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liuzhou

Rice

105 posts in this topic

a.k.a. "fan chew" in Cantonese. An old, old "stuff" known in most rice-eating cuisines for however long the cuisine has been cooking rice, methinks. :-)

The Chinese also cook rice with a melangé of stuff (meat + veggies + etc) in smallish clay pots [traditionally, preferably over charcoal fires] with a tight-fitting clay lid to give a wonderful meal-in-a-pot with very nice "fan chew" at the bottom. Some people push aside the rice & ingredients on top and get to the rice crust at the bottom first!

https://www.google.c...iw=1274&bih=981

Except our version is salty and buttery/oily, and I must say, laden with bias, that that makes it far tastier :biggrin: In Iraqi and Persian food, it's considered the highlight of the meal.

(The bottom of dolsot bibimbap (nurungji) is pretty good, but not as good, and the nurungji that gets served immersed in hot water is soggy and tasteless.)

I agree frying the rice in oil or butter does make rice really tasty.

Oh, such rice would be scrumptious indeed. Still, the use of butter in a Chinese cuisine sense would not be traditional. OTOH, those clay-pot rice concoctions would, depending on who's making it and/or the skill of the chef or vendor of same, would be a dish where the (oiled) drippings and sauces from the meats and other ingredients in the dish percolate to the bottom and form a fond - then the crispy bits of the rice form using the oily sauce rather than just oil or butter (again, not something commonly used in Chinese cuisine). Different strokes for different folks - no doubt rice fried in butter would appeal more to many folks here.

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An aunt taught me to toast brown rice and onion in butter then add water to cook. I use olive oil.


It's almost never bad to feed someone.

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This medium grain heirloom variety brown rice tastes great and has the texture of white rice. I cook it using the Italian 'cook like pasta' approach. Bring lots of salted water to a boil, add rice, boil for 35 minutes, drain, cover, and rest for a few minutes.

Kokuho Rose Organic Brown Rice, available online here.

Bittman mentioned this rice a few weeks ago.

JIm


olive oil + salt

Real Good Food

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How about Risotto made with regular rice? 10x cheaper.

carrotheart2_zpsc281904d.jpg

Real Native American (not farmed) wild rice

wildriceX2_zps8c6845b1.jpg

dcarch

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Risotto should be made with Vialone Nano rice! I have tried Carnaroli and Arborio - I find Vialone Nano the easiest to use. I make mine in the oven (no need to stir), and then give it a furious whisk before serving. This releases the starch and makes the rice creamy:

original.jpg


There is no love more sincere than the love of food - George Bernard Shaw

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An aunt taught me to toast brown rice and onion in butter then add water to cook. I use olive oil.
.

The use of oil or other fat when making rice is common with Middle Eastern as well as Latin cuisine

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wildriceX2_zps8c6845b1.jpg

Is this a medium for growing mushrooms? Cause there looks like some sort of dirt on that plate there... Maybe modernist cusine?

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Is this a medium for growing mushrooms? Cause there looks like some sort of dirt on that plate there... Maybe modernist cusine?

Those are Enokitake mushrooms to be eaten raw. The black "dust" sprinkle is chopped black olives.

dcarch

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What about salt in rice?

Before I came to China about 17 years ago, I always salted rice when cooking it. Then I discovered that the locals here never do. In fact, they thought that I was totally deranged for doing so.

As they see it, the rice is a blank canvas behind the seasoned dishes; the dishes are the seasoning - and I find I agree. So now I never salt my rice.

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I normally don't salt my rice when cooking it. Neither did *anyone* I know nor (as far as I know) did any Chinese restaurant in SE Asia and elsewhere do so (again, AFAIK) in the context of Chinese cuisine, although specific rice preparations such as Hainanese chicken rice *would* be made with salted stock - but those would be exceptions. I *have* done it with non-Chinese cuisine - when making biryani-type rice with "Indian"-type influences, or with other cuisines. But plain boiled rice? For Chinese or Chinese-derived food? Never.


Edited by huiray (log)

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Yes, but Hainanese chicken as served in N. America is an American or Malaysian invention. I have been to Hainan often and never seen it on a menu outside of deeply tourist ghettoes and that only recently.

Yes I salt rice for some non-Asian applications


Edited by liuzhou (log)

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Yes, but Hainanese chicken as served in N. America is an American invention. I have been to Hainan often and never seen it on a menu outside of deeply tourist ghettoes and that only recently.

