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eje

Stomping Through the "Savoy" (2007–2008)

551 posts in this topic

Hey Erik,,

I read your erlier post on Cognacs and Brandy. I also have been on the quest to find Cognacs and brandies that really work for me.

Martell Cordon Blue Makes one of the Best stingers ( from Imbibe Dave Wondrich with dashes of absinthe and all)

Masion Surrenne Pettit Champagne love this for sipping or cocktails

Daniel Boujou Premier aromes 90 proof one of the most fuity congacs fantastic!

Daniel Boujou brut de fut royal 120 proof this cognac blows me away it is so intense makes for a great brandy punch again ( from Dave Wondrich Imbibe)

Charles Neil selection Armagnacs very impresive.

F. Paul Pacult reveiws Camus Vs and Frapin Vs as being very good and I agree.

I also really like A. Hardy Vs

Love Loius Royer force 53 for cocktails only not so nice for sipping.

again me butting in with some of my opinions :wink:

best regards

Kev

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Hey Erik,,

I read your erlier post on Cognacs and Brandy.  I also have been on the quest to find Cognacs and brandies that really work for me.

[...]

A couple spirits geeks and bartenders have recommended to me Dudognon Cognac Reserve. The price is on the high side for me (pesky exchange rates) at around $56, so I went with the Osocalis Brandy this time instead.

Next time I may have to break down and give it a try... I've heard it makes an excellent Japanese Cocktail.


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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Hey Erik,,

I read your erlier post on Cognacs and Brandy.  I also have been on the quest to find Cognacs and brandies that really work for me.

I think a lot of us are on this quest. And, for most of us I imagine, price is a factor as well. As always, PerfumeKev's suggestions really peaked my interest, so I thought I'd try to find out how much these things cost. Having done this, I figured I'd share the results. These are just ballpark figures from cursory Googling:

Martell Cordon Bleu ~$100

Maison Surrenne Petite Champagne ~$35

Daniel Bouju Premiers Aromes ~$50

Daniel Bouju Royal Brut du Fut ~$60

Charles Neal Selections Armagnacs ~$100

Camus VS ~$25

Frapin VS ~$40

A. Hardy VS ~$25

Louis Royer Force 53 ~$45

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The advantage of the high proof cognacs (in the $60-$45 range) is that you don't need to use as much of it.


Samuel Lloyd Kinsey

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haven't seen one of those congacs in a PA liquor store. so sad. $35 is about my limit for a mixing base spirit, so i really struggle with finding brandies that i'm satisfied with. right now chalfonte vsop is all i can find in this price range.

question: why isn't there any reasonably priced american brandies that i'm satified with? why can't california make a good congac-like brandy? they make great, inexpensive wine.

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I'm still experimenting with it in cocktails, but the Osocalis Brandy makes a pretty darn interesting Sazerac. Chewy.


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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Income Tax Cocktail

1 Dash Angostura Bitters.

The Juice of 1/4 Orange. (1/4 quarter valencia orange squeezed right over the tin)

1/4 French Vermouth. (3/4 oz Dolin Dry Vermouth)

1/4 Italian Vermouth. (3/4 oz Carpano Antica Vermouth)

1/2 Dry Gin. (1 1/2 oz Broker's Dry Gin)

Shake (haha, stir!) well and strain into cocktail glass. (Orange Peel.)

I know I sometimes bang on about the Brooklyn* variations as the cocktails in the Savoy which I am most tired of. But this was really good. A nice stiff gin, a beautiful fresh valencia orange, generous portion of bitters, decent dry and sweet vermouth.

When this cocktail is good, it is hard to beat!

*This should say "bang on about the Bronx variations". How embarrassing. The Brooklyn is a lovely drink all of it's own with Whiskey, Vermouth, Maraschino, and Amer Picon. No Orange Juice involved.


Edited by eje (log)

---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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I know I sometimes bang on about the Brooklyn variations as the cocktails in the Savoy which I am most tired of.  But this was really good.  A nice stiff gin, a beautiful fresh valencia orange, generous portion of bitters, decent dry and sweet vermouth.

I think there may be some borough confusion. Isn't the Income Tax cocktail a variation on the Bronx, and not the Brooklyn?


Samuel Lloyd Kinsey

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I know I sometimes bang on about the Brooklyn variations as the cocktails in the Savoy which I am most tired of.  But this was really good.  A nice stiff gin, a beautiful fresh valencia orange, generous portion of bitters, decent dry and sweet vermouth.

