• Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create an account.

e_monster

Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques & Equipment (Part 8)

577 posts in this topic

What does one do with the accumulated juices from, say, a steak? Are they usable as a sauce, au jus etc.?


Monterey Bay area

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Would you say moisture retention is enhanced buy cooking SV then shocking just like cooling braised meats in their cooking liquid is key?


Sleep, bike, cook, feed, repeat...

Chef Facebook HQ Menlo Park, CA

My eGullet Foodblog

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Pete - I was wondering about all the coagulated meat proteins. Confirms my thoughts.


Monterey Bay area

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Addendum to what Pedro posted:

I used to boil the juices to coagulate the proteins and then used the strained liquid (osmazome) for sauce making.

Looking more carefully at the proteins that were coagulated, they seemed to be the residue that the meat would put out whilst frying that then cooked onto the bottom of the pan and would later be deglazed to make a sauce.

Using this reasoning, I now heat the liquid and strain off the osmazome, which I add later in the sauce making process.

I then cook the remaining residue at a sufficient temperature for it to be undergo a Maillard reaction and give the approximation of the bits that stick to the bottom of the pan when you fry meat. I then deglaze with an appropriate liquid (typically red wine, which I then reduce) and proceed to make the sauce, adding an amount of the osmazome as one of the components (as well as chicken stock, veal demi glace and an acid just before serving).

Once the sauce is cooked down to a suitable thickness or thickened with a starch such a potato starch (this call depends on the flavour of the sauce and the degree to which it will cope with being further concentrated), I strain it and serve it over the meat.

The flavour of this sauce more closely represents a traditional sauce due to incorporation of the meaty, maillardized flavours.


Edited by nickrey (log)

Nick Reynolds, aka "nickrey"

"The Internet is full of false information." Plato
My eG Foodblog

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another puzzle.

So far all my test were on red meat. I tried some scallops at 49 Celcius... They were awfull.

Any recommendation

Tks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Scallops cook so quickly and the searing gives such a nice caramelization I don't think I'd even want to sous vide them.


Nick Reynolds, aka "nickrey"

"The Internet is full of false information." Plato
My eG Foodblog

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Scallops cook so quickly and the searing gives such a nice caramelization I don't think I'd even want to sous vide them.

Agreed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yup... Actually I think so too. I also did some Red Deer 1 cm thick loin and they were so awsome seared that I dont think that it was worth it to sous vide.

Thaks for the reply

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been experimenting with SV custards of various kinds, that is egg-thickened creams such as crème brûlée, crème anglaise, cheesecake, pumpkin pie, and even eggnog.

A few things I've learned:

SV is an excellent method for cooking custards. While custards thicken when the egg proteins in the mix are heated, they curdle when the egg protein is overheated. Traditional methods to prevent curdling include preheating the milk, stirring, adding flour, or placing ramekins in a waterbath in the oven. But SV is much more accurate, more dependable, and far easier.

Preparing the mix couldn't be simpler. Its just a matter of combining the basic ingredients: egg, liquid, sugar, salt, and flavoring. The liquid can be milk, cream, coconut milk, cream cheese (for a chesecake) or variations and combinations thereof.

Ratios vary. An eggnog would be about 1 egg to 1 pint of liquid. A soft custard (English-style custard or crème anglaise) would have about 1 egg to 1 cup of liquid. Firmer custards would have a greater proportion of eggs. Either whole eggs or yolks can be used. Yolks add a little more color and richness, but do not have greater thickening capacity.

Some flavorings appear to work better than others in SV conditions. Vanilla is superb. But strong flavors such as citrus zest (often used in cheesecake recipes) or pungent spices (as in pumpkin pie filling) can be too harsh. Strong flavorings can be toned down by precooking, then cooling and adding to the custard mix.

A temp of ~83C/181F does the trick. Interestingly, this is higher than the ~64C/147F at which egg yolks set; diluted eggs in need a higher temp for their proteins to coagulate.

SV cheesecake or pumpkin pie clearly depart most from the traditional method, since the crust and the filling must be cooked separately. But the traditional method often produces a dry, cracked, hard product. SV cheesecake or pumpkin pie is much more creamy, soft, and delicate. A modernistic cheesecake sprinkled with cookie crumbs, or a new pumpkin pie garnished with a wedge of pastry can be fun.

