Jump to content
  • Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create a free account.

Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques & Equipment, 2012


rotuts
 Share

Recommended Posts

I just finished constructing my sous vide rig and set it to autotune. It's powering a hotplate and a pot right now. For my casing, I used a $4 plastic bucket from Home Depot and I built the outlets and pid into the lid. There is enough room in the bucket to store the cords and everything. I still need to figure out venting system for the ssr w/ heat sink. I don't want to cut vents in the side of the bucket if I can avoid it. I'll take and post pics once I get my workbench a little tidier. Still have to figure out a way to rig up the water pump, too.

I also want to thank marco and richie over at lightobject because their kind help was very important.

For all those building their own sv rigs, I suggest using a stranded conductor. I used a 14 gauge solid conductor, and it was so stiff, that it was a little tricky to assemble.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

After 12 hours, the belly came out nice but it wasn't a great piece to begin with. I made it into rilettes. The shoulder did not come out good. I am not blaming the method as it is, but the bad butchering (somebody else bought it for me) and that there was a hole at the seal, and there was water inside. I resealed it with some duck fat but it ended up a bit dry. I will probably use it as a base for something else.

Wings are in @ 60c till tomorrow

Now any recommendations for a rolled lamb breast? I've done 85@12h 72@24h, both good but maybe for something closer to medium?

Also a recommendation for lambs heart would be great!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just finished constructing my sous vide rig and set it to autotune. It's powering a hotplate and a pot right now. For my casing, I used a $4 plastic bucket from Home Depot and I built the outlets and pid into the lid. There is enough room in the bucket to store the cords and everything. I still need to figure out venting system for the ssr w/ heat sink. I don't want to cut vents in the side of the bucket if I can avoid it. I'll take and post pics once I get my workbench a little tidier. Still have to figure out a way to rig up the water pump, too.

I also want to thank marco and richie over at lightobject because their kind help was very important.

For all those building their own sv rigs, I suggest using a stranded conductor. I used a 14 gauge solid conductor, and it was so stiff, that it was a little tricky to assemble.

Cut a hole in the lid and mount the heat sink for the ssr in that hole. That is all it takes.

Paul Eggermann

Vice President, Secretary and webmaster

Les Marmitons of New Jersey

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is an idea I posted a few pages back that several of you helped me get some ideas on how to execute. This is my Surf & Turf.

Top Left: The patients, one prime ribeye, and one cape U10 cape scallop

Top right: Surgery complete, the knob of fat under the rib cap was removed and replaced with the trimmed scallop, glued in with Activa RM.

Bottom Left: I knew the scallop and steak had different ideal times/temps, so I went with setting the bath hotter than my final temp to make sure the steak got to temp while the scallop didn't spend too long in the bag. Calculation showed that about 40 minutes in a 56C bath would hit a core temp of 52C. Seasoned simply with salt and pepper and seared in a cast iron pan.

Bottom Right: Science! The scallop had just the right consistency to stand in for the Ribeye fat, and brought that nice briny sweetness that scallops have.

All in all I'll call it a win and something I'd try again.

Surf and Turf.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I personally would be cautious about this unless you have sterilized the outer surface of the meat before making the incision since you aren't pasteurizing the meat.

When you make the incision, you will be making the interior non-sterile. So, when you cook you are going to be incubating any pathogens that managed to migrate with the cut -- and they won't be killed during searing.

So, unless this is beef that you would be comfortable eating raw and serving raw, you might want to consider sterilizing the outer surface of the meat prior to cutting it open. And, these should be scallops that you could eat raw, also since the surface of scallop's is also not going to be cooked enough to kill any pathogens on its surface.

Best,

E

This is an idea I posted a few pages back that several of you helped me get some ideas on how to execute. This is my Surf & Turf.

Top Left: The patients, one prime ribeye, and one cape U10 cape scallop

Top right: Surgery complete, the knob of fat under the rib cap was removed and replaced with the trimmed scallop, glued in with Activa RM.

Bottom Left: I knew the scallop and steak had different ideal times/temps, so I went with setting the bath hotter than my final temp to make sure the steak got to temp while the scallop didn't spend too long in the bag. Calculation showed that about 40 minutes in a 56C bath would hit a core temp of 52C. Seasoned simply with salt and pepper and seared in a cast iron pan.

Bottom Right: Science! The scallop had just the right consistency to stand in for the Ribeye fat, and brought that nice briny sweetness that scallops have.

All in all I'll call it a win and something I'd try again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ooh, good point E. Luckily these particular pieces were top quality and from a butcher and fishmonger I trust, but in the future I'll definitely remember to give the area a pass with the torch to be sure.

I personally would be cautious about this unless you have sterilized the outer surface of the meat before making the incision since you aren't pasteurizing the meat.

