Charcuterie question: fermenting with live yogurt/other cultures

[Joe Wood]

Has any of our members fermented salami or sopprasata using yogurt to ferment the meat or other live cultures successfully? I was reading on a foreign blog site about it...

[Joe Wood]

On 11/3/2020 at 4:46 PM, Joe Wood said:

Has any of our members fermented salami or sopprasata using yogurt to ferment the meat or other live cultures successfully? I was reading on a foreign blog site about it...

I am pleased to report to the community that I did in fact make a batch of hard salami using only a few ounces of plain yogurt to ferment the meat... The fermentation worked beautifully... I'm told the finished product will be indistinguishable from batches using commercial starters... I've been in touch with folks from many parts of the globe Europe, Australia, India, Africa and all say they use yogurt as a starter... Just be sure to get yugurt which reads: "CONTAINS ACTIVE CULTURES"...

[AAQuesada]

glad you had success with it.  did you end up using quinoa as well?

[Joe Wood]

No I did not... Actually I just bought 80/20 ground beef from restaurant depot and used 5 lbs. of that because the fat content was correct at 20%... 

I'm just delighted about the fermentation using live yogurt though... 

The recipe I used is different too...

5 lbs. 80/20 ground beef

3.heads finely chopped fresh garlic

the zest of one whole orange chopped finely

3 % kosher salt by weight {3% of 5 lbs.}

* 12 oz. of blue cheese pieces FROZEN before adding to the meat and other ingredients

 

*I was afraid the blue cheese would mush when added to the meat... It did not... Frozen is the way to go... CRUMBLED FIRST... Then frozen...

**I also am able to transfer the mold600 from batch to batch quite easily... Paying about $29.00 for one ounce makes me conservative & creative... If anyone's interested just ask me...

[Duvel]

May I ask: you are not using any nitrate source ? And where does the yoghurt comes into play ? And finally: what is the purpose of the frozen blue cheese (and which one do you use) ?

 

[Joe Wood]

20 hours ago, Duvel said:

May I ask: you are not using any nitrate source ? And where does the yoghurt comes into play ? And finally: what is the purpose of the frozen blue cheese (and which one do you use) ?

 

I should have  mentioned it before... I did use the pink salt ... I also added red wine {8 liquid oz.} and 13 grams of sugar... The blue cheese crumbles can be found in any food store {at least here in the USA}

[Duvel]

2 hours ago, Joe Wood said:

The blue cheese crumbles can be found in any food store {at least here in the USA}

Thanks - but what is the function of the cheese ? Flavor ? I assume that would not be a cheese with live cultures ?

[Joe Wood]

1 hour ago, Duvel said:

Thanks - but what is the function of the cheese ? Flavor ? I assume that would not be a cheese with live cultures ?

I just copied someone else's recipe containing the cheese... the function of the cheese is to add to the flavors of the finished product... the author said it was delicious I cannot comment on that because mine is still aging... I would also imagine that the blue cheese should have some live cultures possibly adding to the fermentation (?)... the orange peel zest is also there for flavors...

[Duvel]

1 hour ago, Joe Wood said:

I would also imagine that the blue cheese should have some live cultures possibly adding to the fermentation (?)

That was my initial thought, but if that’s an industrialised product found in every supermarket it is hard to imagine that it has not been pasteurised.

 

Good luck with your sausages - I am looking forward to your report how they turned out and how the flavour profile was. You certainly have a lot going on (orange zest, red wine, blue cheese ...). Best of luck !

[Joe Wood]

16 hours ago, Duvel said:

That was my initial thought, but if that’s an industrialised product found in every supermarket it is hard to imagine that it has not been pasteurised.

 

Good luck with your sausages - I am looking forward to your report how they turned out and how the flavour profile was. You certainly have a lot going on (orange zest, red wine, blue cheese ...). Best of luck !

Thanks for your interest in this venture... I'll be sure to keep posting...

On 12/2/2020 at 2:28 PM, Duvel said:

May I ask: you are not using any nitrate source ? And where does the yoghurt comes into play ? And finally: what is the purpose of the frozen blue cheese (and which one do you use) ?

 

Sorry... I forgot to mention using the pink salt in the recipe... I DID USE IT...  5 grams... I also added liquid 8oz. of red  wine, 13 grams of table sugar... The purpose of the blue cheese and orange zest was simply to try a different recipe... I read it on another site and the gentleman said it was fantastic... We'll see how this turns out... As for the brand of blue I just bought a small container marked "BLUE CHEESE CRUMBLES

[Joe Wood]

On 11/3/2020 at 11:38 PM, liuzhou said:

  Foreign relative to where?

