Timing your cooking

[Nick]

I just checked in at the Recommend a Book thread and saw the baker's recommendation for a book on timing cooking. That got me to thinking (a dangerous preoccupation of mine).

Do you always, often, never - time your cooking? The only thing I time is a boiled egg. Six minutes.

[Jinmyo]

Nickn, try this for hard-cooked eggs. Bring to a good boil, remove from heat, let sit for ten minutes.

[Sandra Levine]

I set the timer as a reminder, but always use my judgement once the dinger rings and sometimes before if it smells right.

[Shermar]

I set the timer for half of the suggested time. Then I re-set the timer according to how the dish is going.

[Nick]

Nickn, try this for hard-cooked eggs. Bring to a good boil, remove from heat, let sit for ten minutes.

I don't want to turn this into a boiled egg thread, but outside of using them in a few dishes calling for hard-boiled egg, their use I want to learn most about is pickled eggs. Got a recipe? That will give me an excuse to try your ten minute suggestion.

Edit: Let's keep this to timing cooking. Maybe I'll start a separate thread on pickled eggs.

Edited January 4, 2003 by Nickn (log)

[Anna N]

I just checked in at the Recommend a Book   thread and saw the baker's recommendation for a book on timing cooking. That got me to thinking (a dangerous preoccupation of mine).

Do you always, often, never -  time your cooking? The only thing I time is a boiled egg. Six minutes.

This book recommendation really caught my eye simply because when I need to change or substitute an ingredient I have no real idea how to alter the cooking time. It might also answer another cooking question I asked on another thread - how to adjust times so that things cook longer or shorter to enable a whole meal to be done in the oven.

Actually, this link could be my downfall since I check out most of the links and then want to buy not only the recommended book but half a dozen others that Amazon offers to sell me!

[nightscotsman]

Because I do a lot of baking I always time everything, though I usually just watch the clock rather than set a timer. Start checking progress 1/2 to 3/4 of the way through. And yes, I use the bring to boil, 10 minutes off the heat "recipe" for boiled eggs.

[Oreganought]

On a busy night I will use a timer for a reminder and use it as a pivoting point,or if I have items in the oven I tend to forget like,croutons or pastry of sorts.A preliminarily vaque assesment of the timer.Never use it verbatim,but it

does come in handy on occation.

[torakris]

I set the timer as a reminder, but always use my judgement once the dinger rings and sometimes before if it smells right.

Ditto

I have found that if I don't set a timer I can forget about the food.

Just a little while ago I forgot about a lunch I was going to heat up in the microwave. I discovered it when I went to make dinner, the microwave had never been started!

[Matt Seeber]

for me, timers are good as reminders that something is in the works, lest i forget about it.

for a doneness check, i'll go by taste, sight, smell, touch / feel (and an occasional guess)

i do recall one new years eve with rack of veal for 100 people. i was using two timers and a meat thermometer (insurance)!

[Cyn-bluefrog]

All right, maybe this is going to sound really anal-retentive, but for large complicated meals (several courses/dishes in which timing is essential), I draw out a timeline. My friend told me it's very similar to what his project manager does to track project progress. I made a graph in 15 minute increments and put everything I needed to do and how long it would take so that everything (for the course) was done at the same time. I find it also helps me think about the recipes (or other concoctions). The only thing I forgot to add was plating time. For some dishes it was important, for others it wasn't.

However, I don't do it this formally for everything because it would drive me crazy; however I do make small mental notes like, "I have to put this in the oven in 15 minutes because it will take a hour for the sauce to reduce and this will take 45 minutes."

[Suzanne F]

All right, maybe this is going to sound really anal-retentive, but for large complicated meals (several courses/dishes in which timing is essential), I draw out a timeline.  My friend told me it's very similar to what his project manager does to track project progress.

Hey, sound great to me! I'm a big fan of Critical Path Method in the kitchen -- that's the basis of how I've written my recipes for work.

[Sandra Levine]

I'm a big fan of Critical Path Method in the kitchen -- that's the basis of how I've written my recipes for work.