Since vacuum sealers do not work well with liquids, custards can be cooked in ziploc bags or in small mason jars.

I'd be interested in hearing what anyone else has discovered in this area.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.


Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm planning to order one of the SousVide Supreme units in the next couple days. They have a special right now where you get their vacuum sealer with the SVS for only $20 extra. I'm kind of concerned about how basic this model is, missing features like pulsed vacuuming or multiple speeds. I recall reading earlier in the thread that you really want a fully-featured sealer for sous vide.

Should I even be considering the vac sealer they carry, cheap or not? The alternative would probably be something like the Foodsaver V2490, which is also fairly cheap but more fully-featured.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Chris! I have to say that I've been happy with my FoodSaver (click here for information) and think that there's no need for a home user to upgrade to anything much more than that.

MartinH, thanks for that write-up. It's extremely useful.

What Nick wrote above is my procedure for those juices when I'm feeling virtuous. More often than not, however, my "sauce" isn't classical French but is a quick rustic one with sautéed onions or tomato sauce. So I just fine strain the contents of the bag, push the stuff in the strainer through the mesh, and add the stuff all at once into whatever sauce base I'm making. I'll also add that LTLT-cooked proteins with a lot of collagen in them -- skin, bones, tendons -- have thickening properties that mean that you can skip the cornstarch etc.


Chris Amirault

camirault@eGstaff.org

eG Ethics Signatory

Sir Luscious got gator belts and patty melts

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm planning to order one of the SousVide Supreme units in the next couple days. They have a special right now where you get their vacuum sealer with the SVS for only $20 extra. I'm kind of concerned about how basic this model is, missing features like pulsed vacuuming or multiple speeds. I recall reading earlier in the thread that you really want a fully-featured sealer for sous vide.

Should I even be considering the vac sealer they carry, cheap or not? The alternative would probably be something like the Foodsaver V2490, which is also fairly cheap but more fully-featured.

I have a SVS and have quit on using a vacuum sealer for routine stuff. Careful expulsion of air from a normal zip lock bag (either by rolling or immersing in water and sealing the zip lock) has worked fine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.

Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.

Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.

I sv'd custard once for ice cream, and it was the best batch of ice cream I've ever made. Only complaint is how the bag fills with air unless you have a chamber vacuum...what would be handy are bags with one way valves so the air can escape, but I think that'd be overkill :smile:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.

Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.

I sv'd custard once for ice cream, and it was the best batch of ice cream I've ever made. Only complaint is how the bag fills with air unless you have a chamber vacuum...what would be handy are bags with one way valves so the air can escape, but I think that'd be overkill :smile:

Yeap. Certainly not overkill! I have not made ice cream custard base on the stove top in a long time. SV is just ideal. I use the Pulse feature to get more or less a perfect air-free seal using the FoodSaver and I cook at about 82 C per the instructions in Under Pressure. I think my favorite part, in addition to how simple the whole thing is, is that the sealed bag is not pasteurized and can rest in the fridge for quiet some time until I am ready to churn.


E. Nassar
Houston, TX

My Blog
contact: enassar(AT)gmail(DOT)com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am looking to cook some quinces and am wondering what the consensus for timing would be. I think about 85C is fine for temp, but quince is hard and am not sure if I should go for a couple of hours or more. Ideas?


E. Nassar
Houston, TX

My Blog
contact: enassar(AT)gmail(DOT)com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Chris! I have to say that I've been happy with my FoodSaver (click here for information) and think that there's no need for a home user to upgrade to anything much more than that.

I'm wondering more specifically whether the SVS vac sealer is so basic that it's not worth considering, even cheaply, instead of a basic Foodsaver unit that's more expensive. I will definitely be trying out the Ziploc bag technique, but I don't want to pay extra for a vac sealer that's a waste of money, and I have to decide up front since I live in Canada (shipping is $80 per order). It seems like a lot of people use the pulse feature on their Foodsavers, which the SVS model doesn't have. I am happy to spend a bit extra on a Foodsaver if it's more useful for sous vide.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Chris! I have to say that I've been happy with my FoodSaver (click here for information) and think that there's no need for a home user to upgrade to anything much more than that.

