Recommended gourmet foods?

[NewFoodie]

Now that I can afford it, I've recently decided to explore the gourmet, haute cuisine, "foodie" world.  Can anyone recommend gourmet foods I might like to try, other than the ones I've already started to delve into, namely:

 

• alcoholic beverages (such as beer, single malt scotch whiskies and wine)

• caviar

• cheese

• chocolate

• coffee

• cooking oils and fats (including olive oil)

• escargot

• fois gras

• fungus (such as mushrooms and truffles, the latter being a form of fungus, but not a mushroom)

• meat (including fish and shellfish, pork, and Wagyu beef)

• vinegar (including real balsamic vinegar and many others)

 

I'm looking for "generally accepted" gourmet foods, not exotic, crazy things, and I don't care for "sweetbreads" and other offal.

 

Thanks for any help anyone can provide.

[SobaAddict70]

Honestly, the best recommendation I can make is to be curious about new experiences and to keep an open mind.

A question for you: define "exotic". Because for some people, escargot is "exotic".

"Generally accepted" gourmet food depends on the culture. Your question is a bit broad, no?

[NewFoodie]

My culture is American, and in my experience, escargot would not be considered "exotic" here in the U.S., at least not among those with an interest in haute cuisine.  My question is a bit broad, yes, but I just don't want to eat brains, pancreata, thymi, tongues, eyeballs, etc.  Call it a cultural bias if you will, but in these parts, offal and such things aren't considered to be foodstuffs.  In general, despite a few exceptions such as escargot, the only parts of animals we eat are the large muscles.

[Mjx]

Okay, but what's the thinking behind what you're doing here, and what food have you been eating, recently? What do you like?

 

If you're mostly feeling curious/flush, try everything; there isn't a general food bucket list, and planty of more or less iconically 'gourmet' foods leave plenty of people unmoved (truffles kind of bore me, which does have the advantage of making it really easy to horrify waiters who try to do a truffle up-sell); in many cases, their status has more to do with their current cost and marketing/public perception than anything else (consider lobster's elevation from trash food for prisoners to expensive delicacy). The most disturbing experiences tend to make for the best stories.

 

If you're looking for more things you'll genuinely enjoy, seek out people who are commited to eating and preparing excellent food – avoiding self-described gourmets or foodies, who may care more about the impression they make than the food they eat – and talk to them, eat with them; forget about labels and categories.

 

Or, just eat your way through this list.

[SobaAddict70]

My culture is American, and in my experience, escargot would not be considered "exotic" here in the U.S., at least not among those with an interest in haute cuisine.  My question is a bit broad, yes, but I just don't want to eat brains, pancreata, thymi, tongues, eyeballs, etc.  Call it a cultural bias if you will, but in these parts, offal and such things aren't considered to be foodstuffs.  In general, despite a few exceptions such as escargot, the only parts of animals we eat are the large muscles.

Fair enough, although it still seems broad.

I guess my stumbling block is the terminology you're using.

For instance, something like this

might be characteristic of what foodies eat. (it's a picture of french toast topped with plum jam)

Bird's nest soup might be considered "gourmet" to someone of Chinese descent or even an ABC (American-born Chinese); "exotic" could be, say, spam musubi. That's what I meant by culture.

If you mean Escoffier-like haute cuisine, then try looking into ortolans if you can get them. There's some risk involved though.

[SobaAddict70]

Call it a cultural bias if you will, but in these parts, offal and such things aren't considered to be foodstuffs.  In general, despite a few exceptions such as escargot, the only parts of animals we eat are the large muscles.

By "these parts", do you mean the entire country?

That's a broad generalization, no?

Or do you mean a smaller region?

I can think of lots of people in the U.S. who consider offal (liver, tongue, tripe, heart and yes, sweetbreads) to be foodstuffs. Try any good Jewish delicatessen (i.e., tongue sandwich) or a Mexican taco truck (i.e., tacos con lengua or tacos con tripa).

If you go down South, they eat way more than just the large muscles. Chitlins, pig's feet and so forth, for example.