Could you elaborate, Suzanne? What is Critical Path Method?

[Cyn-bluefrog]

Critical Path Method. Cool, I like that. I have a Master's in Industrial Psych, but I never made that connection before. Thank you so much.

Info about the critical path can be found here here. They refer to it as the "P.E.R.T." method, but I think I did more like a Gantt chart. An explaination of that can be found here. I think I might try the other one in my next large meal, but only because it takes into account variances, which sometimes I cannot predict, much to my dismay.

[Suzanne F]

Not to get too far off-topic, but you asked:

Critical Path Method (CPM) is a slightly simpler version of Program Evaluation and Review Technique (PERT), and Gantt charts are simpler still. Basically, you break down the project (whatever it is you need to accomplish -- building a rocket, renovating Yankee Stadium, cooking a multi-course meal) into discrete tasks, and the tasks into steps. You determine how long it should take for each step of each task. You also determine which tasks must be completed before you can go on to others, and which can be worked on simultaneously. When you plot the whole thing out (on paper or in a computer program), you get a clear picture of the order and interrelationships of all the pieces of a complicated job, and how long the project should take. So you can work backwards and say, If I want to serve dinner at 8pm, and I need 1 hour to prep and 3 hours to cook the main course, but I can make the dessert and salad while the main course is in the oven, then I have to do all my marketing before 3pm in order to get home in time to ... You get the idea? PERT uses three time estimates for each part; CPM and Gannt charts only require one.

The way I apply it is to break down every part of the dish into the smallest possible step, and then list the steps in the most efficient order. For example, if the mashed potato rosettes have to be frozen solid before they can be placed on top of the cooled stew, the FIRST things you have to do are wash, peel, and weigh out the peeled potatoes, then get them cooking. You can then start of prepping for the stew while the potatoes cook. A lot of people wouldn't think that, unless they realize how long it takes to make, form, and freeze the rosettes -- you start first on the overall task that takes the longest. Does that make sense to you?

[Sandra Levine]

I do this all the time. I didn't know it had a name. I feel like Moliere's Bourgeois Gentilhomme, who was surprised to learn that he had been speaking prose his whole life.

[Really Nice!]

Suzanne has it right on. A couple of additional things I do (have done) include:

Plating. Draw a circle on the sheet and do a quick sketch as to what goes where, unless I'm doing the standard protein at 6 O'clock, veg at 10, starch at 2.

Reverse engineering. As previously stated, after developing the timetable, start from the time you serve it and plot backwards. I found that giving an extra five minutes for plating and a five minutes buffer (what can go wrong, will) at the end helps.

MEP (Mis en Place). Write down the equipment you're going to need and have it out before you start. One thing you can do is throw the utensils that you'll need into a pot that you won't be using for the meal. This will keep your work space organized. Another thing to do is set up the kitchen before leaving for work in the morning. This means all the utensils in the pot (I use a bain marie), cutting boards on the counter, pots/skillets on the stove, non refrigerated/frozen ingredients on the counter. This shaves about 15-30 minutes off your prep time.

Back in November at my house, a group of us did a French Laundromat dinner using recipes from the cookbook. Photos are on Pbase. There were four cooks and 13 dishes. Since everyone did the initial preparation at their house, I put together an equipment MEP list for when the time came to do the dish and taped it above the stove. It looked something like this:

Menu Item:

1. Salmon Tartar

2. Cauliflower “Panna Cotta”

3. White Truffle Oil—Infused Custard

4. Blini with Roasted Sweet Peppers

5. Carrot Soup with Cream*

6. Whole Roasted Moulard Duck Foie Gras

7. Chestnut Agnolotti

8. Salmon “Chops”

9. Butter Poached Maine Lobster

10. Yabba Dabba Do

11. Chaource with Red Plums

12. Coffee and Doughnuts

13. Lemon Sabayon

Sorry about the column alignment.

