How Long do Things Last

[MetsFan5]

I apologize if this is a topic already, in which case please merge. 

 

 How long is too long for things to sit out? Example 1- I ordered bare (non sauced) wings and got them 4 hours ago. Can I throw them in the fridge and reheat?

 

  Also, really, how long is too long for cold cuts? I swear my Land o Lakes white American cheese (guilty pleasure) should be fine way past the sell by date. Am I crazy and asking for food poisoning? My home is generally kept at 64 degrees Fahrenheit so if I leave something out it's on granite and not changing temps rapidly.  

  I should likely dig out my food safety text from college but I think it's at my parents home. God knows where. 

 

  I recently learned white rice is a huge no no.  What else is? The only time (knock on wood) I had legit food poisoning was when I got chicken with broccoli near my office in NYC  during the summer, ate half, never refrigerated it, went to a bar for 4 hours, all while dragging my leftovers with me in July back to Hoboken and drunkenly ate it at 2am. I was sick for a LONG TIME. 

[Lisa Shock]

The Fed only regulates dating baby food. A few states regulate dairy. The sell by date is mostly a suggestion. I used to live in a state which regulated dairy, and there, dairy products had to be good for 7 days past the sell by date. For many foods, if they remain sealed and stored at an appropriate temperature, it's a flexible suggestion. However, if your groceries (including a pack of steaks) sat in the car for 3 hours on a 110° day, and then two days later you set those steaks on the counter for a half hour, opened the package, touched it a few times with bare hands, used half, then tossed the uncooked portion loosely wrapped back into the fridge, it's not going to last that long.

 

Here's a guide, from the FDA. Some bacterial colonies can double in size every 20 minutes at room temperature. Normally, 2 hours is pretty much tops for leftovers, reheating to 165°, if thorough, should kill bacteria but, will not get rid of poisonous waste products from them, nor will it kill viral spores.

 

Some foodborne illness makes us sick because it infects us, gets inside and reproduces like norovirus or e. coli. Some, like botulism, don't make us ill, they poison us -they produce poisons as waste. Then, there's the world of parasites and their eggs in/on food.

 

There are conditions which enhance growth: temperature, moisture, available nutrition, oxygen for some, lack of oxygen for others, and pH. If you eliminate some of these conditions, some foods will no longer be potentially hazardous. But, it varies from food to food. Even the world of cold cuts offers a huge variety: room temperature-stable salumi, soft cheeses that go moldy quickly, and everything in-between.

 

In a restaurant situation, for most open foods, one week is the max it can be kept. There are always exceptions, like jars of olives or jam, of foods which do not foster bacterial growth if stored properly. Some foods, are really not very good after a few days. I don't like keeping custards more than 3 days. Commercially processed foods are often made to be kept longer under bad conditions -like ketchup.

 

I can't really answer about your wings. If they went from the deep fryer straight into the to-go container without being sauced or touched, there's a good chance they'll be fine. (sauce adds moisture and food, plus opportunities for cross contamination, and general exposure to people breathing) If you ate half of them bare-fingered, touched a few while grabbing, and talked for 20 minutes with the open container within two feet of your mouth, then they would clearly have a much larger number of bacterial colonies growing.

 

There's also susceptibility to consider. Everyone's personal medical situation is different, and considered confidential. Some people have strong constitutions. However, someone recovering from another illness or even serious physical trauma like a car accident will have a compromised immune system and be less able to fight off an infection or handle a load of toxins. Children under the age of 7 don't have fully formed immune systems. Senior citizens often have weaker immune systems, as do pregnant women, people in chemotherapy, and people taking a myriad of medications. When you add it all up, restaurants have to assume that a goodly percent of their customers are sensitive in one way or another, and have to take measures to protect them. You can make different decisions at home, based on your knowledge of your own situation. That said, foodborne illness is no fun. I had salmonella once and it was horrible: two weeks of continuous nausea and vomiting, with lingering nausea for months. Good luck!

[Deryn]

I also had salmonella once. Three months of being almost incapacitatingly sick and in pain before it was even diagnosed. 4 days in hospital in isolation at the end of it all. No idea to this day what caused it but it was probably chicken. I have been excruciatingly cautious ever since and tend to throw away anything I have the least doubt about - and to wash my hands constantly when I am touching any foods I think have even a remote chance of being contaminated. That is one 'diet' I never want to go on again.

Edited March 13, 2016 by Deryn (log)

[scubadoo97]

Sorry to hear Deryn. 

 

But it to the original question, longer than they say it does 

[naguere]

MetsFan5

Rice, you have it right, it is a good growing medium for anything nasty.

 

Generally I go by the 'Sniff It' test for most things.

 

If you are going to reheat something, get it hot and do it well.

 

But if your cheese has a  bit of mold on it, scrape it off and you will be fine (unless it is from unpasteurized milk and you are pregnant)

 

 

[Martin Fisher]

MetsFan5,
Give Dr. O. Peter "Pete" Snyder's "FOOD SAFETY HAZARDS AND CONTROLS FOR THE HOME FOOD PREPARER" a read.
It's invaluable.

