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FrogPrincesse

What Are You Cooking Sous Vide Today? (Part 3)

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5 hours ago, paulraphael said:

 

Sure, but does anyone remember the whole conversation? I'm not about to spend $20 for the whole season on Netflix!

 

I remember the silverskin issue. He was busting a contestant's chops for removing it. Contestant rightly pushed back with something on the order of "you want to eat that?"

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3 hours ago, Anna N said:

 No guarantee they still exist in my Costco! And getting a ride to Costco is almost as challenging as getting beef short ribs.xDxD

 

Me with a car and you with access to a Costco with beef short ribs.  Too bad I'm not closer.

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I just threw some pork chops in.  135F.  I might have put them in too early, but the last ones that I did weren't tender enough so I'm trying longer to see if we like them better.

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16 hours ago, gfweb said:

 

I remember the silverskin issue. He was busting a contestant's chops for removing it. Contestant rightly pushed back with something on the order of "you want to eat that?"

 

I mean on the sous-vide issue. If there was any context or if he was just dismissing it outright.

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This weekend, various seasoning chicken thighs 65cx4 hours, and beef chuck steaks seam trimmed out of chuck roasts, 54.8cx30hours. They will all wait paitiently in the back of the fridge for me to eat them in the next three weeks. 

 

A pound of the chicken has made it into some buffalo chicken salad with franks hot sauce, mayo, celery, garlic powder  and blue cheese crumbles 


Edited by Dave W (log)
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make sure your refirg is cold.  

 

for 3 weeks id consider a temp check.

 

the vey back of the lowest shelf in my refrig is almost 32 F


Edited by rotuts (log)
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4 hours ago, paulraphael said:

 

I mean on the sous-vide issue. If there was any context or if he was just dismissing it outright.

I believe he said that a tender cut of meat like a pork tenderloin doesn't need to be sous vide and that method results in loss of too much moisture from the meat.  Something about it cooking very quickly in a pan.

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2 hours ago, Okanagancook said:

I believe he said that a tender cut of meat like a pork tenderloin doesn't need to be sous vide and that method results in loss of too much moisture from the meat.  Something about it cooking very quickly in a pan.

This is testable

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not to rush in here:

 

PT is over priced and very lean  with at best a mild flavor.

 

SV  if that's they way to go , and indeed removing fat and silverskin , a thin but still a tendon

 

is with your knife skills and time.  45 second ?

 

I can not pull a second cork in that amount of time s im gluggin the contents of the first.

 

just sayinmg

 

Cut the Cord  and Dump Cable

 

your Cell ?

 

we ill discuss that later

 

iPhone your say  Fine

 

F.D.:  I have 10 shares of aapl

 

buy a few more.

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7 hours ago, rotuts said:

make sure your refirg is cold.  

 

for 3 weeks id consider a temp check.

 

the vey back of the lowest shelf in my refrig is almost 32 F

 

 

Some beef in this location in my fridge registered 2/2.5C in core/surface so max 36.5F. 

 

I think Baldwin wrote that under 3C, outgrowth of C botulinum spores was over a month but he has wisely monetized that information and it's not readily available online. 

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5 hours ago, Okanagancook said:

I believe he said that a tender cut of meat like a pork tenderloin doesn't need to be sous vide and that method results in loss of too much moisture from the meat.  Something about it cooking very quickly in a pan.

 

FWIW, I cooked a tenderloin SV t'other day; marinated a couple of hours in char siu sauce, SV in sauce for 3 hours at 135 F, cooled, then steam-baked at 400F for 10-15 minutes to crisp it up on the exterior. Drier'n a bone.

 

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1 hour ago, Dave W said:

 

Some beef in this location in my fridge registered 2/2.5C in core/surface so max 36.5F. 

 

I think Baldwin wrote that under 3C, outgrowth of C botulinum spores was over a month but he has wisely monetized that information and it's not readily available online. 

 I believe that information is still freely available online.Here .

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22 hours ago, Dave W said:

This weekend, various seasoning chicken thighs 65cx4 hours, and beef chuck steaks seam trimmed out of chuck roasts, 54.8cx30hours. They will all wait paitiently in the back of the fridge for me to eat them in the next three weeks. 

 

A pound of the chicken has made it into some buffalo chicken salad with franks hot sauce, mayo, celery, garlic powder  and blue cheese crumbles 

 

 

About the chuck roasts, that profile is, to me, quite risky. Let me quote/repeat what I said to the ChefSteps team (they never bothered to answer) for a profile at 54ºC (this has also been discussed here in the past):

 

I am concerned about the suggestion to go as low as 54ºC for such a long time. The rule that Douglas Baldwin established himself, and now he works with ChefSteps, was that the safety minimum threshold for long cooking times was 54.4ºC. Furthermore, when we push the limits like this a small error in our equipment calibration can be critical, so this is, to me, just pushing the boundaries of safety. See for example the several comments saying that they had bad odors after that profile. I understand that you are using several hurdles here (nitrites and likely pre-searing, but these are not mentioned explicitly in the entry as critical requirements).
 
