Jump to content
  • Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create a free account.

mebinsf

New to working with gianduja-questions.

Recommended Posts

I've been wanting to do a gianduja ganache for some time now. Do most people make their own? (50:50 nuts to milk chocolate?) I have tried grinding hazelnuts myself in a food processor but the result was far too grainy for my taste. Do you use purchased hazelnut paste and mix milk chocolate to create your own? Do you use a premade gianduja from a chocolate manufacturer (ie callebaut or cocoa barry) and make a ganache as you would with traditional chocolate? 

I see recipes in some of the pro books that seem to go the different routes. If you are using hazelnut paste and making your own, do you have a favorite brand? It looks like they are usually made with sugar (praline paste?).

I feel like this subject is actually pretty simple, but I'm having trouble wrapping my head around it.

Thanks for any hints/tips/ideas.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I use purchased hazelnut paste (Cacao Barry) with milk chocolate. Actually I make 3 different giandujas, one with milk, one with white and one with dark. With milk chocolate I use 350 grams of chocolate to 150 grams of hazelnut paste. I don't use praline paste because I find it too sweet.

 

If I want to grind my own hazelnuts to make paste - I do so in my Sumeet spice grinder or the Thermomix - a food processor never got it smooth enough. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I use dark chocolate, toasted hazelnuts and powdered sugar in a 2:2:1 ratio.  If I use milk or white  chocolate, I'd add about 25% more chocolate.

I basically put the nuts and sugar in the food processor until I have a nut butter then I stream in the melted chocolate and process until just combined.  Don't forget to temper your gianduja - I usually table it on marble.


Edited by Bentley (log)
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IMG_5667.JPG

 

The food processor doesn't get it perfectly smooth, but the chinoise does!  (Did I mention being slightly obsessive? 9_9)

 

I make my own.  60/40 hazelnuts to powdered sugar plus a bit of salt, then about 60/40 dark milk chocolate (49%) to hazelnut paste.  It does take quite some time in the food processor, but it gets close to smooth if you let it go to liquid.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Do you use the gianduja as a ganache as is for a bon bon centre? Or do you make a ganache from it?

 

I've seen some gianduja that is too firm for a centre. I that changed by your nut:chocolate ratio?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I use it as is - it gets softer with different chocolate and proportions of nut paste. 

 

With white chocolate I use less paste - dark - more 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Even though the Italian pastry chef across the street from me insists that gianduja is made only with milk chocolate, I have found I like the taste made with dark much better. Originally I bought bars of gianduja from Valrhona and melted them gently, but quickly discovered it is as much a pain to melt them (keeping them in temper) as it is make the stuff from scratch (not to mention the cost of having Valrhona make the gianduja). So I bought Cacao Barry's hazelnut praline paste and followed Peter Greweling's 1:1 (chocolate, hazelnut praline paste) recipe, which results in the equivalent of 1:1:1 (chocolate, hazelnuts, sugar). One time I accidentally purchased plain hazelnut paste (Cacao Barry) and discovered that I liked the taste of 1:1 dark chocolate to hazelnut paste (no added sugar) much better. Cutting the sugar this much is unorthodox, but it works and I have had no issues. The consistency of the final product depends on the consistency of the hazelnut paste (and how well I have mixed it up), but it firms up enough to cut and not so firm as to endanger guitar wires.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, mebinsf said:

 

I've seen some gianduja that is too firm for a centre. I that changed by your nut:chocolate ratio?

 

Yes, more non-cocoa butter fats in the mix make it softer, whether that is milk fat, hazelnut oil, or others such as coconut oil for meltaways or browned butter for deliciousness.

 

Speaking of gianduja, has anyone tried Valrhona Azelia?  I keep seeing posts on instagram describing it as "the first chocolate in the world to combine the indulgence of hazelnuts with milk chocolate" and I wonder what the heck they're talking about since milk chocolate gianduja already exists.  Maybe they define gianduja as a different proportion and the Azelia is more chocolate?

 

 

 

http://valrhonaprofessionals.com/azelia.html

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've tried it - tasty! I think that they conche the non oil parts of the hazelnut with the chocolate 

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Kerry Beal said:

I've tried it - tasty! I think that they conche the non oil parts of the hazelnut with the chocolate 

 

 

 

Just a way to utilize the byproduct of hazelnut oil production?

I've been puzzled when I saw about their pistachio praline: I said to myself "a bad way to ruin good pistachios, or a good way to recycle bad pistachios".

Call me old, blind or whatever, but they lost me with all that stuff like Dulcey, Caramelia and so on.

 

 

 

Teo

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, teonzo said:

 

Just a way to utilize the byproduct of hazelnut oil production?

I've been puzzled when I saw about their pistachio praline: I said to myself "a bad way to ruin good pistachios, or a good way to recycle bad pistachios".

Call me old, blind or whatever, but they lost me with all that stuff like Dulcey, Caramelia and so on.

 

What's wrong with their pistachio praline? 

 

I do like Dulcey  but Caramelia is too sweet for me.  I'm sure there are lots of pastry chefs who appreciate the time saving and consistency of some of the new blends.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, pastrygirl said:

 

What's wrong with their pistachio praline? 

