Faux Carbonation

[paulraphael]

Any thoughts on a chemical that would make bubbles on contact with saliva? I'm trying to figure out how to make something seem carbonated when it can't be. Already investigated pop rocks ... aparently they have C02 embedded in small bubbles in the candy grains ... not something that will work for me.

[mkayahara]

What about just a dry acid/base combination? Like citric acid and baking soda mixed together. Cf. Eben Freeman's jellied G&T.

[paulraphael]

I should have added that it's going to be wet to begin with, so something besides moisture needs to release the gas.

[Shalmanese]

I should have added that it's going to be wet to begin with, so something besides moisture needs to release the gas.

There's not much in saliva that's not in water and, of the stuff that is in saliva, none of them seem like good candidates for either a chemical reaction or a catalyst. Your best bet is either real carbonation or figuring out some way of keeping free water from the reactants until they hit your tongue.

[paulraphael]

Maybe I need dinner guests with more interesting saliva.

I did find one reference to someone doing what I'm trying to do, but it involves liquid C02. Seems like a more reasonable project in a commercial environment (my brief flirtation with LN2 ice cream at home turned into a spectacular waste of time and ebay resources).

[Sethro]

Well there is one thing present in saliva but not in water that has a lot to do with carbonation: acid. Unfortunately baking soda also reacts to moisture, which is why faux alkaseltzers are encapsulated in chocolate or cocoa butter; to keep moisture away until you pop in in your mouth.

So basically, I think with the food science available today, you cannot have an un-carbonated liquid the carbonates on contact with your mouth. Sorry.

What the heck are you trying to make there, anyhow? Would a flavored faux alkaseltzer that you drop into a liquid to create carbonation be helpful? Because thats very cheap and easy to achieve.

[ray goud]

Well there is one thing present in saliva but not in water that has a lot to do with carbonation: acid.

Saliva is only slightly acid between meals. Immediately before and during eating the pH of saliva becomes slightly basic, not acid.

Ray

Edited March 26, 2010 by ray goud (log)

[Sethro]

Well there is one thing present in saliva but not in water that has a lot to do with carbonation: acid.

Saliva is only slightly acid between meals. Immediately before and during eating the pH of saliva becomes slightly basic, not acid.

Ray

I didn't know that.

[David A. Goldfarb]

You could do something involving a procedure like the nineteenth-century Russian custom of drinking tea with a lump of sugar in the mouth.

[paulraphael]

I think I figured out the solution, and it will be genuine carbonation. Easier than the fake variety and easier than I thought.

[J.Stevens]

if your product is wet all you need to do is put your product in to a cream siphon close the lid and charge with a couple of Co2 bulbs (not to be confused with the normal No2 cream bulbs) and leave over night .... co2 is water soluble and will carbonate it .... were is no2 is fat soluble and will aerate fat

[chiantiglace]

Strange things said here. Hmmm.

Of course CO2 is water soluble.....?

Is NO2's relative solubility relevant? It is not used in solution, and the mixture does not require fat for it to work. All you need is something to hold the pressurized air like a combination of proteins or hydro-colloids, or both. If you take the protein out of the whipping cream, it no longer aerates, fat and water is not a very stable foam, or stable at all for that matter. Plus with the NO2 is injected into the siphon, it doesn't dilute, it remains as air.

CO2 however does fall into solution, if it didn't, every soda you had would explode upon opening, and there would be no carbonated water.

Who wants to eat baking soda? Regardless of what you put with it. And better yet, who wants to eat baking soda and acid?

Saliva is not in question. The enzymes are not going to react to anything (that you would want to eat) enough to give a sensation on the tongue, protein substances just don't do that. mucus, same thing, proteins. Teeth? No, I doubt you will get much reaction out of calcium phosphate. It doesn't like acids, but you wont get in major reaction. And if you did then that would probably mean something very bad.

The sensation from pop rocks and carbonated beverages is a physical reaction, not a chemical. In pop rocks the sugar is hardened very quickly when the carbonation is added, thus hardening over pressurized gas. When the saliva in your mouth dissolves the thin sugar walls the carbonations strength finally breaks free at a certain point creating all those little pops. Carbonation in a liquid occurs because you tongues roughness causes millions of little nucleation sites spewing off congregated carbon dioxide at an expedited rate.

You are right about the liquid nirtogen and liquid co2. This is food, not ridiculousness. Once in a while I find a use for dry ice, but if I had to I could find a way around it. People use those things because they think they look cool with it. Probably the same kind of people who wear sunglasses in the club at night.

I hate to be the one to say it, but what you are looking for doesn't exist. At least, conceptually, not in the natural world.

Edited April 29, 2010 by chiantiglace (log)

[lesliec]

... Who wants to eat baking soda? Regardless of what you put with it. And better yet, who wants to eat baking soda and acid?

I must defend eating baking soda and acid! The G&T jellies mentioned upthread are great fun.

[J.Stevens]

I hate to be the one to say it, but what you are looking for doesn't exist. At least, conceptually, not in the natural world.

lol i feel like i just got told off

anyway if you are looking to carbonate fruit the method i said earlier WILL work ... and im pretty sure (not that ive tried) you can carbonate jelly, purees ect. ive been thinking of carbonating orange flavoured yoghurt ...