster. Perhaps this is part of the allure.

At one time I was a guy who lived life on the edge. Now I am just another old guy with memories. However, in a lame attempt to turn back time, my one and only Thanksgiving turkey goes on the WSM. If it is a dud, we will have lots of sides and deserts to eat. Good luck to all Thanksgiving day smokers

[lancastermike]

I've got mesquite for my wood chips, and I typically soak them for around 20 minutes before use to prolong the smoke.

I would urge you not to use mesquite for a turkey. A turkey does better with something milder like apple or cherry. Mesquite has an ugly taste to me. It can be ok on a steak or other beef but it is too strong for the turkey

As to temps i have learned that my dome temp is really 20 to 25 higher than the top grate. I used to use all sorts of thermometers like lots of the real smoke geek guys. Now I just use one at the dome.

If it is 250 at the dome, I know I have the 225 at the grate.

[Toliver]

Instead of using the water pan I placed a foil pan on the bottom grate to catch the drippings.

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The water pan (filled with water) is to help provide a stable temperature inside the cooker/smoker. That it catches the drippings is just a byproduct of its placement.

[fifi]

Lancastermike . . . Thanks for the info. I suspected that you would have to ditch the water pan to get the higher temperature. I agree that you don't need the slow approach with a bird. I do the same thing as you with the thermometers. I just go by the one in the vent. The temperature at the grate is predictable from that. I do use a remote Redi Chek in the meat though. I just think it is cool to sit back in the living room with a cold brew and watch the numbers. Guests find it entertaining as well. Who knew that you could have a bunch of supposed grown-ups gawking at a thermometer for hours.

We are doing a turkey as it turns out. My nephew is going to do it on his offset style. He does this thing with jalapenos and oranges in the cavity and wraps it in bacon. I have never had it but he has done it several times and likes it. We will see if the impermeability of turkey defeats the effort.

We will have a braised leg-o-bambi and a ham as back-up. I'm too old to live dangerously.

[snowangel]

But, half the fun of smoking is going at a low temp so it takes longer and you can drink more beer!

[fifi]

Hmmm . . . There is that.

I may have to rethink this.

[lcdm]

Instead of using the water pan I placed a foil pan on the bottom grate to catch the drippings.

←

The water pan (filled with water) is to help provide a stable temperature inside the cooker/smoker. That it catches the drippings is just a byproduct of its placement.

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True in low temp smoking the water pan, helps regulate the temp, but since I wanted a high temp I was going to foil the pan and leave it empty. Instead of that (why foil the pan). I used a disposable foil pan to catch the turkey drippings.

[lancastermike]

Forecast for tommorow is snow with high of 35 degrees. However, I am undaunted. Smoke I will. My darling wife, once again, thinks I am nuts. Perhaps so. But after all, snow and high of 35 is probably the typical Labor Day forecast for Susan, and she smokes all the time

I may try some pics if my camera and the balky ImageGullet allow

[snowangel]

Forecast for tommorow is snow with high of 35 degrees.  However, I am undaunted.  Smoke I will.  My darling wife, once again, thinks I am nuts. Perhaps so.    But after all,  snow and high of 35 is probably the typical Labor Day forecast for Susan, and she smokes all the time

I may try some pics if my camera and the balky ImageGullet allow

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Let me tell you. I've smoked sub-zero. I've had to shovel show off the deck and once had to remove about a 1/2 food of snow from the Weber. But, damn it, I smoked, and it was wonderful.

It is actually easier to control temp when it is really cold and snowy!

You are not crazy. Absolutely not. What else are you going to do on a snowy, cool day?

[fifi]

We will be smoking the bird in 80 F and sunny weather. The humidity is uncommonly low, about 30%, so it is really comfy. This is what we call fall weather.

I really haven't had any problems with temperature control in extremes of weather so I say go for it. But then, we don't have the same extremes. Those remote thermometers come in real handy for us in the summer. After Rita, we were at the country place and the nephew and I were smoking chickens. It was 109 F. Not in the smoker. Outside. In the shade. Since his smoker was running a bit hot, we wanted to keep an eye on the chickens and doing that in the air conditioning was a plus.