Edited March 15, 2016 by DiggingDogFarm (log)

[naguere]

10 minutes ago, DiggingDogFarm said:

MetsFan5,
Give Dr. O. Peter "Pete" Snyder's "FOOD SAFETY HAZARDS AND CONTROLS FOR THE HOME FOOD PREPARER" a read.
It's invaluable.

Listen to your heart. 

 

'Best before'

'Consume by'

As an ex-Scout, an Ex soldier and generally a fellow who lives on the land.

 

cycling along and if there is a dead rabbit, (is it still warm, is it floppy), good to go.

 

In my area now I pick up pheasants, the males look lovely  but the females taste just as good ,

 

Road kill.

[kbjesq]

On 3/12/2016 at 5:39 AM, Lisa Shock said:

The Fed only regulates dating baby food. A few states regulate dairy. The sell by date is mostly a suggestion. I used to live in a state which regulated dairy, and there, dairy products had to be good for 7 days past the sell by date. For many foods, if they remain sealed and stored at an appropriate temperature, it's a flexible suggestion. However, if your groceries (including a pack of steaks) sat in the car for 3 hours on a 110° day, and then two days later you set those steaks on the counter for a half hour, opened the package, touched it a few times with bare hands, used half, then tossed the uncooked portion loosely wrapped back into the fridge, it's not going to last that long.

 

Here's a guide, from the FDA. Some bacterial colonies can double in size every 20 minutes at room temperature. Normally, 2 hours is pretty much tops for leftovers, reheating to 165°, if thorough, should kill bacteria but, will not get rid of poisonous waste products from them, nor will it kill viral spores.

 

Some foodborne illness makes us sick because it infects us, gets inside and reproduces like norovirus or e. coli. Some, like botulism, don't make us ill, they poison us -they produce poisons as waste. Then, there's the world of parasites and their eggs in/on food.

 

There are conditions which enhance growth: temperature, moisture, available nutrition, oxygen for some, lack of oxygen for others, and pH. If you eliminate some of these conditions, some foods will no longer be potentially hazardous. But, it varies from food to food. Even the world of cold cuts offers a huge variety: room temperature-stable salumi, soft cheeses that go moldy quickly, and everything in-between.

 

In a restaurant situation, for most open foods, one week is the max it can be kept. There are always exceptions, like jars of olives or jam, of foods which do not foster bacterial growth if stored properly. Some foods, are really not very good after a few days. I don't like keeping custards more than 3 days. Commercially processed foods are often made to be kept longer under bad conditions -like ketchup.

 

I can't really answer about your wings. If they went from the deep fryer straight into the to-go container without being sauced or touched, there's a good chance they'll be fine. (sauce adds moisture and food, plus opportunities for cross contamination, and general exposure to people breathing) If you ate half of them bare-fingered, touched a few while grabbing, and talked for 20 minutes with the open container within two feet of your mouth, then they would clearly have a much larger number of bacterial colonies growing.

 

There's also susceptibility to consider. Everyone's personal medical situation is different, and considered confidential. Some people have strong constitutions. However, someone recovering from another illness or even serious physical trauma like a car accident will have a compromised immune system and be less able to fight off an infection or handle a load of toxins. Children under the age of 7 don't have fully formed immune systems. Senior citizens often have weaker immune systems, as do pregnant women, people in chemotherapy, and people taking a myriad of medications. When you add it all up, restaurants have to assume that a goodly percent of their customers are sensitive in one way or another, and have to take measures to protect them. You can make different decisions at home, based on your knowledge of your own situation. That said, foodborne illness is no fun. I had salmonella once and it was horrible: two weeks of continuous nausea and vomiting, with lingering nausea for months. Good luck!

On every food forum there are questions about "can I eat this" or "is this food safe" etc.,  (there are hundreds of such inquiries on Chowhound, for example) and this is the most thoughtful, responsible and balanced response that I've ever read. Thank you @Lisa Shock 

[Lisa Shock]

Eventually, I might get around to writing a sanitation guide for eG, I just mostly feel like the ServSafe manual covers it and anything I would write would simply be a rehashing of that.

 

BTW, odor has almost nothing to do with foodborne illness. There are a bunch of microorganisms that cause offensive odors, and most of them have not really been studied much. They appear to be, ironically, mostly harmless. I do not recommend cooking food that smells bad, simply based on the old programming motto: GIGO. (garbage in = garbage out) I will say that salmonella and some infectious strains of e. coli have no odor detectable to humans. Most parasites and many physical contaminants (glass shards, rat poison, etc.) have no odor, either.

 

And, I did find a series of studies that found that with certain foodborne illnesses, salmonella and e.coli IIRC, drinking hard liquor helped decrease the effects of the illness. (Authors studied parties like weddings where large numbers of people became ill from eating the food served at the event. Those who consumed the most hard liquor had the mildest cases of illness.) This makes sense in that alcohol is a poison, and those who drank more hard liquor were killing off part of the illness colony forming in their gut, whereas teetotalers had full blown colonies thriving inside.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

One summer when I was in college howsoever many years ago and cooking over a hot plate, I had a steak whose time had past and which would qualify for the category of offensive odors.  I sought the opinion of my fellow students.  One replied:  "I used to work in a butcher shop, that is not spoiled."  So I ate it.