[ChrisTaylor]

Now that I can afford it, I've recently decided to explore the gourmet, haute cuisine, "foodie" world.  Can anyone recommend gourmet foods I might like to try, other than the ones I've already started to delve into, namely:

 

• alcoholic beverages (such as beer, single malt scotch whiskies and wine)

• caviar

• cheese

• chocolate

• coffee

• cooking oils and fats (including olive oil)

• escargot

• fois gras

• fungus (such as mushrooms and truffles, the latter being a form of fungus, but not a mushroom)

• meat (including fish and shellfish, pork, and Wagyu beef)

• vinegar (including real balsamic vinegar and many others)

 

I'm looking for "generally accepted" gourmet foods, not exotic, crazy things, and I don't care for "sweetbreads" and other offal.

 

Thanks for any help anyone can provide.

 

So if I understand you, you're looking to expand your horizons. Right? Just not into things like offal. Even though foie gras is expensive offal and arguably has a flavour profile more assertive than sweetbreads. I'd urge you to rethink the offal thing. I mean, I'd argue that part of being a carnivore is moving beyond the rib eye. That's not to say you'll like every smell, texture or flavour but to write off things enjoyed by much of the world's population throughout history, including your people, sort of goes against your mission. I don't want to bang on about this point or derail the thread, but a gourmet is someone that enjoys good. He or she approaches food with an open mind. I mean, if you think about foie gras for a moment -- why do you desire it but no other kinds of offal? Because Escoffier drops it like a comma? Surely it's not the 'Frenchness'--I mean, otherwise you'd jump wholeheartedly on board the nose-to-tail bandwagon, right? Is it because it's expensive?

 

Anyway. You've listed some really, really, really broad categories. Cheese? I mean, I've tried a lot of cheeses and I still feel like I'm only dipping my toes in the water. I'd argue that in addition to just tasting the stuff you're going to want a decent cheese shop or deli. Not only so you can buy the products--I mean, I'm sure you can probably order a good variety of cheeses online now--but so you can actually learn something about the products from people that love and understand them. Same applies to charcuterie, something else worth exploring. You might want to dip your toes into the world of game meat. Some big classics that might be right up your alley--hare royale, for instance. Only it has the hare's blood in it. To thicken the sauce.

 

Are you looking to be able to say that, yes, you've had wagyu and that yes, you've consumed 50 year old Glenfiddich or are you looking to say you can really appreciate the qualities of, say, grain-fed wagyu in comparison to some high end grass fed beef? The big ticket items, with their household names and high price tags, can be lovely but aren't necessarily the best of what is available, merely what is in high demand. This is true of perhaps every category you've listed in your post. And I'd argue that it's perhaps impossible to appreciate the good stuff--and to separate the expensive and good from what which is merely expensive--without understanding the context in which it sits. You're not going to 'get' an independent bottling of an unusual expression of single malt whisky without first developing your palate won a lot of other whiskies. Similarly, until you've developed a palate a high end bottle of Bordeaux is probably wasted on you. I know that the good stuff with regards to wine is largely wasted on me. 

 

In short, I'm not having a go at you. When I first set out to 'try all the things' I too was eager to tick off all the big name items--caviar, foie gras, truffle and so on--so I can understand where you're coming from. At the same time, though, appreciating as opposed to merely consuming nice food involves opening yourself to a lot of experiences and being prepared, at times, to focus on one or two things and learn a lot about them through experience, listening to knowledgeable people, asking questions and reading. It also involves forming your own opinions, which may or may not line up with some classical perspective on what is worth spending a lot of money on. It wasn't long, for instance, before I decided I preferred the aroma of porcini mushrooms--you know, the plain old dried kind--to truffle.

[ChrisZ]

Now that I can afford it, I've recently decided to explore the gourmet, haute cuisine, "foodie" world.

For the price of a decent meal in a restaurant, you should be able to get an annual subscription to a food magazine.

The "foodie world" is not a static collection of dishes that you much consume in order to be admitted. There is a foodie world but it's just a constantly evolving interest and different things come in an out of fashion all the time. Quinoa is a lot cheaper than fois gras or caviar and dare I say it, currently more fashionable.