Dish                                                        Owner                        Oven                        Stove                       Other Items
Salmon Tartar                                           Mike                            --                              --                                  --
Cauliflower “Panna Cotta”                       Margaret                         --                          med. SP                   FP / CH / SMB
White Truffle Oil—Infused Custard             Simon          275°F 25 min & 45 min       med. SP / med. SP          M / S / EC / BL / CH / GBP
Blini with Roasted Sweet Peppers               Paul                           350°F                     Large SP                    T /  EG 
Carrot Soup with Cream                            Mike                             --                             HP                              J
Whole Roasted Duck Foie Gras                  Mike                         475°F  /  SP                  SK                             --
Chestnut Agnolotti                                    Simon                               --                           LP                           --
Salmon “Chops”                                      Mike                                 --                    SP / SK / SP /                 M 
Butter Poached Lobster                             Paul                         300°F 50 min                    --                       M / CB /  S / FP
Yabba Dabba Do                                       Paul                          450°F /                  Small SP                    M / CB 
Chaource with Red Plums                       Margaret                            --                            --                         2RM
Coffee and Doughnuts                             Mike                               --                           --                       DF
Lemon Sabayon                                     Simon                                --                         --                        MX

Things that the cookbook says can be prepared 24 hours or more in advance are not shown.
SP = Sauce Pan
SK = Skillet
LP = Large Pot
FP = Food Processor
CH = Chinois
SMB = Small Metal Bowl
M = Mandolin
S = Silpat
EC = Egg Cutter
BL = Blender
GBP = Glass Baking Pan
T = Tamis
EG = Electric Griddle
J = Juicer
HP = Pan in Bain Marie
CB = Clarified Butter
2RM = 2-inch Ring Mold
DF = Deep Fryer
MX = Mixer

* This recipe isn't in the cookbook. I got it from his series of LA Times columns back in 2000/2001.

So yes, timing is everything. It's a great book to have when, for example, all you want to do is cook a rack of lamb without looking through twenty cookbooks to find out how long you need to cook it. Timing is Everything.

Edited January 7, 2003 by Really Nice! (log)

[col klink]

For elaborate meals, I'll plan things out but rarely do I use a timer except to remind me to check the fire every once in a while. Since mostly what I cook is meat, I go by temperature, not time.

[=Mark]

Great. Supply Chain Management for the kitchen...

[nightscotsman]

Dish                                                        Owner                        Oven                        Stove                       Other Items
Salmon Tartar                                           Mike                            --                              --                                  --
Cauliflower “Panna Cotta”                       Margaret                         --                          med. SP                   FP / CH / SMB
White Truffle Oil—Infused Custard             Simon          275°F 25 min & 45 min       med. SP / med. SP          M / S / EC / BL / CH / GBP
Blini with Roasted Sweet Peppers               Paul                           350°F                     Large SP                    T /  EG 
Carrot Soup with Cream                            Mike                             --                             HP                              J
Whole Roasted Duck Foie Gras                  Mike                         475°F  /  SP                  SK                             --
Chestnut Agnolotti                                    Simon                               --                           LP                           --
Salmon “Chops”                                      Mike                                 --                    SP / SK / SP /                 M 
Butter Poached Lobster                             Paul                         300°F 50 min                    --                       M / CB /  S / FP
Yabba Dabba Do                                       Paul                          450°F /                  Small SP                    M / CB 
Chaource with Red Plums                       Margaret                            --                            --                         2RM
Coffee and Doughnuts                             Mike                               --                           --                       DF
Lemon Sabayon                                     Simon                                --                         --                        MX

Things that the cookbook says can be prepared 24 hours or more in advance are not shown.
SP = Sauce Pan
SK = Skillet
LP = Large Pot
FP = Food Processor
CH = Chinois
SMB = Small Metal Bowl
M = Mandolin
S = Silpat
EC = Egg Cutter
BL = Blender
GBP = Glass Baking Pan
T = Tamis
EG = Electric Griddle
J = Juicer
HP = Pan in Bain Marie
CB = Clarified Butter
2RM = 2-inch Ring Mold
DF = Deep Fryer
MX = Mixer

* This recipe isn't in the cookbook. I got it from his series of LA Times columns back in 2000/2001.

I stand in awe. I want to cook (and eat!) at your house.