When you make the incision, you will be making the interior non-sterile. So, when you cook you are going to be incubating any pathogens that managed to migrate with the cut -- and they won't be killed during searing.

So, unless this is beef that you would be comfortable eating raw and serving raw, you might want to consider sterilizing the outer surface of the meat prior to cutting it open. And, these should be scallops that you could eat raw, also since the surface of scallop's is also not going to be cooked enough to kill any pathogens on its surface.

Best,

E

This is an idea I posted a few pages back that several of you helped me get some ideas on how to execute. This is my Surf & Turf.

Top Left: The patients, one prime ribeye, and one cape U10 cape scallop

Top right: Surgery complete, the knob of fat under the rib cap was removed and replaced with the trimmed scallop, glued in with Activa RM.

Bottom Left: I knew the scallop and steak had different ideal times/temps, so I went with setting the bath hotter than my final temp to make sure the steak got to temp while the scallop didn't spend too long in the bag. Calculation showed that about 40 minutes in a 56C bath would hit a core temp of 52C. Seasoned simply with salt and pepper and seared in a cast iron pan.

Bottom Right: Science! The scallop had just the right consistency to stand in for the Ribeye fat, and brought that nice briny sweetness that scallops have.

All in all I'll call it a win and something I'd try again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont know what veal shoulder tenders are. Would you be willing to post a pre and post pic with your times and temps?

They are veal shoulder steaks. I'm trying to ascertain what temp. and how long to cook veal- how does it compare to beef?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont know what veal shoulder tenders are. Would you be willing to post a pre and post pic with your times and temps?

They are veal shoulder steaks. I'm trying to ascertain what temp. and how long to cook veal- how does it compare to beef?

I would use 55C for 4 hours. This is a tender cut and much like beef shoulder which is cooked at 55C for 4-10 hours.

Paul Eggermann

Vice President, Secretary and webmaster

Les Marmitons of New Jersey

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've not SV'd veal, so take this FWIW (0!), but although I am a fan of veal, it tends to be a little squishy to start with, so I'd be very wary of long cook times. Of course, if you have several and are available, you should be able to fairly easily do a 12,8,4 and 2 hour version and to direct comparisons. It would be an interesting experiment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Very interesting points. I no longer eat veal, just a personal decision.

but i used to love it, especially when I got it in the Old Boston North End.

Its young. Its tender. SV helps you out with connective tissue, without drying out the muscle itself.

If you were to grill these at high temp, rare lets say, and enjoy the result, I think SV might not help you too much: it will still take some time for the connective tissue to melt. By that time the meat might be 'mealy'

The meat itself probably has not had time to get 'tough' : inner connective tissue. Im guessing SV might not work well for veal.

Not that this confirms this but Baldwin does not have tables for veal.

Id go will the traditional grill or hot pan which you would carefully finish in the oven.

Looking forward to your results!

by reference: Ive usually over SV'd small tender legs of lamb that i've boned out. I bet it can be done, just not by me.

Edited by rotuts (log)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

We pretty much only have veal (<10 months) or "añojo" (<18 months) in Spain butcher's. No beef. And for sure sous-vide works wonders with tough cuts of veal such as tail or cheeks. I cannot compare with beef, but for example I have tried the same times (100 h @ 60ºC) with both oxtail and "añojo" tail and both were excellent. Also have used the same times and temperatures for veal cheeks or shanks as those for the same beef cuts (from Modernist Cuisine recipes) and have always liked the result, even if they are likely already done with shorter times.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We pretty much only have veal (<10 months) or "añojo" (<18 months) in Spain butcher's. No beef.

According to EU regulations, veal has to be 8 months or younger ("category V"). There is also a second category "Z" for bovine animals between 8 and 12 months, which may get a distinct labeling or not (for example, in Austria it's "Jungrind" or "young beef", while in the UK the same meat is marketed simply as "beef").

In Spain, the corresponding labels are "ternera blanca" and "ternera". I assume "añojo" is an older designation? In Austria, the situation is somewhat similar. Most supermarket beef is so-called "Jungrind" and usually between 10 and 12 months old. However, the meat is already red in color, clearly different from veal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm not sure about EU regulations, but all local sources I've looked up, as well as butcher's, use the following classification:

Ternera de leche (milk's veal): Male or female <8 months

Ternera (veal): Male or female 8-12 months

Añojo: Male or female 12-24 months (wrote <18 in previous entry, further search seems that it can be up to 24)

Novillo: Male or female 24-48 months

Cebón: Castrated male <48 months

Vaca (beef): Female >48 months

Buey (ox): Castrated male >48 months

Toro (bull): Male coming from bullfights >48 months

From those, nowadays you only find easily the ones in boldface. Ox you can buy, but it's quite expensive and I'm convinced often you're sold meat that is not actually ox...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm preparing some pork belly for "pork feast" next weekend.

