What's wrong with eating raw flour?

[heidih]

Host's note: this discussion began in the Food Funnies topic.

 

 

On bag of Gold Medal all purpose flour today - seriously!?!

 

Edited April 22, 2023 by Smithy
Added host's note (log)

[TdeV]

What happens if one eats raw flour?

[heidih]

14 hours ago, TdeV said:

What happens if one eats raw flour?

Related to the E coli fear about raw cookie dough. Could be infected.

Edited April 22, 2023 by heidih (log)

[JoNorvelleWalker]

Having recently been in the hospital for an E. coli infection, I'd err on the side of caution.

 

[blue_dolphin]

15 hours ago, TdeV said:

What happens if one eats raw flour?

From the CDC: Say No to Raw Dough

 

And this from last month:  Salmonella Outbreak Linked to Flour

 

 

Edited April 22, 2023 by blue_dolphin
to add link (log)

[heidih]

9 hours ago, JoNorvelleWalker said:

Having recently been in the hospital for an E. coli infection, I'd err on the side of caution.

 

I respect the harm that E.coli can inflict- the wording was so odd to me for a major company - like packaging at the Japanese 98cent store or the slip inside a fortune cookie.Plus not even an attempt to add "due to XXX danger" Perhaps I am easily amused.

[blue_dolphin]

18 minutes ago, heidih said:

I respect the harm that E.coli can inflict- the wording was so odd to me for a major company - like packaging at the Japanese 98cent store or the slip inside a fortune cookie.Plus not even an attempt to add "due to XXX danger" Perhaps I am easily amused.

 

I agree that wording is rather whimsical.  I figure they need to cover their legal ass but don't want to freak people out.  

I've been seeing the labeling for a couple of years but it doesn't seem to be standardized in any way.  

 

This one on a bag of flour from Cairnspring Mills:

 

And Trader Joe's:

 

Pillsbury cake flour:

 

 

 

Edited April 22, 2023 by blue_dolphin
to add photo (log)

[Arey]

I suppose it's better than  putting "Don't eat or play with raw flour,dough,or batter. It'll give you worms."  on the label'

[KennethT]

17 hours ago, heidih said:

Related to the E coli fear about raw cookie dough. Could be infected.

huh. I always thought that we were told not to eat raw cookie dough because of the raw eggs in there.  I would never have imagined that the flour would be the danger!

[Duvel]

Seems German flour is different 😜

[blue_dolphin]

19 minutes ago, Duvel said:

Seems German flour is different 😜

 

Or Germans are sensible enough that they don't need printed warnings to deter them from chowing down on a bowl of flour!

[IndyRob]

I don't think this has anything to do with the warning, but there was an interesting factoid on (I think) the Netflix Series Cooked...

 

If you have only flour and water and eat the flour and drink the water, you will be dead in about two weeks.  However, if you mix the flour and water, allow them to ferment, and bake it into bread, you can live on it indefinitely.

 

I'm not sure if that's true, but I believe that was what was claimed.

 

Edit: I took this as a nutritional claim, not a food safety claim.

Edited April 22, 2023 by IndyRob (log)

[BeeZee]

I’ve read that you can pre-cook flour if you want to kill the bacteria, microwave or spread on a baking pan and cook in oven for a few minutes. I am not a food scientist or medical professional😉

[Honkman]

6 hours ago, Duvel said:

Seems German flour is different 

The German laws regarding suing companies are very different

[MetsFan5]

My gut reaction was “because it tastes like shit”. 
 

 But I learned a lot reading the responses! 

[Annie_H]

The first flour re-call I can remember was about ten years ago. Raw cookie dough tubes have been around forever in groceries near the butter, eggs, biscuits, etc. I did not realize it was a 'thing' to eat raw dough until a NYTimes article about a shop opening called 'dō' 5-6 years ago. Lines down the block and not just teens. Grown men in that line. Scooped into containers like ice cream.

The problem with flour is it is a raw product. From the fields to processing to your pantry, no kill-stop exists. Pasteurized eggs and heat treating the raw flour will make it safe for raw cookie dough.

...“Salmonella is found in animal intestines,” Detwiler says. “Food becomes contaminated when it comes into contact with feces—directly in the fields or even through contaminated irrigation water.” Meaning, animal poop ends up in fields where grain that becomes flour is grown or can get into the water that helps the plants flourish. ...

flour and salmonella   (short article)

 

 

[Annie_H]

I've been getting FDA recall e-mails since available. Not obsessed. Most are medications and un-declared allergens. But some surprised me like spices especially peppercorns. Many cultures that use spices are cooked in stews and sauces. Not sprinkled on top of food.  

Sesame seed is another and many times. I always toast sesame seeds. Commercial humus and tahini re-called many times. 

[Katie Meadow]

No one ever said eating scoops of raw cookie dough was good for you. 

[heidih]

From what I;ve read th "raw cookiedough" peoducts use pasteurized eggs and the flour is treated.

[Annie_H]

50 minutes ago, heidih said:

From what I;ve read th "raw cookiedough" peoducts use pasteurized eggs and the flour is treated.

Yes, you are correct. From their website...dated June, 2022.  (I thought they corrected the problem years ago.)

"Pillsbury Ready to Bake Cookie Dough products are now safe to eat raw. It's the same cookie dough you've always loved, but now we have refined our process and ingredients so it's safe to eat the dough before baking. The dough will still bake up the same as our classic cookie dough. So now you can enjoy our edible cookie dough products before and after baking!"

Edited April 23, 2023 by Annie_H (log)

[Annie_H]

The recent outbreak due to flour was announced just a few weeks ago. I'm guessing many make cookie dough at home and unaware of the potential danger. Or just licking the spoon can make you sick...if you have the contaminated batch of flour. 

[Jon S]

On 4/22/2023 at 2:10 PM, KennethT said:

huh. I always thought that we were told not to eat raw cookie dough because of the raw eggs in there.  I would never have imagined that the flour would be the danger!

The interesting thing is that the eggs are "safe(r)" to eat raw because they are pasteurized, while the flour isn't given any treatment against those hard hitting germs. 

[heidih]

3 minutes ago, Jon S said:

The interesting thing is that the eggs are "safe(r)" to eat raw because they are pasteurized, while the flour isn't given any treatment against those hard hitting germs. 

This was a warning label from a major US flour company. Eggs vary globally. Whole in shell eggs are not pasteurized in US; only egg products that may be  used lightly or uncooked or if specifically labeled as pasteurized.

[Jon S]

I should have been more clear. In the US, some suppliers will pasteurize in shell eggs, it is just not required by law. The processes can be with water bath heat, hot moist air, or even radiation.