 

Simply I don't like it, hehhehe. I'm a bit of a pistachio "purist", I'm not a fan of the pairing with caramel. Using top quality pistachios in a praline is just a waste of good ingredients in my opinion, you loose the nuances that make good pistachios good. Giving how much pistachios cost, I don't see much sense in buying something where pistachio qualities are covered. As I wrote, it seems like a way to use non-top pistachios and ask premium prices for them. Good for their wallets, not for mine.

 

 

 

16 hours ago, pastrygirl said:

I do like Dulcey  but Caramelia is too sweet for me.  I'm sure there are lots of pastry chefs who appreciate the time saving and consistency of some of the new blends.

 

Same as above: I don't think they use their top cocoa beans for caramelized products, but they ask premium prices for them. Ok, caramel flavored things will always appeal to the masses and be a good sell, but there are cheaper ways to get those flavors.

 

 

 

Teo

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/19/2016 at 1:29 AM, pastrygirl said:

 

What's wrong with their pistachio praline? 

 

I'm interested in trying that flavor, but don't see anywhere to order it. How would you suggest it be made? Make a caramel and add that to some pistachio paste?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 20/11/2016 at 2:56 PM, Jim D. said:

I'm interested in trying that flavor, but don't see anywhere to order it. How would you suggest it be made? Make a caramel and add that to some pistachio paste?

 

I would have thought it would be made the normal way - cook the pistachios with sugar until they caramelise, then grind.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But my issue is that I already have some good and completely smooth pistachio paste, from which I now want to make pistachio praline paste--and from that, pistachio gianduja. It seems logical to me that I should make a caramel (just the caramelized sugar, not a full-fledged caramel with cream) and add it to the paste, but I'm not sure what will happen because I can't think of any analogous techniques. I am guessing that heating the pistachio paste may help prevent the immediate seizing of the caramel. Obviously experimentation is in order. Any insights would be appreciated.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Jim D. said:

But my issue is that I already have some good and completely smooth pistachio paste, from which I now want to make pistachio praline paste--and from that, pistachio gianduja. It seems logical to me that I should make a caramel (just the caramelized sugar, not a full-fledged caramel with cream) and add it to the paste, but I'm not sure what will happen because I can't think of any analogous techniques. I am guessing that heating the pistachio paste may help prevent the immediate seizing of the caramel. Obviously experimentation is in order. Any insights would be appreciated.

 

I'd be worried about the paste splitting if you do it like that.

 

It might be worth mixing the paste directly with tempered chocolate - you'll retain more of the flavour of the pistachio, and it'll be less sweet.  I'd probably want to use white chocolate anyway, so as not to drown out the flavour and colour.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, jmacnaughtan said:

 

I'd be worried about the paste splitting if you do it like that.

 

It might be worth mixing the paste directly with tempered chocolate - you'll retain more of the flavour of the pistachio, and it'll be less sweet.  I'd probably want to use white chocolate anyway, so as not to drown out the flavour and colour.  

 

Mix it with Dulcey.  Or half Dulcey and half milk.  Oh, so that's why they make Caramelia xD

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought I should report on today's experimentation, the goal being to create a pistachio praline gianduja:

 

I caramelized some sugar and glucose and added it to pistachio paste (both fairly close to the same temperature). It is, of course, not possible to let the caramel cool or it completely hardens. When the two are mixed, the caramel hardens into lumps. I melted this mixture over hot water, and most of the caramel eventually melted, but the overall texture was not acceptable as it contained clumps of caramel which only increased as the mixture cooled. Perhaps most significantly, the taste of the caramel mostly overpowered that of the pistachio, so the big clue was that pistachio is much more delicate in flavor than I thought (as @jmacnaughtan pointed out earlier).

 

Second try was to make pistachio praline paste from scratch: I caramelized sugar and glucose, added toasted pistachios, poured the mixture onto a Silpat, then ground it to paste in a food processor. It was not (no surprise here) completely smooth. I added an equal amount of white chocolate and melted the two together to make a gianduja. The final taste was quite bland, with the taste of the Valrhona Opalys chocolate predominant.

 

Third approach was simply to mix equal parts of the pistachio paste (no caramel added) and white chocolate, again to make gianduja. The taste is by far the best of the attempts, with a strong pistachio taste. I added some toasted, chopped pistachios with the thought that they might add even more flavor, but whereas they do add a nice texture, I did not perceive any additional flavor. The problem with the gianduja is the texture--it is nowhere near solid enough to use in a bonbon; I would guess that it would take double the amount of white chocolate to make it acceptable. Although I have not tried that option, I am fairly certain that we would once more be dealing with a faint pistachio taste.

 

Oh well, it was an interesting possibility....