SO subscribe to a magazine, or several if you can afford it.

I can't suggest a US one but I'm sure others here can help out (FWIW I get the Australian Gourmet Travller). Once you start getting a monthly magazine you'll notice trends developing, ingredients that come in and out of season, you'll see how some chefs create headlines when they move to different restaurants and so on. You'll also see ads for events and shows and so on.

Joining eGullet and just reading it every day is a more immersive introduction to the "foodie world" than ordering escargot at a restaurant just for the sake of it.

[cdh]

If you're feeling flush and experimental, find a restaurant in your neck of the woods that really knows what it is doing.  If they offer a tasting menu, order it.  On a Wednesday night.  Go back the next week and do it again.  Ask to talk to the chef when you're done and ask about the things you liked.  Become known.  You'll find yourself with a guide to good food who can take your known likes and dislikes and steer you towards likely new pleasures for you.  You'll get a lot more out of that than buying expensive ingredients and trying to figure out how to use them by yourself.  It's always fun to have somebody who knows what they're doing tell you that they found something new that is gonna knock your socks off. 

[NewFoodie]

There's a lot to digest here, so for now I'll just have to promise to reply at greater length to this thread only after thinking about your comments and doing a little homework.

 

Just a few quick comments off the top of my head, though:

 

• I don't understand the usage of the word "flush" in this thread.  Does this mean "flush with enthusiasm"?

 

• I'm entirely uninterested in eating anything simply because it's expensive or trendy.  I just want to know what great things I might be missing.  And as far as being motivated by impressing anyone: I probably won't even mention any of this to my friends and family, unless by chance they raise the topic themselves.

 

• Mjx: Thank you for your humorous suggestion to "eat my way through this list".  It's "a little rich for my blood" though, as the saying goes.

 

• I see via Google that Auguste Escoffier was a French chef.  It's news to me - I never heard of him.

 

• By "these parts", I intended a self-deprecating, humorous allusion to my white-bread, WASP, Northeastern American, middle class demographic group.  And no, I have no aversion in general to the ways of those who aren't  "my people".  I just have an aversion to offal in general.

 

• And yes, fois gras is offal.  But just as with escargot, there are exceptions to my "large muscles only" preference.  But I'm not eating brains, pancreata, thymi, tongues, or eyeballs, that's for sure.  Although it is of course a purely subjective matter, nonetheless, on a deep emotional level, those things don't seem like food to me.  I feel revulsion at the thought of eating these things, whether I should or not.

 

Thanks for everyone's comements.  I'll be back!

[ChrisTaylor]

Flush

 

 

 

• I don't understand the usage of the word "flush" in this thread.  Does this mean "flush with enthusiasm"?

 

 

 

It refers to wealth. Your new hobby isn't cheap.

[cdh]

"Flush" generally means flush with cash --. money to spare, cost is not a primary consideration.

 

We also really need to know your baseline of experience:

Did you just graduate from medical school and subsist on ramen for the past dozen years?

 

Are you accustomed to going to restaurants? 

 

Are you  accustomed to a "meat and 2 veg" diet?

 

Are you now or have you ever been a vegetarian?

 

Do you cook for yourself? 

 

If so, what do you like/what are you good at making?  etc. 

 

There are good preparations and bad preparations of most ingredients, e.g. squid, brisket, . You do need to get to know ingredients...  pressed sweetbreads have enough texture to be OK, brains are just mush in all preparations I've had... rocky mountain oysters actually beat sweetbreads for textural and flavor appeal in my opinion.  Maybe not yours.  You need to be open enough to try stuff.  

 

But to guide you, we need to know where you're coming from...

Edited July 9, 2014 by cdh (log)

[liuzhou]

Appreciating food isn't stamp collecting. There is no secret list. It is more a learning process. 

 

Start simple. Start with two different varieties of say, tomatoes. What is the difference in flavour? Sweetness? Acidity? Then try them cooked in different ways. Then add a third. 

 

Experiment with seasoning. More? less? 

 

Try combinations. What dressing goes best with those tomatoes. Why?

 

The more you learn, the more you will appreciate all foods, not just the rare and expensive.