Yes I salt rice for non-Asian applications

Um, Hainanese chicken rice is NOT an American invention. The dish traditionally known on Hainan is properly known as "Wenchang chicken" (文昌雞). Hainanese chicken, as cooked by folks in Malaysia, Singapore, Thailand, etc etc is "derived from" Wenchang chicken but has acquired its own identity. Perhaps yhou ate the stuff that had been "back-imported" onto Hainan. "Hainanese chicken" as served in the US in restaurants is usually a pale imitation of the stuff you would get in SE Asia, although some are pretty good. I make my own Hainanese chicken and Hainanese chicken rice. In all cases (at home or in restaurants) the rice is made with salted stock.

http://en.wikipedia....se_chicken_rice

http://steamykitchen...icken-rice.html

http://www.yoursinga...icken-rice.html

http://rasamalaysia.com/chicken-rice/

http://www.malaysiak...se-chicken-rice

http://www.yoursinga...icken-rice.html

http://www.vietworld...an-chicken.html

http://www.malaysian...inanchicken.htm

etc etc

http://egullet.org/p1902527


Edited by huiray (log)

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I always salt American rice (liberally) while cooking.

I don't salt Asian or Indian rices.


Edited by patrickamory (log)

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Come on. I've eaten Wenchang chicken" (文昌雞) in Wenchang. It is not the same as what is served in America as Hainese chicken. Not even near. I travel to Hainan often. I'm going again just after the new year break. And as I said before you can't find the dish outside the tourist enclaves.

Interesting that al your links are from everywhere except Hainan. And don't quote Wikipedia at me.

in the US in restaurants is usually a pale imitation of the stuff you would get in SE Asia

Of course.

In fact your post generally agrees with me! I actually edited my post to say it originated in the US or Malaysia, but that edit didn't work. Wherever it was invented it wasn't Hainan. The forums' editing function is screwed.


Edited by liuzhou (log)

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Come on. I've eaten Wenchang chicken" (文昌雞) in Wenchang. It is not the same as what is served in American as Hainese chicken.

In fact your post agrees with me!

in the US in restaurants is usually a pale imitation of the stuff you would get in SE Asia

On the contrary.

Nowhere did I specifically talk about "American Hainanese Chicken Rice" in my previous post. I talked about the dish regardless of where it was served. I provided links to articles describing the dish, all of which illustrate that your statement that "Hainanese Chicken Rice" as served in the US is an "American invention" is false per se because it is NOT an "American invention". It is simply that the version served in the US in restaurants seldom is as good as what one gets in SE Asia, but the character of the dish is basically the same as what you would get in SE Asia.

If you are saying that the Hainanese Chicken Rice I made myself is "an American invention" simply because I made it in the US (since I live here) then you are wrong, wrong, wrong, Sir.

There is also no basis for comparing "Wenchang Chicken" with what is served in the US. Apples and oranges.


Edited by huiray (log)

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There is also no basis for comparing "Wenchang Chicken" with what is served in the US.

Excuse me, but it was you who compared the two. Not me.

The dish traditionally known on Hainan is properly known as "Wenchang chicken" (文昌雞).
in the US in restaurants is usually a pale imitation of the stuff you would get in SE Asia

On the contrary.

So you are disagreeing with yourself?


Edited by liuzhou (log)

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There is also no basis for comparing "Wenchang Chicken" with what is served in the US.

Excuse me, but it was you who compared the two. Not me.

The dish traditionally known on Hainan is properly known as "Wenchang chicken" (文昌雞).
in the US in restaurants is usually a pale imitation of the stuff you would get in SE Asia

On the contrary.

So you are disagreeing with yourself?

Not at all.

It is you who are reading contrary interpretations into what I said.

As for Wenchang Chicken, I *said* that it is a different dish. I was *not* comparing it with "Hainanse Chicken Rice". It is *your* interpretation that I was comparing the two.

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Come on. I've eaten Wenchang chicken" (文昌雞) in Wenchang. It is not the same as what is served in America as Hainese chicken. Not even near. I travel to Hainan often. I'm going again just after the new year break. And as I said before you can't find the dish outside the tourist enclaves.

Interesting that al your links are from everywhere except Hainan. And don't quote Wikipedia at me.

in the US in restaurants is usually a pale imitation of the stuff you would get in SE Asia

Of course.

In fact your post generally agrees with me! I actually edited my post to say it originated in the US or Malaysia, but that edit didn't work. Wherever it was invented it wasn't Hainan. The forums' editing function is screwed.

Interesting the number of edits your post has undergone.