I understand the logic of the 54ºC, I guess. Whereas the 54.4ºC threshold was established as the lowest value where C. perfringens had been shown to die, it should not grow from 52ºC upwards. But still I think this is pushing the limits. Specially taking into account the review by the ComBase team. They are serious microbiologist that developed one of the most well-known models of bacteria growth and destruction, and whereas they themselves start modelling death of C. perfringens from 54.5ºC, they indicate too that this was not intended for very long cooking times, and tell us that, in their opinion and review of the experimental data backing that, there is not enough evidence of the bacteria population kinetics in the area of the growth/no-growth (to which 54ºC would belong) for long cooking times.

 

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14 hours ago, Dave W said:

 

Some beef in this location in my fridge registered 2/2.5C in core/surface so max 36.5F. 

 

I think Baldwin wrote that under 3C, outgrowth of C botulinum spores was over a month but he has wisely monetized that information and it's not readily available online. 

 

There are 3 conditions for a safe storage time like that (and normally I've seen 21 days, not over a month): 1) Full pasteurization (equivalent to 6,5D reduction in Salmonella) - and see my concern about pasteurization for your profile in my previous message; 2) Rapid cooling, to <3ºC in less than 2 hours - don't know whether you do this; and 3) guaranteed storage at <3ºC - though you say you fulfill this, a home refrigerator may have its door open frequently and it is typical that it gets temperatures higher than 3ºC even it its coldest areas.

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On ‎10‎/‎02‎/‎2017 at 6:02 PM, FrogPrincesse said:

Did anybody notice Tom Colicchio criticizing the use of sous-vide as a technique to cook pork tenderloin on Top Chef recently (with Sean Brock approving)? He claimed it gave the appearance of medium rare but drew the juices out. I am not a big fan of pork tenderloin personally, but I was surprised as this technique seems very popular here on eGullet for this cut of meat!

 

That's total nonsense. Science and experience say exactly the opposite, if the profile is selected correctly.

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15 hours ago, kayb said:

 

FWIW, I cooked a tenderloin SV t'other day; marinated a couple of hours in char siu sauce, SV in sauce for 3 hours at 135 F, cooled, then steam-baked at 400F for 10-15 minutes to crisp it up on the exterior. Drier'n a bone.

 

 

10 to 15 min in a steamer at 400 with an already 135 degree tenderloin seems like a really long time. I usually pan sear very quickly after SV and have done well with pork T-loin.Though I often do the old school sear and roast because its quicker and I never plan ahead.

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3 hours ago, gfweb said:

 

10 to 15 min in a steamer at 400 with an already 135 degree tenderloin seems like a really long time...

 

that was my feeling as well upon reading that

 

it's already "done". what does steaming add?

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Id add this re : PorkTenderloin :

 

good for you picking a low temp , i.e. 135  once you figure out the final surface , Id go even to 130.1

 

as you SV'd w sauce , you would have to completely dry the surface off to get some Maillard-ing

 

if that's important to you , surface dry , and chill.

 

then either torch or very hot pan the surface    if your pan is very hot and thick , you might accomplice a surface that looks

 

as taste good w/o raising the meat past 130.1

 

save the bagged ' jus ' and reheat over the meat.

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On 2/19/2017 at 8:00 AM, paulraphael said:

Sure, but does anyone remember the whole conversation? I'm not about to spend $20 for the whole season on Netflix!

 

So, here's the Top Chef convo.  I believe the episodes are available online.  This was in episode 11.

Brooke's dish was braised pork shoulder and tenderloin with smoked island sweets, braised radishes and egg yolk.

 

During service:

Brock: How did you cook the pork?  

Brooke:  Sous vide with a quick sear on the outside

Brock:  By cooking it sous vide, you end up ruining that natural texture of the tenderloin, which is so soft.

 

At judges table with the chefs

Brock: Using a sous vide bath to poach a pork tenderloin was kind of a crutch.  I didn't think it was necessary.

Colicchio: It's a small piece of meat and it goes very quickly and I think by sous viding it you lose the juiciness of it - it looks rare but the juice is gone

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Brock does have a point about texture of some SV  meats. I believe that if your mouth expects an oven roasted MR texture, then you need to SV at higher temp to give it the greater "bite" that you expect...ie have it more done.

 

I see this in filet mignon that I do for a big dinner using SV. My workaround is to slightly oversear it so that there's a few mm of well-done surrounding MR.

 

 

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but that's kind of the opposite of their complaint

 

no one said it had too rare a texture.

they said DRY

 

 

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