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To complete the record of my pistachio experimentation:  Contrary to expectations, after a full day, the purchased pistachio paste mixed with an equal part of white chocolate firmed up enough so that it could be piped. It definitely tasted of pistachio. Also contrary to my previous impression, adding some toasted pistachios makes for a stronger pistachio taste, and because no liquid has been added to the mixture, the nuts do not get soggy. On the other hand, the homemade pistachio praline paste, while delicious on ice cream, tastes primarily of caramel. I look forward to trying Valrhona's product to see what they may have done with it.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I didn't know where else to post this question. I have made almond gianduja many times and have always ground the nuts in the food processor with success--they liquefy in a fairly short time. But this last time they did not. After so long that I worried about my Cuisinart, I added some unflavored oil; it took quite a lot of it, but the almonds finally liquefied (more or less). Unfortunately some of their flavor is gone, and I want a paste tasting strongly of almond. I have some good French almond flavoring, but of course that is mixing water with the fat of gianduja. So I began looking online for almond oil. There is lots of it available, but it's meant for salads and not for flavoring. The only one I found that looks promising is a "toasted almond oil" from France. So often nut products are rancid, especially when they are "gourmet" products that probably sit around for a while. The most frequently referenced almond flavoring made from oil is Lorann, but a little research revealed some dramatically negative reviews for its artificial taste (it's not made from almonds).

 

Does anyone have any knowledge of a good almond oil?  Can I get away with a small amount of water-based flavoring in a gianduja?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jim D. said:

 

Does anyone have any knowledge of a good almond oil?  Can I get away with a small amount of water-based flavoring in a gianduja?

 

No,  and I don't think so.  But!  Maybe you could try those bitter almond kernels or bitter apricot seeds that are supposedly healthy and cancer-fighting but may contain arsenic and kill you if eaten in excess (I don't recall if we debated their merits on this forum before).  But a few should be fine, especially if heated to neutralize the poison ... 😉  I believe they are the same bitter almonds used to flavor almond extract.


Edited by pastrygirl (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Jim D. said:

I didn't know where else to post this question. I have made almond gianduja many times and have always ground the nuts in the food processor with success--they liquefy in a fairly short time. But this last time they did not. After so long that I worried about my Cuisinart, I added some unflavored oil; it took quite a lot of it, but the almonds finally liquefied (more or less). Unfortunately some of their flavor is gone, and I want a paste tasting strongly of almond. I have some good French almond flavoring, but of course that is mixing water with the fat of gianduja. So I began looking online for almond oil. There is lots of it available, but it's meant for salads and not for flavoring. The only one I found that looks promising is a "toasted almond oil" from France. So often nut products are rancid, especially when they are "gourmet" products that probably sit around for a while. The most frequently referenced almond flavoring made from oil is Lorann, but a little research revealed some dramatically negative reviews for its artificial taste (it's not made from almonds).

 

Does anyone have any knowledge of a good almond oil?  Can I get away with a small amount of water-based flavoring in a gianduja?

I must confess that I don't taste much difference between the Lorann and the actual bitter almond oil that I happen to have a bottle of made by Xenex labs. The Lorann has the advantage of not containing prussic acid which the real stuff does.

 

And a small amount of extract probably isn't a huge problem in your gianduja anyway.

 

 


Edited by Kerry Beal (log)
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll ask a question here as well. Reading a recipe by Leroux, where I'm not sure exactly what he mean.

 

Any ideas?

 

1. Roast nuts, mix with sugar

2. Mix with melted chocolate and add cocoa butter, temper at 28°

3. Pour onto tray and allow to crystallize.

4. Pass through the grinder

5. Temper once more at 28°

 

He mentions that you need to use a grinder or a "ball bearing refiner" to achieve maximum level of smoothness. I guess that if you run it through a melanger at the beginning to make the praliné, you really wouldn't need to temper twice, or what do  you guys say? I've never tempered a gianduja before, what's the idea here? Make sure that it's heated to 45 degrees and just table it till 28 degrees? Or are there more steps? 🤔

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Rajala said:

I'll ask a question here as well. Reading a recipe by Leroux, where I'm not sure exactly what he mean.

 

Any ideas?

 

1. Roast nuts, mix with sugar

2. Mix with melted chocolate and add cocoa butter, temper at 28°

3. Pour onto tray and allow to crystallize.

4. Pass through the grinder

5. Temper once more at 28°

 

He mentions that you need to use a grinder or a "ball bearing refiner" to achieve maximum level of smoothness. I guess that if you run it through a melanger at the beginning to make the praliné, you really wouldn't need to temper twice, or what do  you guys say? I've never tempered a gianduja before, what's the idea here? Make sure that it's heated to 45 degrees and just table it till 28 degrees? Or are there more steps? 🤔

I think the step that would differ would be to replace 'pass through the grinder' with melange in the melanger. So there would still be two tempering steps.

 

When I temper gianduja the traditional way - I melt, then cool down to 24º C, then heat back up again to around 28º C.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Kerry Beal said:

I think the step that would differ would be to replace 'pass through the grinder' with melange in the melanger. So there would still be two tempering steps.

 

When I temper gianduja the traditional way - I melt, then cool down to 24º C, then heat back up again to around 28º C.

 

 

 

Hmm. Yeah, but... I wonder why you would do it twice though? If my praliné already is super smooth. I mean, the chocolate should be pretty smooth already as well. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×