[SobaAddict70]

There's a lot to digest here, so for now I'll just have to promise to reply at greater length to this thread only after thinking about your comments and doing a little homework.

 

Just a few quick comments off the top of my head, though:

 

• I don't understand the usage of the word "flush" in this thread.  Does this mean "flush with enthusiasm"?

 

• I'm entirely uninterested in eating anything simply because it's expensive or trendy.  I just want to know what great things I might be missing.  And as far as being motivated by impressing anyone: I probably won't even mention any of this to my friends and family, unless by chance they raise the topic themselves.

 

• Mjx: Thank you for your humorous suggestion to "eat my way through this list".  It's "a little rich for my blood" though, as the saying goes.

 

• I see via Google that Auguste Escoffier was a French chef.  It's news to me - I never heard of him.

 

• By "these parts", I intended a self-deprecating, humorous allusion to my white-bread, WASP, Northeastern American, middle class demographic group.  And no, I have no aversion in general to the ways of those who aren't  "my people".  I just have an aversion to offal in general.

 

• And yes, fois gras is offal.  But just as with escargot, there are exceptions to my "large muscles only" preference.  But I'm not eating brains, pancreata, thymi, tongues, or eyeballs, that's for sure.  Although it is of course a purely subjective matter, nonetheless, on a deep emotional level, those things don't seem like food to me.  I feel revulsion at the thought of eating these things, whether I should or not.

 

Thanks for everyone's comements.  I'll be back!

Some points:

When I hear the phrase "haute cuisine", the associations that come to mind are, for me, Escoffier, French mother sauces and invariably, restaurants such as Lespinasse, Chanterelle, Daniel, Jean Georges and Bouley. The first two are closed, and all were or are located in NYC. For me, haute cuisine refers to a style of cooking that generally consists of meticulous, refined preparation and careful (some would say obsessive) presentation of food, at a very high price level, accompanied by rare wines. Typically it is French, but there are also examples of American (think "Per Se/French Laundry/Manresa") or say, Chinese haute cuisine (see this article by former NYTimes restaurant critic Ruth Reichl), an excerpt of which is quoted below.

 

But China, like France, also has a venerable tradition of haute cuisine. While expensive French restaurants in New York can hold their own against many places in Paris, if you want to move beyond steamed dumplings and stir-fries to experience the complexity of Chinese banquet cuisine, the possibilities grow dimmer each year. Why? Chinese food experts in this country contemplate this culinary disappointment with deep sadness. The reasons, they say, range from the apathy and lack of sophistication of American diners to a shortage of great Chinese chefs.

Of the French restaurants I listed, I've only been to Bouley and only once.

It's not high on my list -- which doesn't mean I won't eat it or that I dislike it or can't appreciate it, just that it's not for me.

This Wikipedia article talks some more about Escoffier's role regarding his influence with respect to haute cuisine: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haute_cuisine

As for what ingredients or foods are used in haute cuisine these days -- anything is fair game. That's the point that many commenters have been making. Jean-Georges Vongerichten, for example, is famous for combining young garlic and frogs' legs, in the same way that Thomas Keller made magic with pig's head and quail egg, or tapioca and oysters.

Modern haute cuisine is a dance between technique, concept and ingredients.

Edited July 10, 2014 by SobaAddict70 (log)

[NewFoodie]

from Mjx:

 

>The most disturbing experiences tend to make for the best stories.

 

Maybe so, but I'm nonetheless inclined to try to avoid disturbing experiences.

 

 

For centuries, a rite of passage for French gourmets has been the eating of the Ortolan. These tiny birds—captured alive, force-fed, then drowned in Armagnac—were roasted whole and eaten that way, bones and all, while the diner draped his head with a linen napkin to preserve the precious aromas and, some believe, to hide from God.

 

— The Wine Spectator

 

See, this is the kind of thing I meant when I said I wasn't interested in anything "crazy".

 

from ChrisTaylor:

 

>...charcuterie, something else worth exploring.

 

This sounds like an excellent idea.

