Steak – Cooking Sous Vide

[weedy]

hmmm you can "overcook" sous vide (and pay a texture penalty) but I don;t find it happens to a steak in an extra hour or two

 

an extra 4 or 6 hours, sure

 

but the difference in texture on a rib eye done sous vide for 2 hrs versus 4 hrs is pretty subtle, if noticeable at all, and only apparent I think on an actual direct comparison.

or to put it another way, I doubt anyone would be unhappy with a 4 hr rib eye 

 

 

Fish is much more quickly changed, but then I'm not generally a proponent of fin fishes done sous vide anyway, except for special effect

[chris_s]

as an epilogue, plans changed, didn't end up doing ribeyes on that night. 

 

I did however have a bbq a couple of days ago and made regular t-bones on the grill for guests, and a trial-mode SV blade steak for myself. Did it for 10 hours at 134, no seasoning in bag. It was pretty frigid out so I wasn't able to get the grill too hot so I seared it quickly on a frying pan in hot hot oil. It was very tender, though I don't think I got the sear done properly as I was a bit rushed. Overall not bad for a trial run, impressed with how edible a cheap steak turned out! 

 

also of note, the t-bones were about 1.5" thick and I was WAY off on having them done appropriately in spite of using a temperature probe. Should've done those SV also (but shorter time) 

Edited January 2, 2015 by chris_s (log)

[paulraphael]

T-bone is still a tender cut ... part strip and part fillet. It likewise doesn't need to be tenderized with long cooking times. I suspect you'd be happier if the cook times were under 4 hours.

[dwmackay]

Greetings,

 

I am very new to Sous Vide cooking.  I have had moderate success with the process, but recently tried my first NY strip steaks.  The results were very good, but not exactly as I expected.  I could use some more experienced some advice.

 

I individually sealed 4 NY strips that were about 1 lb each and maybe 1.5" thick.  I did not add any spices or other flavorings, just the steaks which I trimmed fairly aggressively.  My theory was that I did not want a big fat cap that would be hard to sear and fully render.  They went onto a 127 degree bath for about 90 minutes.  I removed the steaks, dried them with paper towels, coated with olive oil and seared them in a cast iron pan with a little added butter and fresh thyme.  They turned out well but were not exactly what I expected.  Here is what was different:

1. Texture:  One of the things I like about a NY strip is the relatively firm texture compared to other cuts.  Mine were much softer than a traditionally grilled NY strip.  For some, the softer texture might be good, but I missed the texture I was hoping for.  Question: Is this just the nature of SV cooking?  Is there some way to recapture the great texture of a NY Strip while still getting the perfect edge to edge doneness?
2. Juice:  As we ate the steaks, I noticed that the juice that was on the plates was very red.  It was not bad, but created a distraction in the meal as it was very unusual.  I have eaten plenty of steak, but have not seen juice like this.  Question:  Is this too just how it works?  Is it possible that I did not leave the steaks in the bath long enough?
3. Searing:  This was also my first attempt at searing a steak in a cast iron skillet.  I did them 2 at a time.  I started by searing the fat cap edges first which worked well, but created a good bit of liquid in the pan.  The first 2 steaks seared beautifully, but the second 2 did not do as well.  I am wondering if I should have poured the liquid out of the pan before adding the second pair.  My guess is that the amount of liquid prevented the final steaks from making good contact with the pan.  Question:  Should I drain the liquid after the first pair?  I added some butter and thyme and did not really want to discard that.  Maybe I should have poured out and reserved the juice?  Also, whey they say that this technique makes a lot of smoke, they are not kidding.  Thank goodness for the whole house fan...

 

So that's it for now.  I really appreciate any advice that might be offered.

 

Doug M.

[gfweb]

I like NY strip at about 130, not quite so red.

 

And I agree that the steak ought to have a bit of chew to it.

 

Before searing you need a dry steak and a HOT dry pan.

 

I don't think SV is necessarily the way to do all steaks. It certainly keeps meat tender, but who needs  a filet that is more tender than normal?

 

Unless I'm cooking a whole bunch of steaks I tend to sear and roast till done and not use SV. SV works better for me when I have lots of steaks (usually of varying size) to get right.

[btbyrd]

Hi Doug! Welcome to the forum! To answer your questions....

 

1) Yes, that soft texture is what you'll get when you cook tender cuts of beef sous vide. Because you're not exposing the meat to higher temperatures, the proteins do not denature/unfold as much as they do in traditional cooking methods. Though this has the bonus that the meat tends to hold onto more of its moisture, it also produces a softer texture that not everyone prefers.

 

2) Yes, this is also just how it works. When you cook a steak in a bag, its juices do not have the same sort of exposure to oxygen that they do if you cook it in a pan or on the grill. The appearance of "red" meat is a consequence of myoglobin in the protein/juice bonding with oxygen. Grocery stores often exploit this property of red meat, using modified atmospheric packaging to seal meat in a tray with a bit of carbon monoxide which bonds with the myoglobin on the surface of the meat, turning it a bright red. Anyway, when you cut into a SV steak and let it sit, the juices on the surface of the meat (and on your plate) will "bloom" and turn from brown to a bright red. Some recipes exploit this property of meat, such as this recipe for intensely flavored, bright red rare beef jus from Modernist Cuisine.