I'm wondering more specifically whether the SVS vac sealer is so basic that it's not worth considering, even cheaply, instead of a basic Foodsaver unit that's more expensive. I will definitely be trying out the Ziploc bag technique, but I don't want to pay extra for a vac sealer that's a waste of money, and I have to decide up front since I live in Canada (shipping is $80 per order). It seems like a lot of people use the pulse feature on their Foodsavers, which the SVS model doesn't have. I am happy to spend a bit extra on a Foodsaver if it's more useful for sous vide.

My suggestion is to skip theirs and either just use Ziploc bags or spend the extra cash on a better FoodSaver with Pulse. I use that Pulse feature 99% of the time honestly because even "dry" items will still leach liquid once you push that "Vaccum" button.


E. Nassar
Houston, TX

My Blog
contact: enassar(AT)gmail(DOT)com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.

Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.

I sv'd custard once for ice cream, and it was the best batch of ice cream I've ever made. Only complaint is how the bag fills with air unless you have a chamber vacuum...what would be handy are bags with one way valves so the air can escape, but I think that'd be overkill :smile:

Yeap. Certainly not overkill! I have not made ice cream custard base on the stove top in a long time. SV is just ideal. I use the Pulse feature to get more or less a perfect air-free seal using the FoodSaver and I cook at about 82 C per the instructions in Under Pressure. I think my favorite part, in addition to how simple the whole thing is, is that the sealed bag is not pasteurized and can rest in the fridge for quiet some time until I am ready to churn.

I was talking more about how the bag fills with air while you SV it...I released it twice, was afraid it wouldn't cook evenly if I didn't since it displaced so much space.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does Hollendaise sauce = custard?? Anyone tried to make SV???

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.

Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.

I sv'd custard once for ice cream, and it was the best batch of ice cream I've ever made. Only complaint is how the bag fills with air unless you have a chamber vacuum...what would be handy are bags with one way valves so the air can escape, but I think that'd be overkill :smile:

Yeap. Certainly not overkill! I have not made ice cream custard base on the stove top in a long time. SV is just ideal. I use the Pulse feature to get more or less a perfect air-free seal using the FoodSaver and I cook at about 82 C per the instructions in Under Pressure. I think my favorite part, in addition to how simple the whole thing is, is that the sealed bag is not pasteurized and can rest in the fridge for quiet some time until I am ready to churn.

I was talking more about how the bag fills with air while you SV it...I released it twice, was afraid it wouldn't cook evenly if I didn't since it displaced so much space.

I have been using the SV water bath as a heat source for ice cream base for the last few months - works great. I messed with bags just once. I now use a quart jar with a plastic storage cap. Simple and easy. After the custard thickens (about an hour) the jar can go into an ice bath if I am in a hurry or just into the fridge to churn the next day.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does Hollendaise sauce = custard?? Anyone tried to make SV???

A "quasi-custard" perhaps? It is similar to a custard being egg-thickened, but water-based rather than milk-based. I haven't tried it SV, but I can think of two different ways to do it. Either cook the egg+liquid then whisk in the butter; or, slightly warm the egg+liquid enough to blend in the butter and then cook. No idea if either works.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

  • Similar Content

    • By oferl
      Hi :-) Bought 1.7Kg pork chunk, might be a bit of weird cutting, seems like a rack of pork chops caught between V shaped in bones.
      Would like to sous vide it whole without further cutting to single steaks and would be glad to get a direction for temp and time, from what i've seen 60-62C 
      area might be great to keep it juicy but i'm lost with the time, as it is a big chunk and not single steaks.. Thanks !   
    • By Rugby
      Hello fellow eGullet members. I stumbled across this forum while looking for ways to improve my food here.
      I've been a technical type all my life and started assembling my kitchen 7 years ago piece by piece after quitting living from hotels for the previous 12 years.  
      I currently enjoy smoked foods and tweaking local / regional recipes by applying technique instead of hard boiling or large batch frying.  So far it's allowed me to enjoy and reinforce my knowledge of ingredients.
      Thank you everyone contributing here and those folks who laid the frameworks for dispelling myths and providing understanding of ingredients and flavours.
      Best regards and bon-appetit,
      Warren
       
       
    • By ltjazz
      Hey all,
       
      I've made thicker and creamier sorbets with 25% to 35% sugar strained fruit purees and sugar, syrups, and other stabilizers that have worked well. However, because it's so much fruit and little to no water it can be an expensive project.
       