 

>At the same time, though, appreciating as opposed to merely consuming nice food involves opening yourself to a lot of experiences and being prepared, at times, to focus on one or two things and learn a lot about them through experience, listening to knowledgeable people, asking questions and reading.

 

I agree in principle, but I'm wary that too much education being required to fully appreciate a foodstuff could possibly result in purely acquired tastes, which I am not persuaded are necessarilty the most pleasurable tastes.  Not that I wouldn't be willing to try this approach.

 

from ChrisZ:

 

>Quinoa is a lot cheaper than fois gras or caviar and dare I say it, currently more fashionable.

 

I don't care for quinoa, although I had used it extensively many years ago in growing mushrooms.

 

I dislike fashion per se in all its guises.

 

from cdh:

 

>...find a restaurant in your neck of the woods that really knows what it is doing.

 

Oddly enough, there are three such restaurants - all within 400 feet from each other!

 

>We also really need to know your baseline of experience

 

Someone prepares rather mainstream American non-haute cuisine for me, but in my opinion, she's REALLY good at it.  I don't cook.

 

from liuzhou:

 

>Start with two different varieties of say, tomatoes. What is the difference in flavour? Sweetness? Acidity? Then try them cooked in different ways.

 

I've cultivated perhaps a dozen kinds of tomatoes, and perhaps a dozen kinds of other vegetables, as well as perhaps a dozen kinds of potatoes, and I sampled all of these a number of times.  I confess I didn't analyze these gustatory experiences, though.  I suppose I should have.

[SobaAddict70]

I wasn't actually being serious about finding and eating an ortolan.

On a more serious note, "crazy" is broad. Insects on a stick is probably crazy to you, but to the folks in Beijing, it's actually kinda normal. (I wouldn't eat it either, don't worry.) Conversely, I'm sure there are things we eat they find strange.

[NewFoodie]

 

I wasn't actually being serious about finding and eating an ortolan.

On a more serious note, "crazy" is broad.

 

Yeah, I know; I was just having a little fun myself.  We're "riffing"...

[SobaAddict70]

Someone prepares rather mainstream American non-haute cuisine for me, but in my opinion, she's REALLY good at it.  I don't cook.

Assuming you mean things like fried chicken, pizza and meatloaf, then I might start here: 

; it's Franny's clam pizza at their restaurant in Brooklyn.  It's not haute cuisine, but it's something that a foodie might eat.  According to the vid, the clam pizza is one of the more popular items.

 

Meatloaf elevated to a more refined level could be something like a terrine.  There's a great thread devoted to that topic, here.

 

Korean fried chicken seems to be one of the new foodie trends in recent years.  There's a nice NYT article here:  http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/07/dining/07fried.html?pagewanted=all and a more recent Serious Eats article here:  http://www.seriouseats.com/2012/10/the-food-lab-korean-fried-chicken.html

 

None of those dishes are what I would consider to be "haute cuisine".  For that, consider dining out frequently or asking if your friend could explore more adventurous cooking.

 

[djyee100]

Much good advice here. I can only say, find what you like to eat and appreciate it fully. I feel that's what gourmet means. It's true that traditionally a gourmet is supposed to be interested in exotic foods like foie gras or caviar or expensive wines, but that doesn't have to be so. In my neck of the woods, Alice Waters has made "fresh, local, seasonal"--and simple--as the epitome of good food with a gourmet cachet.

 

My other advice is, find other people who are interested in good food and learn from them. Go out to dinner together and talk about food. Cook a meal together. Years ago, when I had a hobby job assisting cooking classes, I met a couple people who are still my friends today. One is a long-time professional cook, the other is one of the best home cooks I've ever met. We meet regularly for dinner, usually at a restaurant we want to check out, and we happily talk about food, and only food, for hours. We joke that we have to stick together for these dinners because nobody else we know will tolerate a dinner conversation entirely about food.

 

So don't try to do this alone. You haven't mentioned where you're from, except the Northeastern U.S. If you can be more specific about your location, other EGulleters may be able to suggest people or places for your foodie explorations. Have you checked out your local Slow Food group? People there are interested in food in general, and artisanal foods and foraging in particular.