I've been away for quite  a while.  The fermenting w/ yogurt trick came from somewhere in Greece... I've used it in my last two batches of Soprasatta with great success... I will pass on what I learned BEFORE trying it... 

1. Use plain regular {not non-fat} yogurt

2. Make sure the carton reads "CONTAINS LIVE CULTURES"

3. Use 4 oz. of yogurt by volume to5 lb. of meat...

I plan to do this from now on... I cannot detect any difference in the end result... flavor and texture are the same as using a starter culture... 

[Joe Wood]

On 12/4/2020 at 8:42 AM, Joe Wood said:

Thanks for your interest in this venture... I'll be sure to keep posting...

Sorry... I forgot to mention using the pink salt in the recipe... I DID USE IT...  5 grams... I also added liquid 8oz. of red  wine, 13 grams of table sugar... The purpose of the blue cheese and orange zest was simply to try a different recipe... I read it on another site and the gentleman said it was fantastic... We'll see how this turns out... As for the brand of blue I just bought a small container marked "BLUE CHEESE CRUMBLES

Well I have to admit the blue cheese-orange zest recipe was a disappointment for me... While the salami came out nicely aged and tasty there was no flavor of the blue cheese at all . It seemed to have disappeared into the meat... The orange zest {I used the zest of an entire orange peel }.was slightly detectable  but not worth doing again... Just had to try it though...

[Joe Wood]

On 12/3/2020 at 2:25 PM, Joe Wood said:

I just copied someone else's recipe containing the cheese... the function of the cheese is to add to the flavors of the finished product... the author said it was delicious I cannot comment on that because mine is still aging... I would also imagine that the blue cheese should have some live cultures possibly adding to the fermentation (?)... the orange peel zest is also there for flavors...

I won't do this one again... 

[Joe Wood]

On 12/3/2020 at 4:16 PM, Duvel said:

That was my initial thought, but if that’s an industrialised product found in every supermarket it is hard to imagine that it has not been pasteurised.

 

Good luck with your sausages - I am looking forward to your report how they turned out and how the flavour profile was. You certainly have a lot going on (orange zest, red wine, blue cheese ...). Best of luck !

 

1 minute ago, Joe Wood said:

I won't do this one again... 

Well I have to admit the blue cheese-orange zest recipe was a disappointment for me... While the salami came out nicely aged and tasty there was no flavor of the blue cheese at all . It seemed to have disappeared into the meat... The orange zest {I used the zest of an entire orange peel }.was slightly detectable  but not worth doing again... Just had to try it though...

[Joe Wood]

On 12/3/2020 at 4:16 PM, Duvel said:

That was my initial thought, but if that’s an industrialised product found in every supermarket it is hard to imagine that it has not been pasteurised.

 

Good luck with your sausages - I am looking forward to your report how they turned out and how the flavour profile was. You certainly have a lot going on (orange zest, red wine, blue cheese ...). Best of luck !

Well I have to admit the blue cheese-orange zest recipe was a disappointment for me... While the salami came out nicely aged and tasty there was no flavor of the blue cheese at all . It seemed to have disappeared into the meat... The orange zest {I used the zest of an entire orange peel }.was slightly detectable  but not worth doing again... Just had to try it though...

[Joe Wood]

On 12/1/2020 at 8:26 PM, AAQuesada said:

glad you had success with it.  did you end up using quinoa as well?

No on the quinoa... A friend is doing that one and we'll get his esults when he's done...

[Joe Wood]

My friend chickened out on the quinoa... So I have no information... As for me, however, the big "Q" is in my rear view mirror...

 

I've made several batches of soprassata {never get the spelling right} using yogurt for a starter... I have no science about portions though... For a five lb. batch of meat I use about half of a 4 oz. cup... It's worked out perfectly every time... After filling the casings I put  them in the oven WITH OVEN LIGHT ON as a heat source... The oven light gets the temp. to about  90 degrees F.

After 48 hrs. I move  them to the wine cooler at 60 degrees F.

Another tip I use to save $$$ : Save the peeled collagen casings from cured salamis... Freeze them in zippy bags. When you make the next batch rub one of the old casings with the white powder on the new batch and watch that good ole penicillium nalgovence {sp} start to grow again

... You'll never have to buy it again !