Of course the links I posted are not from Hainan. It is precisely because the dish I talk about nowadays called "Hainanese Chicken Rice" was developed outside of Hainan. The history of it is called out in the links. It is disingenuous of you to complain that the links do not include any from Hainan.

As for Wikipedia and your sneering at it - in my opinion it is misguided to consider it with contempt. On the contrary - it is quite useful, and is a quite suitable "jumping off" point for many things, with citations to look up as one wishes. If you have such a disregard for the site - then just look up the other links I listed.

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It is precisely because the dish I talk about nowadays called "Hainanese Chicken Rice" was developed outside of Hainan.

What I said from the beginning.

I will continue to sneer at Wikipedia though. It would take me ten minutes to change the description to suggest Hainanese Chicken was invented in Northern Scotland. Which wouldn't surprise me.

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It is precisely because the dish I talk about nowadays called "Hainanese Chicken Rice" was developed outside of Hainan.

What I said from the beginning.

Yet you said that "Hainanese chicken rice" as served in America was an American invention (before you started editing your post after I responded) and it was my original point that it was NOT.

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I like rice, lol, based on how often I eat it and the contents of my pantry.

going off the top of my head, there's probably at least 3 different kinds right now -- arborio, jasmine, brown basmati and Japanese sushi rice.

I don't use a rice cooker because of lack of space and the way my kitchen is configured when it comes to electric sockets. only one socket in the kitchen, on the wall to my right if I were standing in front of the stove, and located a few feet above the rear back right burner. not the best place, in my opinion. there is a socket in the hallway, but it's not terribly convenient. so that option is out.

I use a ratio of 1 cup rice to 2.05 to 2.10 cups water. I like my rice a little moist so that if I end up overcooking it, I won't end up with a crust on the bottom of the pot. this method works for me. in addition, I don't do the knuckle thing. never have.

In addition to water, I have done any of the following at one point or another -- chicken stock, vegetable stock, fish or seafood stock, coconut milk; first toasting the grains in butter, oil or schmaltz. and that doesn't enter into the realm of risotto making.

for risottos, they range from traditional italian risotto alla milanese, to sweet risottos (the most recent one I did was sweet coconut risotto with meyer lemon confiture, sort of a grown-up version of rice pudding), to non-traditional risotto like a tomato risotto with tomato confit. in the spring, I like to do risotto with fava beans, ramps, morels and asparagus. risotto with peas and mint is an idea that, oddly enough, I have not yet attempted.

I adore Hainanese chicken rice, but don't make it as often as I should. I do have some turkey parts which I was saving for stock. Hmm, might have to repurpose some of that this weekend as this thread has given me a couple of new ideas so far. No, Hainanese turkey rice isn't traditional, but I'm sure it will be delicious.

edit: there is also Indian rice -- lemon rice, tamarind rice, coconut rice or a biryani. lemon rice is probably my favorite -- cooked basmati rice, flavored with toasted spices, ghee, lemon juice, chiles, chopped peanuts and cilantro. my mouth is watering just typing this sentence.


Edited by SobaAddict70 (log)

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Good topic.

Rice is a staple in our house hold. We primary eat short grain rice with basmati close second. For short grain we've been buying Kokuho brand (the red pkging) for decades. For basmati, I tried many variety have settled on Tilda brand. However, we also keep 4 to 6 additional varieties in the house.

I did have one enlightening moment a couple of years ago on rice. I went to a persian resturant. Since then I've had a lot of different varieties of persian rice dishes. IMHO, I believe persians make the best rice on the planet. This is tough statement for a asian person who grew up on short grain rice to make but they have the best rice dish.

On risotto, is there just bad to mediocre risotto everywhere? Everytime I order this dish, it is just a huge dissappointment. I keep expecting it to be good but it never is. Just went to a pricey place over the holidays and the risotto was pretty bad, mushy and cruchy (in an unpleasent not fully cooked rice way).

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Just went to a pricey place over the holidays and the risotto was pretty bad, mushy and cruchy (in an unpleasent not fully cooked rice way).

You are not the first person I've come across who feels this way. It seems to me that people used to Asian rice cooking find risotto at best strange, at worst unpleasant. And "undercooked" is a frequent complaint.

The staff in my local (ludicrously overpriced) Italian restaurant in the local (ludicrously overpriced) "International" hotel spend hours every week explaining to local clientèle that the translation of risotto into "肉汁烩饭*' might not convey quite what they expect. I virtually had to sign a waive of rights form before they would serve it to me. It was lovely.

*Literally "Gravy braised rice"


Edited by liuzhou (log)

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