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Hooray - Hardens 2011Guide is out


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Well, looking through the new guide, Hardens seem to have got it right, again.

Their ratings are based on reports from Joe Public and they rate regardless of the establishments Michelin status, and it seeks out good eating establishments that Michelin have never heard of.

We agree with 99% of their ratings both good and bad.

If you haven't got a copy log on and order one quickly - it is a guide you shouldn't be without and NO I am not employed by Hardens but I am a member and as such if you put in more than six reports a year you get a free copy. :biggrin:

Pam Brunning Editor Food & Wine, the Journal of the European & African Region of the International Wine & Food Society

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I agree with you, Pam (Note to self: this is becoming a habit, stop it John).

I make sure I send enough reviews to get my freebie copy(should be due any day).

It scores for me by including the more casual sort of place which tends to be where I choose (and can afford) to eat most often. Because of this, I find it particularly helpful when visiting a new town - at least I can usually be assured of finding somewhere halfway decent to eat almost anywhere in the country.

John Hartley

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My preferred guide book is the GFG. Hardens is a bit like sugarvine or tripadvisor for my taste. Some good info at times, but without cross-referencing the places scoring well in the GFG or Michelin rated then I take it with a pinch of salt. I have only ever had one copy though. I might be a little more interested getting a free copy.

I tend to find far more reliable advice on here!

Martin

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I cannot comment on recent Hardens editions as I do not buy guide books, (except for last years Good Food Guide).

I can however comment historically on Hardens. It was a review of Pied a terre and so much off the money, I remember thinking "what are they on". They slagged it off big time which soured me somewhat to the guide.

Having said all that I am prepared to give them another go. Best do a few reviews for them to even things out a bit. :wink:

And of course get my free copy. :smile:

"So many places, so little time"

http://londoncalling...blogspot.co.uk/

@d_goodfellow1

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And should you want me to expand on why:

Their ratings are based on reports from Joe Public

That's the reason :)

I tend to agree, I prefer recommendations from people I know, rather than a "diverse crowd" (I believe Harden is a believer in the "Wisdom of Crowds" - although he seems to ignore some of the pitfalls of group-think).

I may only know a lot of the trusted recommender's online but because I can build up an insight into someone like David's (Goodfellow) opinions I feel I can tune my reading to my own personal taste. I also like professional reviewers/publications (like Michelin) for much the same reason i.e. I can understand their bias and appreciate their strengths and weaknesses.

I am also very suspicious about the tastes of a great many people in the UK, the acceptance of so much mediocrity (especially in UK food) illustrates this. I think it is also massively amplified by the media's delusion that the UK food scene is generally healthy, with world leading restaurants - there are a few but it is still too much of a lottery with many overpriced and delivering fairly average fare. I also find it interesting to read a lot of the comments on sites like the Guardian's WoM: given the demographic of that papers readership I find the knowledge and opinion of food to be quite woeful. Given these factors why would a democratic guide based on Joe Public book be good for me? Doesn't "crowd-sourced" opinion simply trend towards the average rather than celebrate the best?

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Doesn't "crowd-sourced" opinion simply trend towards the average rather than celebrate the best?

Perhaps it does. And I doubt whether Hardens make a particular claim to celebrate the best.

I think the guide should be regarded as exactly as that. A guide. It's one of a number of reference points that I might use - others include this board, the GFG and, to some extent, local review sites and professional sites, such as Manchester Confidential.

Guides take much of their prose from Joe Public contributors. I know this as I see some my own words in several write-ups in the 2011 GFG. Does that weaken the write-up, or strengthen it. I like to think that the views of the ordinary paying public have validity.

As for Hardens, yes it's entirely Joe Public. But when I read the comments about places I know in Manchester, I generally find that I'm in agreement with them, whether they be good or poor comments. So, if there's what I consider to be accuracy about my own area, then why would I not tend to trust the view about areas I'm only visiting.

John Hartley

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My "reporters" copy arrived yesterday. I think it safe to say that Hardens is not trying just to mention "the best" but is, perhaps, more valuable for the traveller as a "warts an' all" publication. I noticed several entries rated "poor, poor and average" (food, service and ambiance, etc

John Hartley

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Thats the thing with Hardens John the reports tell it as it is .If we are travelling to part of the country in which we dont know any eateries refer to Hardens seldom fails.

Pam Brunning Editor Food & Wine, the Journal of the European & African Region of the International Wine & Food Society

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Yes, I'm a fan of Hardens too (and a contributor). It covers such a range of places right across the country that it's ideal when we're travelling and looking for a decent lunch on the road. I agree that many (most?) people in this country seem to be very easily pleased when it comes to eating out, but I find that the scoring in Hardens is often slightly lower than I would give to the places I know. There are a few misses, but in the main it is pretty reliable. They don't attempt to only celebrate the best and using the quality of food verses the price as the main reference point probably means that a wider range of places get mentioned, and it is therefore useful to a wider range of people, which can only be a good thing. How many guides and websites do we need to talk about the Michelin starred places?

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Thats the thing with Hardens John the reports tell it as it is .

I find this to be slightly ridiculous. Is it your position that the other guides do not 'tell it like it is'? If that was the case no-one would buy the guides and they would go out of business. I note that Hardens themselves uses Michelin as a reason to defend its own results (http://www.hardens.com/restaurant-news/uk-london/03-11-10/reactions-to-the-top-100-list/).

Incidentally, having viewed the list that is defended in this link, I am at a loss to understand how One-O-One, for example, is rated so highly.

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Is it your position that the other guides do not 'tell it like it is'?

Dunno about Pam, but there's something of that in my position - although the only other guidebook I use is the GFG, so I accept my sample is limited. What differs Hardens from the GFG is the inclusion of places it concludes are crap. If you are crap, you do not get into the Good Food Guide (self-evidently).

John Hartley

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I gave up with the GFG a few years ago. We used to be reporters until I contacted them to let them know that several restaurants we had been to told us they knew their local inspector and they were always told when he/she was coming. One establishment, that received a county restaurant of the year award, told us that one of the GFG top inspectors rang them, introduced himself and booked his table.

The GFG response was to strike us off their reporters list. :angry:

Pam Brunning Editor Food & Wine, the Journal of the European & African Region of the International Wine & Food Society

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I think that this may have been true, but I do know that the GFG had a huge purge of inspectors a couple of years back, precisely it seemed for those reasons. That said, if you do have small circle of inspectors, they are eventually going to be recognized (until the purge its true we did recognize a local inspector). I do quite like the idea of a mix of inspectors, and Joe Public views in one, in the hope that they balance each other out.

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