I think there may be some borough confusion. Isn't the Income Tax cocktail a variation on the Bronx, and not the Brooklyn?

Ack! You are, of course, correct sir! How embarrassing!


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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Inca Cocktail

1 Dash Orgeat Syrup. (1/3 tsp homemade)

1 Dash Orange Bitters. (dash Fee's, Dash Regan's Orange Bitters)

1/4 Gin. (3/4 oz Junipero Gin)

1/4 Sherry. (3/4 oz Bodega Dios Baco Fino Sherry)

1/4 French Vermouth. (3/4 oz Dolin Dry Vermouth)

1/4 Italian Vermouth. (3/4 oz Carpano Antica Vermouth)

Shake (stir, please) well and strain into cocktail glass. (Orange Peel.)

Apparently, I am crazy for liking this cocktail. I tried it a while ago for myself and thought it a really cool puzzle of tastes. I gave one to Mrs. eje to try. Interestingly, her first impression was that it was a whiskey cocktail, but she also liked it.

Then I sent the recipe to a few friends. Crickets. I sent the recipe to some bartenders I know. The silence was deafening.

I made it again a couple other times, including tonight, and still think it rocks.

I do have to say I over-squooshed my almonds when making the orgeat, thus the kind of dottiness to the almond oils and solids in the cold cocktail. Still tasty despite the somewhat unappealing appearance.

Robert Vermeire tells us, "This cocktail was invented by H.C. Harrison, who supervises the American Bars of the Gordon Hotels in England."


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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Inca Cocktail

1 Dash Orgeat Syrup. (1/3 tsp homemade)

1 Dash Orange Bitters. (dash Fee's, Dash Regan's Orange Bitters)

1/4 Gin. (3/4 oz Junipero Gin)

1/4 Sherry. (3/4 oz Bodega Dios Baco Fino Sherry)

1/4 French Vermouth. (3/4 oz Dolin Dry Vermouth)

1/4 Italian Vermouth. (3/4 oz Carpano Antica Vermouth)

Shake (stir, please) well and strain into cocktail glass.  (Orange Peel.)

Apparently, I am crazy for liking this cocktail.  I tried it a while ago for myself and thought it a really cool puzzle of tastes.  I gave one to Mrs. eje to try.  Interestingly, her first impression was that it was a whiskey cocktail, but she also liked it.

Then I sent the recipe to a few friends.  Crickets.  I sent the recipe to some bartenders I know.  The silence was deafening.

I made it again a couple other times, including tonight, and still think it rocks.

I do have to say I over-squooshed my almonds when making the orgeat, thus the kind of dottiness to the almond oils and solids in the cold cocktail.  Still tasty despite the somewhat unappealing appearance.

Robert Vermeire tells us, "This cocktail was invented by H.C. Harrison, who supervises the American Bars of the Gordon Hotels in England."

that is a high maintenance drink to construct but it looks like my style... it could kick off some introspective contemplation... a companion for heavy reading, or is it simpler than it seems?


abstract expressionist beverage compounder

creator of acquired tastes

bostonapothecary.com

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that is a high maintenance drink to construct but it looks like my style... it could kick off some introspective contemplation... a companion for heavy reading, or is it simpler than it seems?

It almost has enough ingredients to be a tiki drink.... But now that I mention that, it is a bit like the Fog Cutter, is it not?

If you used Rum and Cognac in place of the vermouths. And orange juice in place of the orange bitters (Trader Vic was bitters-phobic, anyway...)


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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The only references I can google for Ichbien are drink recipes.

"Ich" of course being "I" in Germain.

"Bien" being something like "good" in French?

It could be mis-spelled, I suppose...

My first guess as far as misspelling would be "Ich dien," which appears on the crest of the Prince of Wales - German for "I serve." The Prince of Wales cocktail does have brandy and curacao, so maybe this started out as a variant?

"Tea and cake or death! Tea and cake or death! Little Red Cookbook! Little Red Cookbook!" --Eddie Izzard

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Ink Street Cocktail

1/3 Canadian Club Whisky. (3/4 oz 40 Creek Barrel Select, 1/4 oz Buffalo Trace Bourbon)

1/3 Orange Juice. (1 oz fresh valencia Orange Juice)

1/3 Lemon Juice. (1 oz fresh Lemon Juice)

Shake well then strain into cocktail glass.