      I am trying to make "Water Ice" or "Italian Ice" in my home ice cream machine. Think of textures similar to Rita's Water Ice, Court Pastry Shop, or Miko's in Chicago. It eats much lighter than a sorbet but isn't really icy, but it's also not thick like sorbet. Ritas uses "flavoring" and sugar, while the other two use fruit juice. I'm thinking of thinning the strained fruit juice with water and adding a stabilizer, but I'm having trouble getting this in my home ice cream machine without it freezing solid like granita.
       
      Can anyone suggest a way to use real fruit juice, water, and a combination and concentration of stabilizers to get a looser, frozen fruit dessert that isn't icy?
    • By paulraphael
      Does anyone have reliable tricks for getting good flavor out of garlic in a sous-vide bag? I'm talking about using it just as an aromatic, while cooking proteins, or as part of a stock or vegetable puree.
       
      The one time I forgot the maxim to leave raw garlic out of the bag, I ended up with celeriac puree that tasted like a tire fire.
       
      I see some recommendations to just use less, but in my experience the problem wasn't just too much garlic flavor. It was acrid, inedible flavor. Using less works fine for me with other mirepoix veggies.
       
      I also see recipes for s.v. garlic confit (listed by both Anova and Nomiku) and for some reason people say these taste good. How can this be?
       
      There was a thread questioning the old saw about blanching garlic multiple times in milk, which didn't come to any hard conclusions.
       
      I'm wondering if a quick blanch in water before adding to the s.v. bag, to deactivate the enzymes, would do the trick. But I don't know the actual chemistry behind the garlic tire fire, so am not confident this would work.
       
      Some cooks advocate garlic powder; I'm hoping to not resort to that.
       
      Thoughts?
    • By May10April
      I know there was a thread on this a few years ago, however it seems these scales are no longer made or newer better models are available.
      As I've become more serious about my baking, I've decided to get a kitchen scale. I'm debating between the My Weigh KD-8000 http://www.amazon.com/My-Weigh-Digital-Weighing-Scale/dp/B001NE0FU2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1297958394&sr=8-1 or the EatSmart Precision Pro Digital Scale. http://www.amazon.com/EatSmart-Precision-Digital-Kitchen-Scale/dp/B001N0D7GA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1297958443&sr=1-1 Originally I wanted the Taylor Salter High Capacity Scale because it looked cool, but I've noticed it received many mixed reviews. http://www.amazon.com/Taylor-Salter-Aquatronics-Capacity-Kitchen/dp/B004BIOMGU/ref=sr_1_24?s=home-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1297958465&sr=1-24
      Here are my requirments:
      -Minimum capacity of 11 lbs
      -Minimum resolution of 1 g
      -Measure in Kg, lb, oz, g
      -Tare feature
      -Preferably have seamless buttons
      I want to get a nice scale. I don't want to get a scale with minimum features only to find in two years that I do enough baking/cooking that requires me to have something more sophisticated.
      Here are a few other questions:
      1. How important is it to have a scale measure fluid ounces?
      2. What about measuring lbs. oz (for example 6 lbs and 4.2 ounces)
      3. Is it important to have a scale measure in bakers %? I'd like to learn how to do these and have a cookbook that shows them next to the measurements. I'm not sure if this is something most people can figure out on their own or it would be handy to have them on a scale. The MW KD-8000 does this.
      The only problem with the MW-KD-8000 is it appears to be big and bulky and I don't have a lot of counter space so I'd probably keep it stored most of the time. The Eat Smart just seems to minimal. The Salter seems like an expensive scale for what it offers and somewhat of a risk.
      Thanks for any help in helping me choose the right scale. I do not know why this is becoming a chore to purchase! I just want to make sure I choose the right one right off the bat.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.