[liuzhou]

 

On a more serious note, "crazy" is broad. Insects on a stick is probably crazy to you, but to the folks in Beijing, it's actually kinda normal. (I wouldn't eat it either, don't worry.) Conversely, I'm sure there are things we eat they find strange.

 

Many Chinese people find the whole concept of cheese to be disgusting. Even those who would accept a bit of mozzarella on a pizza would gag at the thought of a blue cheese or anything particularly strong smelling.

 

I've yet to find anyone here who thinks avocado is edible.

 

I was washing some white button mushrooms once while chatting with a couple of Chinese friends. As is my habit, I selected one of the smaller mushrooms and popped it into my mouth. The two women were aghast and, sure that I would be dead within minutes,  wanted to call an ambulance or a hearse.

 

They simply don't believe me when I describe steak tartare. 

 

And these are the people who serve me stir fried bees, stewed dog, and  roast rat. Not usually simultaneously.

 

P.S. Nothing wrong with insects on sticks.

Edited July 10, 2014 by liuzhou (log)

[quiet1]

Since it sounds like you are really quite new, another avenue for information and ideas might actually be TV. As much as I dislike reality tv in general, I have actually started watching some of the better cooking shows in the house with the housemates' kiddo because of the way the judges discuss the food. It seems to help give the kiddo ideas about what he can be thinking about when he eats things, and when he is deciding what he likes and what he doesn't. It's helping him develop a vocabulary, which in turn helps to figure out where to go next in trying something new. ("I didn't enjoy the texture and felt it needed something crispy" is much more useful in tweaking a dish or teaching him how to tweak it than "it was icky.")

You may not agree with what the judges are saying about something, but you can still learn from how they're assessing it. (With the caveat that I'm sure they have to find problems with this or that dish for production reasons. But they still usually don't say anything totally ridiculous.)

When the kiddo is a bit older, I also plan to introduce some of the Jacques Pepin shows to him - some of them may be a bit dated in terms of food style, but even if you're not interested in cooking yourself, sometimes knowing why a certain skill or another is important gives you another tool for considering the food you're eating. (And also understanding what you're going to get when you order a dish from a menu. )

[NewFoodie]

from SobaAddict70:

 

Assuming you mean things like fried chicken, pizza and meatloaf...

 

Sometimes it's things like that, other times it's:

 

• "Thanksgiving food" (turkey / quail / cornish game hen, stuffing, mashed potatoes with turkey gravy, butternut squash, pumpkin pie, etc.)

 

• pasta-based dishes (such as raviloi or tortellini), which may incorporate:

...• mushrooms (usually porcini or button / portobello)

...• meat (such as beef, pork, or various seafood such as shrimp, scallops, fish, or crab)

...• any of a number of vegetables, such as tomatoes, onions, black and / or green olives, or even asparagus, or artichoke hearts

 

She also uses garlic a lot, including what she jokingly describes as "grubs" (larvae), which are simply carmelized cloves of garlic.

 

She also, in various ways, serves asparagus, avocado, and cucumbers.

 

 ...then I might start here: it's Franny's clam pizza at their restaurant in Brooklyn.

 

 

This clam pizza looks excellent.  I'll show this video to my friend.  I won't be able to sample it at Frannie's restaurant though, because I never go to NYC, even though I live somewhat nearby (near Trenton & Princeton in New Jersey).  That's because of the surreal, nightmarish experiences I've had in NYC, as well as stories I've encountered in the media about what goes on there.

 

from djyee100:

 

Cook a meal together.

 

I've repeatedly offered to be my friend's sous chef, but she'll have none of it.  She prefers to do everything herself.  In fact, she once told me, to my great surprise, that she thought it was "weird" for a man to cook.

 

from liuzhou:

 

Many Chinese people find the whole concept of cheese to be disgusting.

 

I've yet to find anyone here who thinks avocado is edible.

 

As is my habit, I selected one of the smaller mushrooms and popped it into my mouth. The two women were aghast,,,

 

And these are the people who serve me stir fried bees, stewed dog, and  roast rat.