 

 

3) You should always sear in a "dry" pan -- a pan that contains no moisture. That doesn't mean it doesn't contain oil or fat, but that it doesn't have any water in it. If your pan has moisture in it, your meat will steam rather than sear, and it'll take longer to develop a nice crust. This also increases the risk of overcooking the meat. Also, if your pan has water in it, it's not hot enough to sear. Your pan should be so hot that any water you sprinkle into it will immediately vaporize. You want the pan as hot as you can get it so that you get maximum sear in minimum time. For this reason, it's not generally recommended to sear off a steak with whole butter because the milk protein will turn black and bitter if your pan is hot enough. Clarified butter is much better for this purpose. Also tallow or lard -- really, any saturated fats that is able to withstand high temperatures without breaking down. If you want to infuse a bit of thyme flavor, it's better to just seal it in the bag with the steak before cooking. A little will go a long way, and make sure that you keep the thyme off to the side so that it's not pressing into your steak (which can over-flavor the meat and distort its shape).

 

I'll add that I don't really prefer tender cuts like strip or ribeye when they're cooked sous vide... at least when I'm eating an entire steak. If I'm doing a plated dish and will be including slices of steak rather than the whole thing, that's a different matter. But otherwise, I'd rather just grill it. For my taste, the real strength of sous vide isn't in cooking tender cuts of beef, but in transforming tough cuts like short ribs or cheek into supple, meltingly tender meat. I also like cooking things like flank or skirt steak SV to ensure that they're cooked all the way through before searing them hard on a screaming hot grill. I also find that tender cuts of pork - like chops - turn out well, especially if you brine them first. And tougher pork cuts can really shine with SV... ribs, cheek, and shoulder are all great things to put in the bath. And, of course, pork belly cooked SV is amazing.

Edited January 6, 2015 by btbyrd (log)

[gfweb]

I'll add that I don't really prefer tender cuts like strip or ribeye when they're cooked sous vide... at least when I'm eating an entire steak. If I'm doing a plated dish and will be including slices of steak rather than the whole thing, that's a different matter. But otherwise, I'd rather just grill it. For my taste, the real strength of sous vide isn't in cooking tender cuts of beef, but in transforming tough cuts like short ribs or cheek into supple, meltingly tender meat. I also like cooking things like flank or skirt steak SV to ensure that they're cooked all the way through before searing them hard on a screaming hot grill. I also find that tender cuts of pork - like chops - turn out well, especially if you brine them first. And tougher pork cuts can really shine with SV... ribs, cheek, and shoulder are all great things to put in the bath. And, of course, pork belly cooked SV is amazing.

 

All good points, esp that last part I quoted.  I don't think SV helps tender cuts...and it takes longer to do as well.

 

RE spices in the SV bag...a nice thing, but don't salt pre-SV esp if the cook will be a long one as the meat will get a cured texture.

[paulraphael]

I very much like SV for tender cuts. I think these cuts have to be cooked with precision, to avoid over softening and drying out, but I like the perfection of the cook, and the lack of overcooked meat around the edges.

 

It's also the only way I have of serving a lot of people simultaneously. Takes all the guesswork and panic out of the equation.

 

I agree with gfweb that a higher temperature will help. I used to think of myself as a rare meat guy, but SV experiments have shown me that I like medium rare beef much more. Part of this is that when you conventionally cook a steak to rare (say 127) only the center will be cooked that low. Everything out to the edge will be progressively more done. The part of that steak you like the most is probably in the 130s. 

 

I generally set my circulator to 55C / 131F, in order to cook the meat to 54C / 129F.  A few degrees higher is still plenty pink. 

 

Yes to what everyone else said about searing. Your last two steaks had trouble because the first two cooled the pan. Cleaning the pan and taking more time to reheat would fix this. A big fat griddle also works great.

[hski7]

I very much like SV for tender cuts. I think these cuts have to be cooked with precision, to avoid over softening and drying out, but I like the perfection of the cook, and the lack of overcooked meat around the edges.

 

It's also the only way I have of serving a lot of people simultaneously. Takes all the guesswork and panic out of the equation.

 

I agree with gfweb that a higher temperature will help. I used to think of myself as a rare meat guy, but SV experiments have shown me that I like medium rare beef much more. Part of this is that when you conventionally cook a steak to rare (say 127) only the center will be cooked that low. Everything out to the edge will be progressively more done. The part of that steak you like the most is probably in the 130s. 

 

I generally set my circulator to 55C / 131F, in order to cook the meat to 54C / 129F.  A few degrees higher is still plenty pink. 

 

Yes to what everyone else said about searing. Your last two steaks had trouble because the first two cooled the pan. Cleaning the pan and taking more time to reheat would fix this. A big fat griddle also works great.

 

Agree with this - makes life easier if serving more than two steaks and I like the slight increase in tenderness SV produces.  I also use a large cast iron griddle -- I heat it up on my BBQ to 650F or so and sear for about 45 secs a side. I can get a good sear on 4-6 steaks.

