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seabream

Built-in combi oven

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The XL has a probe I believe. Miele has several models - some are plumbed, some are not.

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thank you for the correction.  the M. site is a bit hard to navigate 

 

again, knowing nothing at all about it, 

 

Id get a probe if the price was reasonable.

 

this isnt something you are going to cart back to BB&B if you are less than 100 % happy.

 

" Happy in the Kitchen " is worth quite a lot.

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Sooooooooooooooooo  ...................

 

"" Rational ovens are so easy to use, it's a pleasure to work with one, ""

 

many of us would like to hear more.

 

O.K., just me  

 

pics ?  Voltage ?  3-phase  ?

 

Drool ?

 

I want one so bad. It's a shame they don't have a decent home version. Here's a (probably too long) video about the controls on a Rational combi. There are a few other videos out there, but they're mostly cheesy promotional videos that don't really explain the controls in depth like this video does. The fun stuff starts with the automatic programs around 8 minutes in.

 


Edited by btbyrd (log)
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Ive seen this vid.  stunningly interesting.

 

Its the one i suggested one might watch to the upper R

 

No worries.

 

how ever no in nothing about Rational A nor B

 

the Rational we have seen is quite Beguiling.

 

punch, punch  etc 

 

as it might be

 

Im wondering it this is a New Rational for those with Less Training

 

or the Rational group saying  just as good

 

and if you have skill and training, you can make the Combi what you might want with it

 

but .............

 

if your training is no so complete, well you can stiill make fantastic food.

 

that is not a judgement in any way.

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Make sure you know the price of the trim kits. I don't know if any of them include trim kits in the basic price. I've been keeping an eye on the Thermador 24" combo steam-convection oven and the trim kit adds about $350 on to the price. Honestly, I think I could negotiate that down, but still - it's a factor. Also, I like the fact that the Thermador has both a 24" and a 30" trim kit - more flexibility in placement, especially if you are putting it into an existing kitchen. 

 

then again, maybe they all have those options. I just know that some models are out of my current price range. 


Edited by FauxPas (log)

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Not much to say about the Rational, I get to use one on occasions. You can pre-program it for your recipes and just press that one button. It's very much all controllable, from temp, fan speed, steam levels, etc.. It makes cooking or baking easy and perfect each time.

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Seabream,  I have a built in combi, that is not plumbed, and love it.  First, while a countertop can do a nice job, they are limited to 120 volts, most of the installed units ( other than the new Viking which can be installed) are 240 volts and can double as a regular oven.  Since it is not plumbed, there is a container you fill to generate steam. I thought it might be a pain, but it has never been an issue for me.   Most of the containers are quite large,  and mine lasts for a long time.

I almost never need to empty water out of the oven.  If you are in combi mode, much of the water vapor burns off when it hits the floor of the oven.  In steam mode, it would definitely pool on the floor of the oven, and you would have to use a sponge to get it out, which I have done a few times, again, not much of an issue. However,. they come with a slotted pan and a solid pan, and you are instructed to put the solid pan under the slotted pan, and the water collects in the solid pan and you just dump it out when you are done.   I did a combi steam chicken tonight, it sat in a slotted pan, the solid pan under it collected all the drippings, and clean up was pretty easy.

 

 

 IMHO, the Gagg is at the top of the list-  it is plumbed, which is a nice bonus, but the best is that the controls are pretty straight forward - choose the amount of humidity  and then the temperature, and that is it.  Most of the others have various modes which can be a little confusing.  Many have preprogrammed cooking settings for food types.  Some people love that, I don't, I find it too confining and would much rather set it myself. Things to consider include whether it comes with a broil element.  While you are buying it for combi mode, you will likely find that you use it in non combi mode more often than you regular oven.  Because the interior is pretty small, it preheats in under 5 minutes, so it is much quicker to use than a regular built in stove.  Having a temperature probe is a real convenience, especially when you are starting out.  In combi mode , it is much quicker than a regular oven, and the probe can help you keep an eye on how fast your food is cooking, though it is not a deal breaker. 

I looked at all that were available a few years ago, and ended up with a Viking that was being discontinued because the discount was fantastic.  

 

There are two related down sides to combis.  First, they are not by any means mainstream.  The only manufacturers selling them are pretty high end, so the prices are high end to match.  Once mainstream manufacturers start selling them, pricing should drop.  Second, since there are so few, recipes and cook books are hard to find.  Again, if they ever pick up in popularity, that may change.  You can find manuals for some of the combi's here  https://sites.google.com/site/combisteamconvectionsteamoven/home/recipes-and-guides

 

 

 

 

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Maybe I'm missing something but it looks like the maximum temperature on the Miele steam combo oven available here is only 225 C in conventional oven mode.  That's lower than I would like.


It's almost never bad to feed someone.

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Haresfur, most of them max out at 225 C or 440 F,   not sure why.  Also, most of them do not have a pure bake mode without convection, and instead, if you want a dry heat, you only have a convection mode.  Since a typical conversion is to subtract 25 degrees, the equivalent temp in non convection is 465 F.   OTOH,  there are certain things I bake where I don't want convection, and want a higher temp, so I use a different oven.  

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Sooooooooooooooooo  ...................

 

"" Rational ovens are so easy to use, it's a pleasure to work with one, ""

 

many of us would like to hear more.

 

O.K., just me  

 

pics ?  Voltage ?  3-phase  ?

 

Drool ?

  • Like 2

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Barrytm - thank you for the detailed information you shared. Thanks everyone for chipping in too.

 

I have decided to go with the Miele, unplumbed. I got to compare several models in the store, and this one seems to be the best for my purposes. 

 

I am putting it in an odd-sized cabinet, so I will have to add a custom trim around it. I will also have to run 240V to the location where it will be. A plumbed one would be nice, but since I'm not doing a kitchen remodel, just installing this in an existing kitchen, I didn't think that the plumbing work would be worth it.

 

The lack of recipes for combi ovens worries me. If there is no topic on combi oven recipes, I will start one next. Please join and share any recipes or recipe sources you like.

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How exciting, Seabream! Please let us know how you like it once it is installed. You got the XL?

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Nice choice, since it comes with a Broil element, you might have to clean out dust bunnies from your full sized oven in a few months, the Miele will be so fast to warm up, doubt you will use your regular oven much..  I don't in any way mean to criticize your choice, but I did look at the manual, and Miele is just as silly as the Viking I bought.  The manual lists 13 different cooking modes, and so they have to make up names for the different functions.  For example, the call one mode Surround, another is called intensive.  It is hard enough for someone to write a cook book, but they would have to go through all the manuals for the different manufacturers to see what the different names are.  BTW,  my Viking has a function "SteamHeat".  Do you know how much steam it introduces in that function - none.  But as it says in the manual, since the vents are closed while the oven is on, any moisture released by the food is converted into steam.  Hopefully more of the manufacturers will adopt the gaggenau approach - set the moisture amounts as 0 to 100, then set the heat, and start cooking.    

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I have a Rational installed in my home have not regretted it for one second, go with the gas one that uses standard electrical.  Your biggest issue should be drainage and hood venting. Nothing has gone wrong with the Rational so I can not comment about service but if the service department is anything like the on call chef that answers any questions I have  it will be amazing.   The company makes a point of ensuring you are happy.  image.jpeg

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Mike Macdonald Calgary

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