[lcdm]

I smoked a turkey yesterday for Thanksgiving. We had 2 oven roasted and 1 smoked, so if there was some kind of disaster was had back up. This time I did not brine, I took the turkey out of the package washed dried and rubbed with an orange and filled the cavity with rosemary, sage and an orange. It came out great, it was the first time many had a smoked turkey and it was a hit. Even though it was cold and windy the temp stayed between 350 and 325. The 11 lb turkey was done in 2.5 hrs.

[Timmaay]

Hey there folks,

I appreciate the suggestions. Sorry for the long delay in my reply but my wife had to go to the hospital for emergency back surgery. Bad times.

Anyway...I wish I could tell you what brand my smoker is. I will try to get a picture of it sometime soon (I have no idea how to upload it to imagegullet, but I can at least get a picture onto Yahoo photos or something).

All I can say is that it's about the same size as the WB, but looks more like an egg-shaped rocket ship.

At any rate, I have requested some samples of other woods to try smoking with (like apple, sugar-maple and .... I think Cherry). There's a thread on Virtual Weber talking about those, and it seems that the owner of BBQer's Delight Smoking Wood Pellets was offering 3 free samples to anybody who wrote to her referencing that topic. I haven't gotten any response yet, so we'll see if it happens.

At any rate, I will try to do the full cook in the smoker, and will pop the turkey direct from the fridge into the smoker (after 24 brine and dry). I didn't get to do the turkey for Thanksgiving because of the situation with my wife, but the turkey is all thawed now and ready to go for this week.

Maybe I'll just buy some wood chunks to try if nothing shows up. Anybody got recommendations for good places to find flavored wood? Would Walmart or something have them probably? The BBQ's Galore here seems to suck lately.

How much was that remote temperature probe thingy? I want one, but... I can't be too frivolous with the price.

Thanks.

[fifi]

Here is one source for the Redi Chek. It is only about $40. (For some dumb reason, Amazon doesn't have it now.) This is the one that most of my friends and I have.

It may be a regional thing here but there are wood chunks even in most big grocery stores. Also, Home Depot and our big all around sporting goods and outdoor big box store, Acacemy, carries a pretty good selection. However, for "exotic" woods (for here anyway) like apple, I go to a neigborhood fireplace/BBQ/Outdoor kitchen specialty shop, Chim-Chimineys. Look in your Yellow pages and see what you can come up with.

[Timmaay]

ok, so my brined turkey is drying out in the fridge now for a few hours.

I will start cooking in another couple hours from now.

Questions:

1) People keep saying that they heat up 2 chimney's full of coals. Are those used all at one time, or is the 2nd chimney's worth added over time?

I'm guessing this process will take 2.5-3 hours, considering it's about a 12 pound bird. I may buy a chimney today, but I don't think I can quite justify buying 2 at once (at least not today).

So, I'm thinking I'll just add some cold brickets on top of the lit ones, to try and maintain a longer, evenish burn. But, I've only done this kind of thing once before, and I had a hard time maintaining temp after about 30 minutes.

Not sure what the best thing to do here is.

2) I've decided to go ahead and try some cherry chunks (instead of mesquite chips). The only other mention of chunks here recently said about 4 good chunks. Are those all thrown on at once? How long to they last (assuming 350F avg temp at the dome)?

Most recommendations I've seen say soak the chunks for 30 min to an hour.

I'm not really using them for heat. I'm just using them for smoke. Any problem with soaking?

3) Last time, I cooked the bird IN a disposable roast tray. I seem to be getting the impression that most people just put it right on the grate, and let a pan below catch the drips. Is that right? If so, doesn't the bottom get burned?

Thanks.

[VivreManger]

This is going to be very low tech advice. Unfortunately it is also not easily duplicated since I rarely time or measure anything I cook, but my experience over a number of years of smoking fowl has been unerringly good. I have smoked chicken, duck, commercial, and wild turkey in a simple Weber kettle grill, nothing fancier than hardwood charcoal (never Kingswood briqettes) and hickory chunks (usually soaked for up to an hour in water or sometimes red wine). I put nothing on my birds except a bit of kosher salt. Don't bother with brining. However when I use a kosher bird, effectively it has been brined.