[rotuts]

I agree with almost all that has been said.

 

i generally do " bulk " SV, various Turks, Cuts of This and That, stuffed or not, always on sale.

 

the Sale is what feel is the Fair Price.  dont get me wrong, Id pay a least 0.1 % more if there were

 

Salted and Spiced ( Chinese-ey ) Calamari in may area.  

 

where ever you are, try to look for CSA or Local true grass fed beef, in some sort of reasonably priced cut

 

for me in my area that's  'sirloin steaks'

 

the CSA is not so good on the even cut

 

which brings me to my point :

 

uneven cuts have no issue w SV.

 

enjoy.

 

Sur la Plate.

[torolover]

You said that you sous vide for 90 min at 127F?  According to my Sous Vide Dash, the center of a 1.5 inch steak would only have been 122F after 90 min, which is pretty rare.  

 

Perhaps that's why it was too soft?  Perhaps that's also why you saw too much red liquid?

 

I often wondered why lots of recipes say to sous vide for 90 min for a 1.5 inch steak, when my Sous Vide Dash saids it will take over 3 hours?  Is Sous Vide Dash wrong?

[paulraphael]

Is Sous Vide Dash wrong?

[torolover]

Wow, great blog!  I'm learning so much on Egullet!  Love it!!

[dwmackay]

Thank you all for the great and thoughtful replies.  I'll have another go at it this weekend.

 

You have been a huge help.

 

Doug M.

[BKEats]

Just to give another perspective.. I am not a fan of steaks that are prepared sous vide. So, it's quiet possible, you just don't like sous vide.  I think the texture suffers greatly. 

[paulraphael]

I think if you learn to control the process, you can get any texture you want from sous-vide. Whether or not it's the best possible way to get a given texture is a different question.

[BKEats]

i disagree. 

[paulraphael]

I'd be intrigued by a proposition that there's a "sous-vide" texture—rather than a texture that happens to come from the most popular ways SV gets used. How does cooking meat in a 100% humid environment give a certain texture, regardless of time or temperature?

[gfweb]

The result of SV steaks or hamburgers seems to be to preserve a texture and juiciness closer to rare with the color and doneness of a more cooked steak. By avoiding a high temp gradient in the meat, toughness is avoided but "chew"  is lost unless the sear is a hearty one.

 

My suspicion is that the temp is more critical to texture than the 100% humidity.

 

I'm not a big fan of SV for more tender  steaks and I just don't like rare SV hamburgers. My taste buds have been trained t o like the results of the traditional method if properly done. Which is the key I guess. It is so easy to screw-up steak if you aren't vigilant. I tend to use SV for steak only when I have a large number to turn out and don't want the pressure/timing of getting each right. They then get a hearty sear all at once.

Edited January 16, 2015 by gfweb (log)

[paulraphael]

My suspicion is that the temp is more critical to texture than the 100% humidity.

[gfweb]

The difficulty is that, in essence, what I want is an slightly overcooked outer steak and a just-right inner steak. I don't want edge to edge Rare texture.

 

As someone said earlier, they have come to realize through SV experiments that the doneness they want isn't the rare that they prefer in a traditionally cooked steak, but medium rare if by SV.

[paulraphael]

That's not really a difficulty; it's just a result that you want. you can get a medium-rare to medium gradient with sous-vide, and then get the result consistently and perfectly. It just takes some calculation to figure out your method. You can do it in one cooking stage or two. The only real complication is that precise timing becomes a factor again. But since you have control over the temperature, you can just use a timer. No need for instant temperature readings or guesswork. 

[paulraphael]

Here's a method I calculated for a rare to medium-rare gradient:

 

(use only on steaks 1.5” to 2” thick)

-cook through to 52°C/126°F in a 53°C Water Bath.

 1.5” thick: 1 hour 50 minutes    2” thick:  3 hours 15 minutes

-remove from circulator. Adjust water bath to to 57°C / 135°F. Put meat in when stabilized.

 For 1cm gradient: 10 minutes. For 0.75cm gradient: 6min

 

It sounds like you're looking for something more like medium-rare to medium, which would look just like this but with water baths a couple of degrees higher.

 

You could also work out a much faster method with a longer gradient by plopping the bags in a much hotter bath and pulling out at just the right time. This is basically just conventional cooking in a humid environment ... BUT you have total control and consistency.

Edited January 16, 2015 by paulraphael (log)

[gfweb]

Interesting method. what does a cross-section of a steak look like cooked this way?

[rotuts]

""  he doneness they want isn't the rare that they prefer in a traditionally cooked steak, but medium rare if by SV. ""

 

as mentioned, traditional 'Rare' is rare at the center w a gradient.

 

a little of everything there.

 

I do very much like a '130' hamburger, w the best chuck I can find, fresh or home made.

 

with not ' pat pat pat '

 

this I get in the Combi.  for me this 'steam' burger is to die for.

 

Cant imagine doing this in a plastic bag as id have to over handle the meat  ( texture, not germs.  My Germs and I get along

 

fine.  Mostly )