Taking perfumekev's advice to heart, I did a little on-the-fly blending, in an attempt to juice up the 40 creek.

Definitely seems to lend a bit more character in the drink, to the point where I can actually taste the whisk(e)y, which probably wouldn't have been the case with just the 40 Creek.

In regards the drink, 3 oz is a little large. Where 2 1/4 to 2 1/2 oz would have been a bracing tonic that you could throw back in a single go, at 3 oz, the Ink Street gets a bit sour by the end.


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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My first guess as far as misspelling would be "Ich dien," which appears on the crest of the Prince of Wales - German for "I serve."  The Prince of Wales cocktail does have brandy and curacao, so maybe this started out as a variant?

Wow, great deduction! I like that idea hannhah.

I do see "Ich Bein" on some german websites. I'm assuming it's sort of a contraction of "Ich Bin Ein", but can't really tell, my german is so rusty.

In the case of the "Knickerbein", apparently that means something like "Bent Knee".

Interestingly, also the name of one of the early German models of radar, but that wasn't until well after Leo Engel included the Knickerbein in his "American and Other Drinks".

I'm actually a bit disappointed that Craddock didn't include the Knickerbein in the Savoy Cocktail Book. I may have to do a bit of extracurricular drink making, it sounds so interesting and fun.


Edited by eje (log)

---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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Bein = "leg."

Knicken = "to break."

I suppose that makes Knickerbein something like "breaking leg" or "buckling leg" or even "crooked leg." (I assume this is a misspelling of knickebein.)


Edited by slkinsey (log)

Samuel Lloyd Kinsey

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I do see "Ich Bein" on some german websites.  I'm assuming it's sort of a contraction of "Ich Bin Ein", but can't really tell, my german is so rusty.

That looks about right, but doesn't make much sense as far as a name, unless they happened to be making it for a German customer who'd wandered in one day. :laugh:

"Tea and cake or death! Tea and cake or death! Little Red Cookbook! Little Red Cookbook!" --Eddie Izzard

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Irish Cocktail

2 Dashes Absinthe. (2/3 tsp. Marteau Verte Classique Absinthe)

2 Dashes Curacao. (2/3 tsp. Luxardo Triplum)

1 Dash Maraschino. (1/3 tsp. Luxardo Maraschino)

1 dash Angostura Bitters.

1/2 Glass Irish Whisky. (1 oz Redbreast Irish Whiskey)

Shake well (stir, please) and strain into cocktail glass. Add olive and squeeze orange peel on top.

Well, I was very tempted to double the whiskey in this one, but I restrained myself, and put it in my tiniest glass.

Pretty much an "Improved Irish Whiskey Cocktail". To me, the portion of Absinthe seems a bit large for the small amount of Whiskey in this particular cocktail. Washing the glass with, or a single dash of, Absinthe would probably be plenty. And at that point, you'd have a very tasty cocktail indeed.


Edited by eje (log)

---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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Bein = "leg."

Knicken = "to break."

I suppose that makes Knickerbein something like "breaking leg" or "buckling leg" or even "crooked leg."  (I assume this is a misspelling of knickebein.)

Yes, I am embarrassed to admit the Engel's drink is indeed called the "Knickebein", not the "Knickerbein".

I'm almost as bad as Harry Craddock, with the typos!


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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Bein = "leg."

Knicken = "to break."

I suppose that makes Knickerbein something like "breaking leg" or "buckling leg" or even "crooked leg."  (I assume this is a misspelling of knickebein.)

Yes, I am embarrassed to admit the Engel's drink is indeed called the "Knickebein", not the "Knickerbein".

I'm almost as bad as Harry Craddock, with the typos!

engel's drink is really cool... my brother comes to the restaurant and challenges me to make it while i'm really busy... everyone else wonders what the hell is going on...


abstract expressionist beverage compounder

creator of acquired tastes

bostonapothecary.com

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Jabberwock Cocktail*

2 Dashes Orange Bitters.

1/3 Dry Gin.

1/3 Dry Sherry.

1/3 Caperitif.

Stir well and strain into cocktail glass. Squeeze lemon peel on top.

* This will made you gyre and gamble in the wabe until brillig all right, all right.