In the lower grate I put an aluminum roasting pan to catch the grease and keep the coals away from the birds so the heat is always reflected, never direct. With hickory wood I get a bacon-like smokey flavor that overwhelms everything but salt so I never add any other spices to the birds.

Normally the birds take between one and two and a half hours to cook. A three to four pound chicken at the low end. A twelve pound turkey at the high end. But I should underscore that my times are merely approximate. Furthermore I like my fowl pinkish at the core. The standard cooking times were written by lawyers who want to prevent Butterball from being sued by salmonella sufferers.

My last major smoke-out in September yielded a duck, a chicken, and a turkey in one afternoon's work. We finished all but half of the turkey within a day or two. The remaining half was frozen until Thanksgiving when it was warmed up and served for a small gathering of four. It was as moist and flavorful as when it first came off the grill. Smoked food improves with age, even when it has been frozen for two months.

My guess is that the kettle temperature is quite high certainly in the four hundred degree range at the start. The result is a crispy skinned bird with the telltale pink smoke line. I let the heat cool off a bit towards the end so it may be as low as 275 to 300 after a few hours. I periodically check and add chunks of hardwood charcoal and hickory wood when I feel it is getting low.

I also turn my birds over. I begin with the breast down so the fatty thighs and backbone will naturally baste the bird as it cooks. I then turn it over breast up to achieve the golden brown crispy skin that smoking can yield, that is for about the last half hour or so of cooking. With ducks I periodically - - perhaps every 20 to 30 minutes -- lift them up and let the fat accumulating in the carcass pour out into the roasting pan below. To do this I use a strong industrial strength aluminum $25 dollar cooking fork that allows me to pick up anything up to twelve or fifteen pounds. When cooking something heavier I have to use a fork and spatula combination to turn the birds over.

This primitive method works best with high fat commercial birds. The standard supermarket duck cooks more easily than the Whole Wallet elegant Muscovy mallard with its lower fat content. I smoked a wild turkey, but its lower fat content coupled with the high heat did result in a tougher bird, particularly the drumsticks and wings, but even the tough meat was tasty.

Edited November 30, 2005 by VivreManger (log)

[Timmaay]

Well, I smoked that turkey, and it came out amazing.

I placed the bird directly on the top rack, and put my coals on the sides of the lower rack, with a sahped-foil catch tray (since I don't have any pie tins handy at the moment).

I had a real problem with controlling the temperature though. I started off with a Weber Chimney full of kingsford briquets. I only have one chimney, so this was my limit of starter material.

I divided these up roughly evenly on each side of my bottom rack, and then threw some unlit briquets on top to try and extend the cook-time before I had to add more hot coals.

Then I started up a second chimney for backup.

I added my turkey directly from the fridge, and then added about 4 chunks of moistened cherry wood.

I wanted to try and maintain around 350 at the dome.

Over time, I added more coal and wood as necessary. The total cook-time was about 2 hours, finally ending when I "decided" it was done. The temperatur stayed mostly in the 300-400 range, although at one point, I guess I added too many new hot briquets because the temp spike up to over 600 (it pegged the needle), prompting a quick reduction of coals. I had only added about 10 briquets... and I didn't expect that to happen. D'oh!

Sadly, it seems my $7 meat thermometer was not designed to handle that hellish heat (hence the decision, and not the knowledge of when to end the cook).

At any rate... the turkey came out great despite all that. Very juicy, with an amazing flavor. The color didn't come out as nicely pink as I've seen in the "commercials" on other forums, but... it still tasted good. I think I need to dry out the skin for a little longer next time. It was better than my first one, but I still need work. For reference, I had brined the turkey for about 12 hours, then dried it for another 12. I put the bird into the smoker cut, but not quite quartered. I just sliced open the joints between the legs and the breast to even out the cook-times as I've seen referenced in other places. (I don't remember where, either here or Virtual Weber)

I was kinda surprised by how much maintenance this thing took (to keep the temp right, and the smoke strong). I had to check it about every 15-20 minutes to make sure it was doing alright (adding coals or wood as necessary).

I think I burned through about half my 8 pound bag of wood in this two hour cook. I think there's gotta be a more efficient way to control the temp over time. I think I need to hear more from the masters on this.

I have a camera coming to me soon. So, soon I can actually show you guys what the heck I'm talking about with my Dogbert smoker.