 

 

Cheese is disgusting?  Avocado and mushrooms are inedible?  But stir-fried BEES, stewed DOG, and  roast RAT are edible?!?!  It's very difficult for me to understand such a vast difference in cultural perspective.

 

 from quiet1:

 

...another avenue for information and ideas might actually be TV.

 

I actually most enjoy "Good Eats", which host Alton Brown describes as a mix of Julia Child, Mr. Wizard, and Monty Python.  It's the "food science" aspect of the show that I like.

[cdh]

Do you live somewhere with gourmet shops or supermarkets that give classes?  In Philadelphia, we have Tria, a set of temples to the fermented arts of beer, wine and cheese, which offer classes to introduce folks to the depths of deliciousness in those products.  When I used to live in Austin, TX, the Central Market supermarket had lots of classes in many varieties of food.  If you're in shooting distance of NYC, the De Gustibus classes at Macys are fun, as is the James Beard House.  Tell us where you live beyond vague generalities, and somebody might have similar recommendations for where you are.

[cdh]

Ah, so you're quite local to me then, Princeton being half way between NYC and PHL... Had you eaten at Elements on Bayard St before it closed to move to Witherspoon St?  Have you gone and explored the truly local delicacies of Trenton Tomato Pie at either of the Delorenzos?  Are you as averse to Philadelphia as you are to NYC, or does NY carry some particular scary cachet for you?  How close to urbanity are you comfortable going? Don't want to list a bunch of places for you to try that are all in no-go zones for you.

Edited July 10, 2014 by cdh (log)

[SobaAddict70]

Sometimes it's things like that, other times it's:

 

• "Thanksgiving food" (turkey / quail / cornish game hen, stuffing, mashed potatoes with turkey gravy, butternut squash, pumpkin pie, etc.)

 

• pasta-based dishes (such as raviloi or tortellini), which may incorporate:

...• mushrooms (usually porcini or button / portobello)

...• meat (such as beef, pork, or various seafood such as shrimp, scallops, fish, or crab)

...• any of a number of vegetables, such as tomatoes, onions, black and / or green olives, or even asparagus, or artichoke hearts

 

There are "foodie"/gourmet versions of all of these dishes.

Mashed potatoes for example can be colcannon (an Irish dish with potatoes with cabbage (and/or leeks) and lots of butter), stamppot (the Dutch version of colcannon), pure di patate (Italian, puréed potatoes with butter and cream, occasionally Parmigiano-Reggiano cheese). The haute cuisine version of mashed potatoes could be something like purée blanche -- contains potatoes and things like parsnips and celeriac, or pommes dauphine (basically mashed potatoes mixed with choux pastry and deep-fried).

 

This clam pizza looks excellent.  I'll show this video to my friend.  I won't be able to sample it at Frannie's restaurant though, because I never go to NYC, even though I live somewhat nearby (near Trenton & Princeton in New Jersey).  That's because of the surreal, nightmarish experiences I've had in NYC, as well as stories I've encountered in the media about what goes on there.

I've lived in NYC for 25+ years.

The City's changed a lot in the interim -- from a dystopian post-apocalyptic war zone with abandoned buildings (anyone who's lived in the East Village in the late '80s might identify with that description) to a playground for the 1%. It's not for everyone, and it's hardly boring. But I hear you.

 

 

I've repeatedly offered to be my friend's sous chef, but she'll have none of it.  She prefers to do everything herself.  In fact, she once told me, to my great surprise, that she thought it was "weird" for a man to cook.

News to me.

 

 

 

Cheese is disgusting?  Avocado and mushrooms are inedible?  But stir-fried BEES, stewed DOG, and  roast RAT are edible?!?!  It's very difficult for me to understand such a vast difference in cultural perspective.

Liuzhou can tell you more, but a couple of things...

* China has approx. 25% of the world's population and 10% of the planet's arable land. Their society has learned to squeeze every available edible bit out of anything imaginable and put it to good use.

* Cheese/dairy has not, historically, been a part of the Chinese diet in the same way that it is for many other Western cultures for many reasons -- like for instance, that arable land bit. This Wiki article goes into more detail: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Chinese_cuisine . To understand why a culture eats the way it does, you might have to look into its past.