As a first course, I'm planning to do rillettes based on this recipe, but substituting some left-over pâté spice mixture for everything except the juniper berries and garlic. Oh, and I omit the fatback, as my belly is from a mangalitsa pig and not lean at all. And of course I'm cooking the cubes sous-vide. Based on the confit recommendations, I'm trying 82 °C overnight. Or should I use a lower temperature? I just put it in, so it's not yet heated through completely.

The main dish will be sous-vide pork belly with a teriyaki glaze (from Ferran Adria's Family Meal) and some separately prepared crunchy skin. I don't have Instacure #1 (the pink salt available in stores over here only has nitrates, not nitrites, so I can't easily substitute and I don't have the time to do a long cure), so I will be using the basic MC brine with 7 % salt and 3 % sugar (to 100 % water). What brining time should I calculate for two 800-900 g pieces (instead of the whole 2.4 kg belly in MC)?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pork belly question: I've cooked (~45 hours at 62°) and individually portioned the pork belly. The meal is on Saturday. Should I

  1. freeze the portioned belly today and put it into the fridge to thaw tomorrow evening,
  2. re-pasteurize at least the surface of the portions by dipping them into not-quite boiling water (followed by an ice bath of course) and keep them in the fridge until Saturday,
  3. or, should I dispense with all that and keep them in the fridge as-is?

Schweinsbauch roh.jpg

Edit: Added picture of the pork belly after brining.

Edited by pep. (log)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

If the meal is only 2 days away and your refrigerator is moderately cold, I'd say that you're fine leaving in the fridge as is. I would probably wrap each portion in a few layers of plastic wrap and leave in the fridge...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If the meal is only 2 days away and your refrigerator is moderately cold, I'd say that you're fine leaving in the fridge as is. I would probably wrap each portion in a few layers of plastic wrap and leave in the fridge...

Ah. By "portioned" I meant to infer that I vacuum sealed them again afterwards.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Its 1 piece from the shoulder and 1 piece of belly.

I wanted to experiment with this: http://egullet.org/p1672174

Keller is doing his at 82.2 for 12h

The shoulder has a number of muscles. I probably wouldn't run any as high as 82C, but would adjust temperature depending on which muscle I was using.

I just cooked pork shoulder with achiote paste for a cochinita pibil sous-vide. First time to cook shoulder, I did not differentiate between the different muscles. Avaserfi, do you think there is much of a difference on how the different muscles should be cooked?

I put the bath at 60ºC and two bags, the first one removed after 48 hours, the second after 72 hours. 72 hours was too much, meat lost more liquid and was a bit mushy. 48 hours was very good, but I may try shorter (24 or 36) next time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Its 1 piece from the shoulder and 1 piece of belly.

I wanted to experiment with this: http://egullet.org/p1672174

Keller is doing his at 82.2 for 12h

The shoulder has a number of muscles. I probably wouldn't run any as high as 82C, but would adjust temperature depending on which muscle I was using.

I just cooked pork shoulder with achiote paste for a cochinita pibil sous-vide. First time to cook shoulder, I did not differentiate between the different muscles. Avaserfi, do you think there is much of a difference on how the different muscles should be cooked?

I put the bath at 60ºC and two bags, the first one removed after 48 hours, the second after 72 hours. 72 hours was too much, meat lost more liquid and was a bit mushy. 48 hours was very good, but I may try shorter (24 or 36) next time.

I haven't experimented with this as much as I would like, but there are a number of very different muscles in the shoulder that respond differently to cooking. My favorite cut of pork, the collar is great seared and I would never take it longer than 24 hours at 60C, probably closer to 6-12 hours. A small part of the jowl steak often makes it into the shoulder too, I like this at about 5 hours at 60C.

Beyond those cuts, when cooking shoulder traditionally, I rarely consider treating each muscle differently and have not had the opportunity to do so when cooking low temperature. It would be interesting to take a small portion of each muscle in the shoulder and bag them separately to see the effects of cooking time and temperature. Considering that the shoulder houses muscles with the same anatomical structure as the beef flat iron and the teres major, which I suspect would work better with shorter cook times, it might be a worth while experiment. That said, if you get a cross section of shoulder, these pieces would make up a relatively small portion of the meat cooked.

I can say, lately I have been experimenting with shorter cook times for most cuts and have strongly preferred the shorter cook times. For example, I find a 16hr 56C short rib far preferable in flavor and texture to the more common 72 hour short rib, but I have yet to do any real experiments with pork shoulder.

Andrew Vaserfirer aka avaserfi

Host, eG Forums

avaserfirer@egstaff.org

eG Ethics Signatory

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...