[snowangel]

Tim, I preface what this by letting you know that I use a Weber Kettle, so I'm not sure how much of what I say will apply.

But, when I start out, I start with a 1/2 chimney, and never have to add more lit coals. I put in some unstarted charcoal, add the lit stuff, and a few more unlit briquettes to the top. Then the soaked wood. My kettle is pretty old, so nothing fits as tight as it would were it new, so I've found that it can be helpful to control the temp by shutting down the vents. I find it easier to goose up the heat than reduce it. Experience has taught me how to keep the temp on my kettle down to 225 or so (I use a regular oven thermometer on the rack beside the meat; works well for me).

Part of it is just a lot of smoking so you can figure it out. My first experiences were not nearly as sucessful as they are now. Keeping the temp in line is automatic right now.

And, after a certain point, adding more wood chunks is unnecessary, I feel. There is that debate about whether the meat quits absorbing the smoke at about 140, so I quit adding wood about 1/2 way through. (Cheap source of wood can be an apple orchard.)

Your turkey sounds wonderful, and has given me a hankering to smoke one. I was most disappointed when my SIL served smoked turkey. She had paid someone $25.00 to smoke a turkey (which she provided). It was dry and not very smokey. I told her next year, I'll do the smoking!

[Timmaay]

ok, so... half a chimney for you, and no lit coals. I like the idea of not adding smoke after a while. I think that makes sense. It's such a heavy usage of wood to keep adding so much.

It'll make it last a lot longer if I can minimize that.

By the way, I FINALLY got some pictures of Dogbert the Smoker.

I've got all the pictures in my album, but... I have no idea how to use Image Gullet to post pics here. So, I'm gonna try to guess. Thumbnails should pop to a bigger pic.

Edit: Looks like I got it right.

Dogbert Smoker Top Grill Bottom rack

Bottom vent / ash collecter All opened up (Weber chimney added for perspective)

Edited December 4, 2005 by Timmaay (log)

[Timmaay]

Sorry for the double-post, but... I wanted to show activity in the forum so people would read this...

THANKS everyone for your ideas!

My last turkey came out very yummy indeed. Even though it was on for longer than I thought was necessary (I wanted to be sure), and even though I had a temperature spike in the middle of over 600 degrees for a couple minutes that melted my thermometer into goo (which didn't get onto the turkey fortunately), and even though the skin in parts turned black and looked ugly, and I was afraid the whole thing was a heinous 2.5 hour mess....

The turkey still came out awesome. I will definitely be doing this again. I am in love with smoked foods, and I can't wait to branch out.

I think I will try a brisquet next, since that seems to be the other smoker's starter food.

Recommendations for a good brisquet rub?

[snowangel]

  I am in love with smoked foods, and I can't wait to branch out.

I think I will try a brisquet next, since that seems to be the other smoker's starter food.

Recommendations for a good brisquet rub?

I, too, am in love with smoked meat!

In addition to thinking about brisket, think about smoking some Butt. Whole, skin on pork shoulders. This also makes for great leftovers.

And, there is a whole topic devoted to Smokin' Brisket.

Both of these topics are great resources for smoking any kind of meat -- not just the ones mentioned in the titles.

Pork shoulders are usually a lot cheaper, and much more readily available than an entire brisket (flats are common, but the nice thick fatty part -- the part you really want -- seem harder to come by).

And, for a rub, my favorite is Klinik's Dry Rub!

Look forward to hearing about your brisket or butt adventures.

[woodburner]

Anybody up for cold smoking a cured boneless Turkey Breast? I've had a few from Harry and David (mail order source) that were cured, and smoked. Both had a wonderful hint of smoke flavor with a slightly salty taste, just short of a smoke ham flavor.

I would like to do something similar.

woodburner

[snowangel]

I'm not set up to cold smoke, but Marlene and I are planning to smoke turkey on Easter Sunday.

[snowangel]

Easter is a week from Sunday, and I should probably start planning. We will be having 20 for Easter dinner, only one of whom is a little kid (there will be four teenagers in the bunch). How big a turkey should I get? I'm smoking on the Kettle, so I don't have two racks. One big ass turkey and fill in the gaps with some turkey thighs? Or, is that over kill?

Ideas for sides welcome, too.