Right well, Vorpal Sword at ready, I tried this apparently Lewis Carrol inspired cocktail a couple ways. First using the cocktaildb suggested Caperitif substitution Lillet Blanc:

1 Dash Fee's Orange; 1 Dash Regan's Orange; 1 Dash Angostura; 1 oz Beefeater Gin; 1 oz Bodega Dios Baco Fino Sherry; 1 oz Lillet Blanc; Stir, Strain, Orange Peel.

Nope, no thank you. Next:

1 Dash Fee's Orange; 1 Dash Regan's Orange; 1 oz Broker's Gin; 1 oz Bodega Dios Baco Fino Sherry; 1 oz sadly ancient, tired, and nearly empty Cocchi Americano; Stir, Strain, Orange Peel.

I don't know if I'd go so far as to say, "O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!" but, much better, anyway. Dammit! Anyone made any progress on a Kina Lillet replica?

I'm thinking some portion of: quinine tincture, cinnamon tincture, orange tincture, brandy, and muscat cannelli for the wine base. It's probably not that simple, but that, at least, is a start.


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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Dammit!  Anyone made any progress on a Kina Lillet replica?

I'm thinking some portion of: quinine tincture, cinnamon tincture, orange tincture, brandy, and muscat cannelli for the wine base.  It's probably not that simple, but that, at least, is a start.

To the best of my knowledge, if you're going for maximum authenticity you'd use Armagnac for the fortifier and some presumably inexpensive White Bordeaux for the wine base, though I would imagine not an entirely dry one...maybe a Premieres Cotes du Bordeaux Blanc? I think Muscat Canelli would be too floral, you'd want something relatively neutral I think.


Andy Arrington

Journeyman Drinksmith

Twitter--@LoneStarBarman

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Dammit!  Anyone made any progress on a Kina Lillet replica?

I'm thinking some portion of: quinine tincture, cinnamon tincture, orange tincture, brandy, and muscat cannelli for the wine base.  It's probably not that simple, but that, at least, is a start.

To the best of my knowledge, if you're going for maximum authenticity you'd use Armagnac for the fortifier and some presumably inexpensive White Bordeaux for the wine base, though I would imagine not an entirely dry one...maybe a Premieres Cotes du Bordeaux Blanc? I think Muscat Canelli would be too floral, you'd want something relatively neutral I think.

sauternes and armagnac? i saw some haut charmes sauternes on sale. i should probably own a bottle of armagnac... i'll give it a try.


abstract expressionist beverage compounder

creator of acquired tastes

bostonapothecary.com

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Dammit!  Anyone made any progress on a Kina Lillet replica?

I'm thinking some portion of: quinine tincture, cinnamon tincture, orange tincture, brandy, and muscat cannelli for the wine base.  It's probably not that simple, but that, at least, is a start.

To the best of my knowledge, if you're going for maximum authenticity you'd use Armagnac for the fortifier and some presumably inexpensive White Bordeaux for the wine base, though I would imagine not an entirely dry one...maybe a Premieres Cotes du Bordeaux Blanc? I think Muscat Canelli would be too floral, you'd want something relatively neutral I think.

sauternes and armagnac? i saw some haut charmes sauternes on sale. i should probably own a bottle of armagnac... i'll give it a try.

I seem to recall reading that there was in fact a Sauternes Lillet (as opposed to 'Kina') made at one point, but it never really took off to the same extent. I don't think you'd want to use a botrytised wine in your Lillet replica, but maybe something naturally off-dry like so much inexpensive Bdx Blanc can be.

Not that it wouldn't be delicious, I just can't see it being appropriate in the same applications.


Andy Arrington

Journeyman Drinksmith

Twitter--@LoneStarBarman

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[...]

Imperial Cocktail

1 Dash Maraschino. (1/3 tsp. Luxardo Maraschino)

1 Dash Angostura Bitters.

1/2 French Vermouth. (1 1/2 oz Dolin Dry Vermouth)

1/2 Dry Gin. (1 1/2 oz Junipero Vermouth)

   

Stir well and serve with olive.

Another cool and tasty Dry Martini variation.  Yum!

Kind of a Dry Vermouth version of the Martinez.  Who can complain about that?

Uh, that is supposed to say Junipero Gin, not "Vermouth"!

I am as bad as Harry Craddock!


---

Erik Ellestad

If the ocean was whiskey and I was a duck...

Bernal Heights, SF, CA

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